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Old 12-12-2019, 10:54 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
24,336 posts, read 30,586,760 times
Reputation: 9882

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Quote:
Originally Posted by backpaker View Post
I absolutely hate US style suburbs, which also seem to dominate the landscape of Canadian and Australian cities, they are like prisons for the soul and places of isolation for the masses.

I find Australian suburbs from what I have read and spoken to people that have visited, to be much more humane than Canadian ones.

From my understanding Australian suburbs actually have some form of public transportation, Enabling people to move around Without having to drive a car, allowing them to interact like humans are supposed to do.

Canadian suburbs are more like American ones, vast expanses of asphalt Void of any culture, Or trace of an actual interactive society.
Residentially, Australian, Canadian and American suburbs are very, very similar.


Where Australian suburbs might be said to be more "humane" is in the commercial zones that serve them.


Even the more recent ones often retain a main street/high street feel, whereas in Canada they typically feature buildings plunked down in the middle of a sea of parking.


This for example is a commercial area in a mature suburb of Sydney:
https://www.google.com/maps/@-33.677...7i13312!8i6656


There is parking but it is either minimal (in front) or is relegated to the rear of the buildings or even underground.


And this is an even better example as this is the "mall" in a more recent suburban area in the far NW suburbs of Sydney:
https://www.google.com/maps/@-33.690...7i13312!8i6656
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Old 12-12-2019, 10:57 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
24,336 posts, read 30,586,760 times
Reputation: 9882
That new suburban mall does have equivalents in Canada (in Markham near Toronto and also Dix30 in Brossard near Montreal) but they are very exceptional cases.


This is what they typically build in Canada these days:


https://www.google.com/maps/@43.7715...7i16384!8i8192


Commercial areas in older suburban areas of Canada generally look like this:


https://www.google.com/maps/@45.3736...7i16384!8i8192
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Old 12-12-2019, 01:18 PM
 
Location: In transition
10,587 posts, read 13,536,569 times
Reputation: 5020
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Residentially, Australian, Canadian and American suburbs are very, very similar.


Where Australian suburbs might be said to be more "humane" is in the commercial zones that serve them.


Even the more recent ones often retain a main street/high street feel, whereas in Canada they typically feature buildings plunked down in the middle of a sea of parking.


This for example is a commercial area in a mature suburb of Sydney:
https://www.google.com/maps/@-33.677...7i13312!8i6656


There is parking but it is either minimal (in front) or is relegated to the rear of the buildings or even underground.


And this is an even better example as this is the "mall" in a more recent suburban area in the far NW suburbs of Sydney:
https://www.google.com/maps/@-33.690...7i13312!8i6656
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
That new suburban mall does have equivalents in Canada (in Markham near Toronto and also Dix30 in Brossard near Montreal) but they are very exceptional cases.


This is what they typically build in Canada these days:


https://www.google.com/maps/@43.7715...7i16384!8i8192


Commercial areas in older suburban areas of Canada generally look like this:


https://www.google.com/maps/@45.3736...7i16384!8i8192
The Australian commercial areas in the suburbs of the major Canadian cities seem so much more appealing to me with higher density and more street life. The Canadian ones by contrast seem so bland, lifeless and a colossal waste of space. I wonder why they developed so differently? Is it because Canada wanted to copy the American "ideal" but Australia looked more to the UK model with a high street?
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Old 12-12-2019, 01:27 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
24,336 posts, read 30,586,760 times
Reputation: 9882
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneb78 View Post
The Australian commercial areas in the suburbs of the major Canadian cities seem so much more appealing to me with higher density and more street life. The Canadian ones by contrast seem so bland, lifeless and a colossal waste of space. I wonder why they developed so differently? Is it because Canada wanted to copy the American "ideal" but Australia looked more to the UK model with a high street?
That might be it.


Perhaps in Canada a lot of the retailers in these shopping centres are American chains and they're used to this form of development, and that's what they demand from properties in Canada where they set up shop.


Certainly any type of climactic argument for the way we do things in Canada is totally bogus, as that new development in NW Sydney (Rouse Hill) would be way better at shielding people from winter winds than a windswept open parking lot.
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Old 12-12-2019, 01:48 PM
 
Location: In transition
10,587 posts, read 13,536,569 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
That might be it.


Perhaps in Canada a lot of the retailers in these shopping centres are American chains and they're used to this form of development, and that's what they demand from properties in Canada where they set up shop.


Certainly any type of climactic argument for the way we do things in Canada is totally bogus, as that new development in NW Sydney (Rouse Hill) would be way better at shielding people from winter winds than a windswept open parking lot.
Yeah for sure... makes sense. If US retailers wanted to open shops in Australia, why would they tolerate the Australian model but insist on the US model for Canada? Is there a perception that Canada is just an extension of the US? Perhaps, for that reason not many US large chains operate in Australia...
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Old 12-12-2019, 01:49 PM
 
573 posts, read 274,242 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UrbanLuis View Post
This is just a light rail. There were no enough money to build a metro line. A metro line was a better option for those places. Seriously, a light rail to go to the airport????
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Old 12-12-2019, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
24,336 posts, read 30,586,760 times
Reputation: 9882
Quote:
Originally Posted by usuariodeldia View Post
This is just a light rail. There were no enough money to build a metro line. A metro line was a better option for those places. Seriously, a light rail to go to the airport????
I think it's fine, and it won't really make much of a difference to users. The REM will be totally grade-separated in its own right-of-way and won't run on or cross any city streets. No tangible difference from a subway-type system in cities where the subway runs both above and below ground.
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Old 12-12-2019, 02:03 PM
 
573 posts, read 274,242 times
Reputation: 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by UrbanLuis View Post
Montreal has and is improving their transportation system. So is Toronto.. SO you are wrong about that. Most Canadian super markets do have self checkout. Also you're comment about Anglos, that is your experience and that is fine but unless you have spent considerable amount of time in Anglo Canada. How would you really know?
That wasn't my experience with supermarkets in Montreal. None of them had self check-outs. There were also people who pack your bags like in developing countries is done. Another thing that I noticed was that in Australia almost everything is done electronic. You don't need a card to use public transport, you can use your phone via apple pay.

https://transportnsw.info/tickets-op...tless-payments

The majority of people in the cities also use their phone to do any transaction. There are also supermarkets in the business district of Sydney where you can scan things while grabbing them, so you don't have to go to the check-out. https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp....191766151e32e8
A similar thing was trailed in Canada but didn't work

https://www.businessinsider.com/walm...9-5/?r=AU&IR=T

The banking system in Oz is also superior, they still use cheques in Canada lol. Getting cash from an atm (cardless) isn't a novelty in Australia either.

Last edited by usuariodeldia; 12-12-2019 at 03:12 PM..
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Old 12-12-2019, 02:09 PM
 
40 posts, read 11,507 times
Reputation: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by deneb78 View Post
The Australian commercial areas in the suburbs of the major Canadian cities seem so much more appealing to me with higher density and more street life. The Canadian ones by contrast seem so bland, lifeless and a colossal waste of space. I wonder why they developed so differently? Is it because Canada wanted to copy the American "ideal" but Australia looked more to the UK model with a high street?
My guess is that Canada emulates the US on several fronts whereas Australia does its own thing, although influenced by the UK as well as American way doing things.
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Old 12-12-2019, 02:14 PM
 
Location: Australia
1,901 posts, read 814,501 times
Reputation: 3719
Quote:
Originally Posted by backpaker View Post
I absolutely hate US style suburbs, which also seem to dominate the landscape of Canadian and Australian cities, they are like prisons for the soul and places of isolation for the masses.

I find Australian suburbs from what I have read and spoken to people that have visited, to be much more humane than Canadian ones.

From my understanding Australian suburbs actually have some form of public transportation, Enabling people to move around Without having to drive a car, allowing them to interact like humans are supposed to do.

Canadian suburbs are more like American ones, vast expanses of asphalt Void of any culture, Or trace of an actual interactive society.
In Sydney a big issue is getting to the train station as parking is difficult. The buses in the outer suburbs might only run half hourly to the station. The inner suburbs are much better in that respect.

Modern life does not allow a lot of interacting with people regardless of the location. You can go all day and not speak properly to a person. In Sydney it is absolutely not done to chat to people on public transport. The supermarket is half self checkout. Petrol is self serve. I find that eg when you do classes in Italian, as I have, you practise asking when does the train leave for Milan, waiter can I have a table near the window. The reality there and in Australia and I imagine in Canada, you look up the train time online, buy your ticket from a machine and seat yourself in the cafe.
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