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View Poll Results: Who do you support?
Palestine 58 28.16%
Israel 148 71.84%
Voters: 206. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-21-2023, 09:28 AM
 
Location: Taipei
8,864 posts, read 8,438,262 times
Reputation: 7414

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Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
Yes, Pakistan and Bangladesh are absolutely democracies.
You obviously need to up your standards then. Even the US is a garbage democracy, let alone the likes of Bangladesh and Pakistan.
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Old 06-21-2023, 09:30 AM
 
Location: Honolulu/DMV Area/NYC
30,627 posts, read 18,203,012 times
Reputation: 34488
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
You obviously need to up your standards then. Even the US is a garbage democracy, let alone the likes of Bangladesh and Pakistan.
You obviously need an invitation with a dictionary. That you think a nation is a "garbage" democracy is irrelevant to whether a nation is actually a democracy. Again, democracy = people ruling, whether directly or via elected representatives. Democracy =/= freedom. I wouldn't choose to live in certain democracies, to include Pakistan, but that doesn't mean that they are not democracies.

Now, Pakistan does go through stages. When the military conducts coups, etc., obviously that is not a state of democracy as it fails to become rule of and by the people. But that's clearly distinguishable from the status quo.
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Old 06-21-2023, 11:21 AM
 
17,874 posts, read 15,932,559 times
Reputation: 11660
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Iran is a theocracy. Israel isn't. Get over yourself.

And Israel receives only $3 billion aid from the US annually, which would be barely 0.5% of Israel's overall annual economic output. Please be more informed.
And yet they have been receiving this for decades. In the beginning it was a huge chunk of your economy because it is the only way for Israel to even jump start itself. Plus Israel is a tiny country with barely any natural resources. How else can you make money if not through something like fractional reserve banking and finance? That makes the 3 billion US currency even that more valuable especially since it is free no strings attached.

And dont say Israel makes money through from R&D or STEM. For a country like Israel to be successful in that realm they will need lots of foreign investments whether private or tax payers. Afterall, R&D/STEM is just money for trial and error. That kind of money though is better served if it stays domestically to help grow a countries' own science and tech. But thanks to the many Zionists in our own country plus others, Israel gets a lot of that "grant money" for lack of better term.
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Old 06-21-2023, 11:30 AM
 
15,956 posts, read 7,015,660 times
Reputation: 8544
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
You obviously need to up your standards then. Even the US is a garbage democracy, let alone the likes of Bangladesh and Pakistan.
Yet, Israel is dependent on the taxpayers of the “garbage” democracy to sustain it. What does that make Israel?
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Old 06-21-2023, 03:24 PM
 
695 posts, read 286,995 times
Reputation: 1229
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008 View Post
Yet, Israel is dependent on the taxpayers of the “garbage” democracy to sustain it. What does that make Israel?
It doesn't make Israel anything then what it is already - a small country surrounded by enemies that want to destroy it. Otherwise they are financially and politically stable, but their location in a "bad area of town" requires an extremely high tech and expensive military and defense systems (i.e. "the iron dome" alone costs over half a billion $ a year). Aid to Israel not only ensures the survival of this state, it serves US self-interest to have an ally in this area of the world. Actually much of the aid is used to in turn purchase US military equipment and flows back into the US economy.

By the way, Palestine also gets billions of US aid. It was curtailed by Trump but is being resumed by Biden.
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Old 06-21-2023, 05:27 PM
 
881 posts, read 921,784 times
Reputation: 488
Can't say I'm Pro-Israel or anti-Palestine, but the Pro-Palestine trend here in Colombia and Latin America for the most part is silly and I hate it. It's just a fad, virtue signaling.

Many of these people talk about wanting Israel to disappear, but it only gets wealthier, more powerful and developed, with a more sophisticated economy, more military power, etc.

Moreover, the way Israel was created and build is not really different from how Latin American countries were created, non countries made by Spanish Conquistadores, over the lands of many different indigenous groups. Our national identity is feeble. Actually, most countries in the World came up that way, by war, violence, power. Yet, and for obvious reasons, nobody advocates for making Colombia or Peru or El Salvador to dissapear, and giving the land back to Indigenous people.

I hope Palestinians can live at peace and with full rights some day (bla bla).
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Old 06-21-2023, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Brackenwood
9,977 posts, read 5,673,914 times
Reputation: 22125
Quote:
Originally Posted by joacocanal View Post
Can't say I'm Pro-Israel or anti-Palestine, but the Pro-Palestine trend here in Colombia and Latin America for the most part is silly and I hate it. It's just a fad, virtue signaling.

Many of these people talk about wanting Israel to disappear, but it only gets wealthier, more powerful and developed, with a more sophisticated economy, more military power, etc.

Moreover, the way Israel was created and build is not really different from how Latin American countries were created, non countries made by Spanish Conquistadores, over the lands of many different indigenous groups. Our national identity is feeble. Actually, most countries in the World came up that way, by war, violence, power.

I hope Palestinians can live at peace and with full rights some day (bla bla).
Well, except for two obvious differences: 1) Jews are the indigenous people of Israel, and 2) theirs is not a made-up "non-country" but rather a reinstatement of a Jewish state that existed there for over a thousand years before various waves of conquering parties took over. A more apt analogy using Latin America would be: the Arabs are the Conquistadors, and the Jews are the Mayans/Aztec/Incas/whoever finally re-establishing their-nation state after a few hundred years in diaspora.
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Old 06-22-2023, 01:43 AM
 
Location: Taipei
8,864 posts, read 8,438,262 times
Reputation: 7414
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
And yet they have been receiving this for decades. In the beginning it was a huge chunk of your economy because it is the only way for Israel to even jump start itself. Plus Israel is a tiny country with barely any natural resources. How else can you make money if not through something like fractional reserve banking and finance? That makes the 3 billion US currency even that more valuable especially since it is free no strings attached.
Many countries became rich without natural resources. Actually the majority of developed countries have no natural resources at all (the Netherlands, Belgium, Switzerland, Austria, Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore, Iceland etc. etc. etc., you name it) while resource rich countries like Russia, Nigeria, and Venezuela stay poor as ****.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
And dont say Israel makes money through from R&D or STEM. For a country like Israel to be successful in that realm they will need lots of foreign investments whether private or tax payers. Afterall, R&D/STEM is just money for trial and error. That kind of money though is better served if it stays domestically to help grow a countries' own science and tech. But thanks to the many Zionists in our own country plus others, Israel gets a lot of that "grant money" for lack of better term.
Israel makes money through a bunch of stuff. It's a very dynamic economy. You are delusional if you believe it's only rich because of America, lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008 View Post
Yet, Israel is dependent on the taxpayers of the “garbage” democracy to sustain it. What does that make Israel?
What a joke lol.
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Old 06-22-2023, 08:19 AM
 
695 posts, read 286,995 times
Reputation: 1229
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Israel makes money through a bunch of stuff. It's a very dynamic economy. You are delusional if you believe it's only rich because of America, lol.
Anti-Semitism runs deep. The one you are responding to, look at the posters history of responses in this thread. It's almost scary what this guy believes in or does not understand. I remember him from another thread. This is a guy that doesn't even know that US forces fought in North Africa in WW2. Scary.

Indeed Israel is a manufacturing and high tech powerhouse. US aid has been focused on defense as explained above, not to build up the economy. Most of Israel's financial growth occurred only in the last few decade as Israel introduced a number of free-market reforms, and some of the Arab countries signed peace treaties with Israel. from Israel's secret is investments (not loans or aid) and immigration. Financial reforms gave the economy the opportunity to expand. Investments from venture capitalist that have turned into a middle east "silicon valley". Immigration brought the best and brightest from other countries into Israel. Winning formula!

Of course, natural resources is not-relevant in all cases. Singapore is the perfect example.

Quote:
Originally Posted by joacocanal View Post
Moreover, the way Israel was created and build is not really different from how Latin American countries were created, non countries made by Spanish Conquistadores, over the lands of many different indigenous groups.
It is very different from the example you mention, no similarity at all.

Last edited by Johnny Wadd; 06-22-2023 at 08:41 AM..
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Old 06-22-2023, 09:25 AM
 
17,874 posts, read 15,932,559 times
Reputation: 11660
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Many countries became rich without natural resources. Actually the majority of developed countries have no natural resources at all (the Netherlands, Belgium, Switzerland, Austria, Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore, Iceland etc. etc. etc., you name it) while resource rich countries like Russia, Nigeria, and Venezuela stay poor as ****.



Israel makes money through a bunch of stuff. It's a very dynamic economy. You are delusional if you believe it's only rich because of America, lol.
Those European countries are wealthy because they work with the rest of Europe. Europe as a whole has natural resources or they exploited it at one point to become powerful enough to prop each other up over centuries. Russia is not poor. Nigeria and rest of Africa is up and coming.

You are in denial. I get it. It is hard to admit something like that. Israel be exactly worse than what you think Venezuela is without America.

South Korea, Taiwan and Japan etc etc were also propped up by America to curb communism, and Wall Street wanted to transfer more of America's wealth into its own pockets by using Japan and SK in its globalization campaign.

Last edited by NJ Brazen_3133; 06-22-2023 at 09:45 AM..
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