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Old 07-07-2018, 08:09 PM
 
Location: San Diego, California Republic
16,111 posts, read 21,208,250 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HumbleMerchant View Post
So what makes Muslims (Islam), Russians and Jews so special that dislike against them deserves a word for itself?
Huh????
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Old 07-07-2018, 08:10 PM
 
Location: San Diego, California Republic
16,111 posts, read 21,208,250 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AFP View Post
You don't seem to understand what xenophobia means.
Apparently not LOL
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Old 07-07-2018, 08:20 PM
 
2,093 posts, read 2,902,841 times
Reputation: 1203
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCityDreamer View Post
If Islamic terrorists would stop bombing the crap out of people all over the world in the name of their religion, then maybe there will be less Islamophobia.

You know the sentence could be reversed in certain parts of the world in the nature of whom is responsible for the bombing and creation of hate.


If all sides could dispense with hate and reflected more surely a better world ?
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Old 07-07-2018, 08:41 PM
 
2,093 posts, read 2,902,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chint View Post
That's comical. Islam is an ideology - its a blatantly sexist, homophobic, apostate-discriminating ideology -both explicitly and in practice. Its quite comical that you think enlightened people would be not Islamophobic when its an ideology inconsistent with enlightenment.


Perhaps you mean enlightened people are not biased against muslims (i.e. the believers of the ideology Islam). That makes more sense - one can be tolerant and accepting of people who have ideologies entirely inconsistent with one's own, even inconsistent with human rights per se. The right to believe is respected, whereas the belief itself may or may not be (depending on what the belief is). Ideologies are not the equivalent of race or ethnicity like you seem to think. Those things are involuntary and non-determinative of behavior. On the other hand ideologies are voluntary, not inherent, and because they are ideologies they certainly influence behavior and can even control it.


I'm suspecting you have been "brainwashed" by social media yourself, conflating the ideology with the person.
You could do worse than read up on the contributions the Islamic world made to civilisation. Comical? No what I think is ideologues with a hatred and ignorance of Islam , which actually share a number of common uniting factors with the extreme of Islamic thought have in common being more comical.


Obviously, You have a bias against this faith, for ideology is what you may refer to it , but it remains the faith (religion) of one third of humanity, so while it okay of course to lack an understanding, it is only displaying ignorance I'm afraid , that denigrates the belief of others.


I'm suspecting it you that has been brainwashed regardless of source. I'm wondering if you've travelled ? Spoken to Muslims? Looked beyond the right wing rhetoric?
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Old 07-07-2018, 10:06 PM
 
1,984 posts, read 683,366 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
You could do worse than read up on the contributions the Islamic world made to civilisation. Comical? No what I think is ideologues with a hatred and ignorance of Islam , which actually share a number of common uniting factors with the extreme of Islamic thought have in common being more comical.
That the Islamic world contributed a lot to the fields of science is a given. There was a time when it was more advanced then parts of Europe.


Quote:
Obviously, You have a bias against this faith, for ideology is what you may refer to it , but it remains the faith (religion) of one third of humanity, so while it okay of course to lack an understanding, it is only displaying ignorance I'm afraid , that denigrates the belief of others.
If bias leads to an expression of hatred against an individual on the basis of religion then it is most definitely misplaced. However, targeting an ideology is more certainly a valid point. At the end of the day, religion is more of a political institution then a spiritual one, regardless of how people try to frame it. As such, it can and should be subjected to the same scrutiny as any other ideology.

Quote:
I'm suspecting it you that has been brainwashed regardless of source. I'm wondering if you've travelled ? Spoken to Muslims? Looked beyond the right wing rhetoric?
Humanity is primarily driven by utilitarianism, or at least that's what every sane scholar would try to ascribe. The prevalence of political correctness has somewhat alleviated that train of thought from the domain of public discourse, but it nevertheless remains the driving force behind the human mindset.

Islam is at a point where it preaches its doctrine, but fails to take into account the practically behind many of the policies it espouses, while severely under-performing on a utilitarian front. If you're going to advertise a certain mindset, that in many ways is deemed regressive in today's world, you need to back that up with results. Take the chador for example (I know that many Muslim women don't wear it) and look at its applications in the world. Covering one's face, while men can walk rather free, and being forced to constantly lift that veil in order to eat, is beyond ridiculous. Nor is the person doing so, some kind of savant.
Many of the tenets set forth by the religion are simply counterproductive. What's the point of enforcing a ban of pork or alcohol, when Muslims are going to try and consume it when abroad?

Islam is also not very tolerant of other ideologies. Muslims like to preach about how they are the victims (true in part), but have little issue targeting those of other faiths. They are usually more tolerant of Jews and Christians (at least on paper), because they view them as people of the Book. Judaism and Christianity are stepping stones to Islam.
I like to use the following analogy, to better illustrate the issue at hand:
The Quran is the third and final revelation of God, according to Muslims. Nothing is meant to come after it. Imagine going to a bookstore to pick up a new novel. Since it's brand new it is identified as the "first edition". If you wait a couple of years, you will stumble upon the second edition. Keep going, and you'll eventually run into the third edition. If you read the fine print you will run across a disclaimer that states "third edition revised and updated". When a new edition is printed, the old one gets phased out as it becomes outdated.
That is the essence of the relationship between Islam and the other two Abrahamic religions. They are old news at this point, therefore they need to be updated (Quran). That was also the modus operandi of Christianity for a time (in fact, it still is in some circles).

Granted, some of the stigma against Muslims is driven by bigotry, but there is no denying that the causes I've outlined are of far greater importance. In order to advocate an ideology, one needs to first establish positive causality with the rest of the world.
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Old 07-07-2018, 10:33 PM
 
174 posts, read 42,428 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cebuan View Post
Detroit has been the center if American Islam for generations, the people of Detroit have lived with them for a long time, and have learned to respect them as valued members of their community. Houston is another city in which the Muslim population has left a positive mark and the fairly large Muslim community in Houston is also respected.
But Detroit is still in the USA, and it is not always a non-Islamic place
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEq2M1_-M_U&t=593s

Meanwhile the same preacher does the same in San Deigo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBxte8RedBk
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Old 07-07-2018, 10:34 PM
 
2,093 posts, read 2,902,841 times
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Firstly Islam has indeed shown tolerance towards other religions. Not in al situations granted but to suggest Islam is or has always been in tolerant towards other religions is pure fallacy.

Jews long lived in Islamic societies. Just returned from a stint in Malaysia, where religions co exist side by side with tolerance. It is the hot heads and purists, extremists of whatever persuasion that bring tolerance into ill repute.

I do understand the history and do have my own questions around aspects of the faith, but then I question every thing. I do not have to agree with all aspects of anything, to understand people have a perfect, to believe, to follow and form own decisions on validity on personal belief. Just have knowledge into whatever you claim to believe, and not a simple Google search. I mean understanding and knowledge.

A diversity of opinion is what makes this world interesting. Nothing worse than total conformity and all believing the same.
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Old 07-07-2018, 11:01 PM
 
174 posts, read 42,428 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Firstly Islam has indeed shown tolerance towards other religions. Not in al situations granted but to suggest Islam is or has always been in tolerant towards other religions is pure fallacy.

Jews long lived in Islamic societies. Just returned from a stint in Malaysia, where religions co exist side by side with tolerance. It is the hot heads and purists, extremists of whatever persuasion that bring tolerance into ill repute.

I do understand the history and do have my own questions around aspects of the faith, but then I question every thing. I do not have to agree with all aspects of anything, to understand people have a perfect, to believe, to follow and form own decisions on validity on personal belief. Just have knowledge into whatever you claim to believe, and not a simple Google search. I mean understanding and knowledge.

A diversity of opinion is what makes this world interesting. Nothing worse than total conformity and all believing the same.
I been to Malaysia too and there is a degree of tolerance for people of different faiths, however, Malaysia has the religious police where they hunt for unmarried Muslim couples together and inspect hotels and demand to the people that work there to check the names of guests in the hotel to see if there are unmarried Muslim couples staying in the same room and after they find an unmarried Muslim couple they then even if its early hours of the morning go to their room and arrest them.

Yet, of course, Malaysia is more tolerant Islamic society than Saudi Arabia and Iran. They are ok with people of different faiths living there. However, in some ways, Malaysia is still backwards compared to western countries in regards to morality.
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Old 07-08-2018, 06:59 AM
 
6,641 posts, read 7,384,193 times
Reputation: 4093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muthal_Ganesan View Post
Islamophobia is increasing in Europe and the Commonwealth Realms. I believe that several opinion polls point to younger demographic cohorts in these two regions having higher levels of Islamophobia than the United States. India is also famously Islamophobic.

So, apart from the United States, which areas area also now less Islamophobic? Maybe my question is worded incorrectly but I couldn't think of the best phrase to describe the situation.
its a made up term by the regressive left , islamaphobia is not real

i treat people on an individual basis as i find them but islam as a culture is deeply problematic so i see nothing irrational about fearing a large increase in the islamic population of europe , muslims are not any worse than other people but they have a starkly different outlook to most traditional europeans , preserving ones culture is viewed as completely sensible in every region of the world bar europe
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Old 07-08-2018, 01:48 PM
 
Location: Canada
4,190 posts, read 3,842,904 times
Reputation: 2858
Quote:
Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Firstly Islam has indeed shown tolerance towards other religions. Not in al situations granted but to suggest Islam is or has always been in tolerant towards other religions is pure fallacy.

Jews long lived in Islamic societies. Just returned from a stint in Malaysia, where religions co exist side by side with tolerance. It is the hot heads and purists, extremists of whatever persuasion that bring tolerance into ill repute.

I do understand the history and do have my own questions around aspects of the faith, but then I question every thing. I do not have to agree with all aspects of anything, to understand people have a perfect, to believe, to follow and form own decisions on validity on personal belief. Just have knowledge into whatever you claim to believe, and not a simple Google search. I mean understanding and knowledge.

A diversity of opinion is what makes this world interesting. Nothing worse than total conformity and all believing the same.
Currently there are few religions as intolerant as Islam. I know it is not a popular thing to point out but just look at how minority religions are treated in Muslims countries. Look at at Muslims in other countries Like Thailand and the Philippines where Muslims use violence to set up an islamic state. Look at how Muslims treat women, they dress them up like ninjas! I mean women were just granted the right to drive in Saudia Arabia!!
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