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Old 01-13-2018, 09:35 AM
 
2,423 posts, read 933,955 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigma777 View Post
You recently also condemned China for eating dogs, but you want us to be more like China?

Public transportation is part of life in other places. Americans are in love with their cars.
there are good things and bad things. Trains are one of their good things along with Europe, Japan, and (soon) India.

we can aspire to be better, that was just in example at cost effective measures to build a rail system.
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Old 01-13-2018, 01:20 PM
 
3,066 posts, read 8,009,025 times
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Originally Posted by Baven54 View Post
California seems better
No, I liked living in Japan (Tokyo) a lot better.
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Old 01-13-2018, 05:32 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
932 posts, read 287,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cebuan View Post
You don't make people change from car culture to public transport culture by building public transport. You do it by taking their cars away. Good luck.
I disagree. Many cities worldwide have managed to limit car presence on roads by offering a competitive alternative. Of course, the public transportation that takes over needs to cover a wide area for it to be effective. Things like the recently opened Kansas City streetcar do not cut it.
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Old 01-13-2018, 09:52 PM
 
Location: In the heights
17,273 posts, read 19,439,568 times
Reputation: 8547
What probably makes the most sense is for the system to be completed by 2028 prior to the Olympics. That'd boost first year numbers a massive amount since it'd include people coming from other parts of California to watch and attendees from elsewhere who want to make the most of their trip by seeing more of California. Also by that time LA will have opened up some very significant extensions to its mass transit system.

By that point, the transit expansions and infill density in downtown Los Angeles (both in residents and jobs) and surrounding neighborhoods would justify high speed rail service. I think generally, for pairs of this distance and with fairly densely populated tail end cities, high speed rail is pretty optimal for it. Unfortunately, the process of doing so in California (and the US in general) seems to be pretty onerous and then there's the giant political backlash and constant in fighting which has probably played more than a small part in inflating its costs and will do so even more.

It's too bad LA's not trying to make better use of all of its incoming transit though--it's weird that LA insists on having those giant correctional facilities next to Union Station or is so slow on capping the freeway that separates Union Station from the rest of downtown. The most rational thing would probably to heavily build out the half mile or so around Union Station.

Last edited by OyCrumbler; 01-13-2018 at 10:30 PM..
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Old 01-13-2018, 10:04 PM
 
Location: In the heights
17,273 posts, read 19,439,568 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cebuan View Post
You don't make people change from car culture to public transport culture by building public transport. You do it by taking their cars away. Good luck.
Maybe increase luxury car taxes and double the gas tax and have those increases committed to mass transit funding. That way no cars get taken away!
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Old 01-13-2018, 10:33 PM
 
Location: Cebu, Philippines
428 posts, read 76,161 times
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Maybe if the governments stop building and improving roads, and they deteriorate to bad condition and the traffic gets too crowded, people will stop using private cars and switch to public transportation, which the government wil have expanded and improved. If you build it, they will come. Free market democracy. People vote for cars, they get a government that responds to ands favors the car culture.
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Old 01-14-2018, 02:50 PM
 
Location: In the heights
17,273 posts, read 19,439,568 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cebuan View Post
Maybe if the governments stop building and improving roads, and they deteriorate to bad condition and the traffic gets too crowded, people will stop using private cars and switch to public transportation, which the government wil have expanded and improved. If you build it, they will come. Free market democracy. People vote for cars, they get a government that responds to ands favors the car culture.
They donít have to stop building or improving roads for metro systems to be useful. There are many countries that do both. In the US though, we subsidize sprawl in myriad ways.

If weíre talking about California, then yea, several major cities have put funding into mass transit as of late with LA specifically having raised taxes on itself in referendums to do so. Thatís voting. It makes sense that LA did so because the current setup of ridiculous traffic everywhere was onerous enough even as LA has historically had an extremely strong car culture and still does (and the high speed rail was also voted on). Itís too bad planning and leadership wasnít better for these to not have been in place earlier.
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Old 01-14-2018, 03:02 PM
 
Location: Finland
24,075 posts, read 15,687,761 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cebuan View Post
Maybe if the governments stop building and improving roads, and they deteriorate to bad condition and the traffic gets too crowded, people will stop using private cars and switch to public transportation, which the government wil have expanded and improved. If you build it, they will come. Free market democracy. People vote for cars, they get a government that responds to ands favors the car culture.

The most effective ways are to limit parking space and increase parking costs. If you have to search 10 minutes for expensive parking, effective public transport quickly becomes a lucrative alternative.
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Old 01-14-2018, 07:16 PM
 
5,647 posts, read 5,436,894 times
Reputation: 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
The most effective ways are to limit parking space and increase parking costs. If you have to search 10 minutes for expensive parking, effective public transport quickly becomes a lucrative alternative.
China makes it even simpler. In Beijing you need to play a lottery before buying a car. Only if you win, you can buy. In Shanghai, the fees are very high, more than the value of an average car.
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Old 01-15-2018, 08:25 AM
 
6,267 posts, read 4,058,090 times
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Say all you want about California, be it the crap public transportation or the ridiculous level of homelessness, the reality is Asians are still flocking its doorway and the trend is unlikely to stop in the foreseeable future.
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