Japan: Good Move or Bad Move? (violent crime, shops, to move)

[NihonKitty]

Originally Posted by SEAandATL

That's the kind of attitude that makes me ashamed to be an American. I know a lot of people stationed here that walk around with their muscles flexed, and saying "We're Americans, we're the greatest people in the world! HOORAH!!!" and think they can just go around beating up any Japanese person, even police officers because they assume they are all like 4 ft. tall and 100 lbs. For that reason, I don't blame the Japanese for being anti-American. Unfortunately I get put in the same category as them. It's those few idiots that ruin it for everybody.

Japanese are not anti american, actually the most recent study by global pew or whatever it was called showed japanese to be more pro american than even the british are.

Originally Posted by Tenzo

When living in Japan I was refused service in a very few stores. When I did, I bowed and left.

I lived in a rather upscale part of Tokyo that had older homes. One day my Japanese friends and are were looking for a bar. Some of the best have just a small sign outside. So I'm being an American running from place to place, sticking my head in.

I open one door, I can't see very well, so I step in. As my eyes adjust to the light I see a bar with a large table down the center. On both sides are hefty Japanese men wearing dark blue suits, some with sun glasses. I also notice that the guy at the door has tatoos on his arm.

I apologized, bowed my head and stepped out backwards.

If you are going to go to foreign countries, you need to know when you step in it and be prepared to back up.

This is good because those few stores that don't allow foreigners usually have a reason they didnt say "hey i hate gaijin lets ban them" it's almost always because of some drunk guy who caused problems..it's unfortunate they ban all foreigners because of a few but if you are respectful etc it gives a better image for foreigners. I'm sure not all those stores ban foreigners permanently.

Originally Posted by Noliving

Yes and no, xenophobia and racism can be the samething and are often very close to eachother. Ah yes you can be racist against your own race.

For example stores that don't allow foreigners, you would be surprised at how easily those same stores allow asian foreigners in without questioning their nationality whatsoever. That right there is racism, because they are basing it upon a person looks, more specifically their race.

This is the definition of racism

hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

And

Racism is the belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race. In the case of institutional racism, certain racial groups may be denied rights or benefits, or get preferential treatment

So in this context, no japanese are not "racist" but xenophobic (remember not all japanese are, just mostly the old generation which unfortunately is like all of the government). The most discriminated people in japan are japanese-brazilians who are pure japanese but raised in a different culture and for the most part don't speak japanese. The second most discriminated group now and historically was the most discriminated group are koreans who like japanese are east asians. Actually white/black americans have it good in japan compared to zainichi koreans and japanese-brazilians. Almost ALL crime in japanese media is blamed on koreans and chinese, japanese brazilians are extremely discriminated against for being "japanese" yet can't speak japanese and have a different culture, they are viewed as sell outs and "fakes".

Filipinos, Chinese, Koreans and japanese brazilians face the bulk of discrimination and you can argue all are the same race as japanese, at least japanese-brazilians are.

P.S. Brazil has the largest population of japanese outside of japan.

[NihonKitty]

Originally Posted by SEAandATL

Actually the crowded and expensive part is what is similar between CA and Japan. Having mountains and the ocean close together is also what makes them similar, but in a good way. I know they are still different in many ways, especially the weather, but I think overall Japan is more similar to California that it is to Georgia. But since you spent some time in ATL maybe you can offer a second opinion on that.

Well when it comes to density nowhere in the US except NYC is like japan. Personally the only thing i see similar in california/japan are the mountains and proximity to the ocean. I guess you also got the hightech industries..

Japanese are more similar to atlantans IMO, both have the "hospitality"/respect while at the same time being known for "talking behind your back". Both also tend to be kind of xenophobic (at least southerners are by american standards). Atlanta has 4 seasons, tall trees and hills. Atlanta doesnt have mountains, but the trees and 4 seasons are much more similar to japan than california is, while the terrain in cali is more similar. But atlanta has hills.. which is good enough

So for density and urban feel - NYC
For weather and nature - Atlanta
For terrain/earthquakes - California
This one just my opinion but culturally - Atlanta; but as i said this isn't based on anything just what i think. Even atlanta and japan are completely different culturally and I'm not saying theyre similar but out of all of the US it's the only place i can see any similarities. Perhaps NYC for the urbanity too..

[SEAandATL]

Originally Posted by NihonKitty

Well when it comes to density nowhere in the US except NYC is like japan. Personally the only thing i see similar in california/japan are the mountains and proximity to the ocean. I guess you also got the hightech industries..

Japanese are more similar to atlantans IMO, both have the "hospitality"/respect while at the same time being known for "talking behind your back". Both also tend to be kind of xenophobic (at least southerners are by american standards). Atlanta has 4 seasons, tall trees and hills. Atlanta doesnt have mountains, but the trees and 4 seasons are much more similar to japan than california is, while the terrain in cali is more similar. But atlanta has hills.. which is good enough

So for density and urban feel - NYC
For weather and nature - Atlanta
For terrain/earthquakes - California
This one just my opinion but culturally - Atlanta; but as i said this isn't based on anything just what i think. Even atlanta and japan are completely different culturally and I'm not saying theyre similar but out of all of the US it's the only place i can see any similarities. Perhaps NYC for the urbanity too..

Come to think of it, I do see some similarities between Georgia and Japan, especially as you mentioned about the weather and nature. They both have the same type of trees (pine and oak), but Japan also has tsugi trees in addition (Although I hear they are planting them in GA, and if I had a house there I would plant some in my backyard). Also, the friendliness of the people and hospitality is similar between GA and Japan, and also the xenophobia since they are not culturally diverse.

Atlanta may not have mountains in the immediate area, but if you drive one hour north, you can see the Blue Ridge Mountains in North Georgia which look similar to the mountains of Kanagawa-ken or Nikko. Georgia has nothing like Mt. Fuji or the Japan Alps, but I like to think of Stone Mountain as Georgia's "Fuji". The ocean is not that close, but it's a 3 hour drive. Did you get a chance to go to Savannah?

Japan really is like a mix of Georgia, NYC, and California all rolled into one, plus you can throw in Seattle and Hawaii into the mix.

[Tiger Beer]

I actually think of Japan more like California.

Mostly because they are modern, concrete everywhere, well-developed, large economies, eco-everything, mountains, oceans, skiing, surfing, about the same shape/size, they share the same Pacific Ocean, etc. Plus the cities in California are very far-reaching and progressive-minded, and has an advanced feel to it.

I see ZERO between Japan & Georgia.

[SEAandATL]

Originally Posted by Tiger Beer

I actually think of Japan more like California.

Mostly because they are modern, concrete everywhere, well-developed, large economies, eco-everything, mountains, oceans, skiing, surfing, about the same shape/size, they share the same Pacific Ocean, etc. Plus the cities in California are very far-reaching and progressive-minded, and has an advanced feel to it.

I see ZERO between Japan & Georgia.

Not even the weather? I do see the other things you mentioned about the modernness and futuristic feel of California cities how its similar to Japan, especially the Bay Area with its hi-tech companies like Apple. However, California cities are lacking when it comes to infrastructure (esp. the train system) except for the Bay Area. L.A. is catching up with their Metro system. Once the bullet train is built then that would make it more like Japan. Atlanta's MARTA system is similar to what can be found in Tokyo area, but not nearly as many lines, stations, or ridership. The new Beltline train which will loop around Atlanta's urban core will be similar to the JR Yamanote Line in Tokyo.

Atlanta is also pretty technologically advanced (at least was for its time back in the late 1990's), but most people who have never been there would not imagine that. Most people think that Atlanta and Georgia is still in the "Gone With the Wind" or "Dukes of Hazzard" days, while California cities are just like the Jetsons. Especially on these forums there is a lot of anti-Atlanta attitude and people talk that city down to where it is nothing, just a small hick town in the South that no one cares about. Atlanta will never receive the credit it deserves on this site.

The other thing that makes California similar to Japan is the low crime rate. You can walk around any neighborhood of Los Angeles any time of night and not have to worry about getting robbed or shot, same as in Tokyo.

[NihonKitty]

LA is nothing like japan..san francisco is a bit.

[Tiger Beer]

Originally Posted by NihonKitty

LA is nothing like japan..san francisco is a bit.

I think you are comparing TOKYO to California. Tokyo is a major city, and there isn't any American city similar to any Asian city. Atlanta is nothing like Tokyo either.

I'm living out here in the Japan countryside...so my view of Japan is completely different. The country of Japan has a lot of similarities to the state of California.

Tokyo has no similarities to any American city.

[NihonKitty]

No im not from tokyo, i am comparing japan to california. I'm from wakayama which is japanese countryside. Japanese countryside is infinantly more similar to atlanta, the trees,hills, and the climate are basically identical (montly avg temperatures,anual rainfaill, types of trees etc). Of course california wins in the fact that it has earthquakes and mountains though..but no one lives at top of mountains anyways lol

And as i said before when it comes to urbanity no city compares..so you're just repeating what i said :P. Only one that comes close is NYC. Also most of japan is urban..

What city do you live in? Can you speak japanese?

[Noliving]

Originally Posted by NihonKitty

This is the definition of racism

And


So in this context, no japanese are not "racist" but xenophobic (remember not all japanese are, just mostly the old generation which unfortunately is like all of the government). The most discriminated people in japan are japanese-brazilians who are pure japanese but raised in a different culture and for the most part don't speak japanese. The second most discriminated group now and historically was the most discriminated group are koreans who like japanese are east asians. Actually white/black americans have it good in japan compared to zainichi koreans and japanese-brazilians. Almost ALL crime in japanese media is blamed on koreans and chinese, japanese brazilians are extremely discriminated against for being "japanese" yet can't speak japanese and have a different culture, they are viewed as sell outs and "fakes".

Filipinos, Chinese, Koreans and japanese brazilians face the bulk of discrimination and you can argue all are the same race as japanese, at least japanese-brazilians are.

P.S. Brazil has the largest population of japanese outside of japan.

And this is also the definition of racism, which you obviously didn't post:

Discrimination or prejudice based on race. And: policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.

My example of stores that ban foreigners are examples of racism because when an asian walks into a store and doesn't say a word they do nothing, if a black or a white person walks into a store they kick them out. Stores that do this in japan as you know, make the determination right away if the person is a foreigner based upon race/looks. So in this context in which you conviently left out the other definitions from the definitions that you got from dictionary.com, it is racism. Again xenophobia and racism are closely linked. You can talk all you want about discrimination against japanese that were born in brazil or against chinese or koreans but it is still racism when a store bans foreigners and they make the determination if the person is a foreigner based upon race, which they do because it is the easiest way to determine if someone is a foreigner. You don't have to believe that your race is superior to another in order for it be racism, the intolerance that is associated with racism is also what links it to xenophobia, because in a lot of cases because what they "fear" is associated with a race.

[NihonKitty]

"Discrimination or prejudice based on race"

Right its not on race since japanese brazilians are the same race, so my point still stands. Japanese are not racist unless you consider japanese born in different countries a different race.

Sorry but the most discriminated people in japan are koreans and japanese-brazilians, not white or black americans. Look it up, even the UN study they did on japanese xenophobia says the exact same thing. Unless you consider koreans (east asians) and japanese (east asians) as a seperate race you are wrong.

2005 UN report on xenophobia and racism.

Diène (Special Rapporteur of the UN Commission on Human Rights), concluded after an investigation and nine-day tour of Japan that racial discrimination and xenophobia in Japan primarily affects three groups: national minorities, descendants of former Japanese colonies and foreigners from other Asian countries

Hmm national minorities are mostly ryukyuans who are hey hey! East asians! Ainu, as well who don't really belong to any "race" since they are a mix of proto mongoloid and Nivkhs (east russian natives). Descendants of former japanese colonies?? Oh once again! Asians!!! Foreigners from other asian countries?? OH again! Asians!

Sorry but the people who are discrimanted against in japan are the same race as japanese, so no it's not racism. Even the "new" definition you put says "Discrimination or prejudice based on race". Sorry but it's not based on race. So japanese are xenophobic but not "racist".

The 3 biggest foreign groups in japan are
Chinese: 606,889 28.2%
Korean: 593,489 27.6%
Japanese brazilians: 316,967 14.7%

Brazilians of Japanese descent in particular find themselves the targets of class prejudice; some local Japanese scorn them as the descendants of "social dropouts" who emigrated from Japan because they were "giving up" on Japanese society, whereas others perceive them more as objects of pity than scorn, people who were forced into emigrating by unfortunate circumstances beyond their control such as birth order or lack of opportunities in rural areas

I myself am a zainichi korean (half japanese ethnically).

The Diène report identifies Zainichi Koreans as those who have been most discriminated against in Japan, for example in employment, housing and marriage

That's right..koreans.

In other words the people most discriminated against in japan are other asians, specifically east asians! Japanese ARE east asians! So japanese are xenophobic against all foreigners, japanese are not racist. And especially not 'racist' by a western definition.

You are clinging to some tiny store BS that i and all of my american friends have never witnessed in their entire life. That doesnt mean there aren't any because i have seen those so called youtube videos (which all it says is no foreigners, some of them even saying no koreans/filipinos who are again- the same race). You are basing your "racist" claim off of something most people will never see in their life and represents like .0000001% of japanese.