I need your help (Europe/Italy vs USA) (house, to buy)

[XodoX]

I'm form Europe and have been to Italy a million times. If you still have a question you can email me on here.

[SgtAJC]

Please choose Italy. We have enough people in the United States that hate this country. Good luck.

[WiseRoman]

How Italians treat legal immigrants??

What is the minimum wage in Italy??

What is the quality of life in Central/Southern Italy compared to USA?

Are 2 minimum wages in Italy enough to have a decent life there. (Apartment/rent, food, basic expenses and the ability to maybe save a few euros monthly)????

Do Italians MUST own a vehicle in order to commute to and from work???? in Miami you must OWN a car.... the public transportation is terrible.


This is what you asked. I live in Rome and i can tell that Italy isn't a good choice to live now. Politics is pretty bad and there are thousands economic problems, not counting the others.

How Italians treat legal immigrants??

It depends, but there will be no problems i think.

What is the minimum wage in Italy??

This is the point. Wages are low in Italy. As a teacher i think you'll get 1200-1500 euros a month or at least, is what my teachers at High School earn. But if you and your woman earn that salary that could work for you two.

Are 2 minimum wages in Italy enough to have a decent life there. (Apartment/rent, food, basic expenses and the ability to maybe save a few euros monthly)????

As i said above, it could be enough, but it depends if you can find a work which will give you 1200 euros at least a month. Unemployment is high here.

Do Italians MUST own a vehicle in order to commute to and from work???? in Miami you must OWN a car.... the public transportation is terrible.

You will hardly find a job near the place where you live, and it's all about the city you live. Rome has too much traffic for example like the other biggest town in Italy. And of course, public trasportation sucks as well. Bus arrive late most of the times and there are lots of problem both when you go and come from work. Here there's the GRA, which is a highway that goes around all the city, but it gets very crowded like always.

What is the quality of life in Central/Southern Italy compared to USA?

This depends by the city you decide to go. Florence for example is one of the most expensive town i was in. Rome is quite cheap. I mean you could get food for a week with like 20-30 euros for two people.

This is obviously my opinion that Italy isn't good for living right now. But the choice is yours, i've exposed everything i know to answer. If you've got more questions, feel free to ask. I will be glad to help you

[linicx]

Call the Italian Embassy in DC. The Consulate should know the answers - or he can find out. It is his job to help you. . 202-612-4400.

[baboo]

Hello Eduardo,

From what I understand, you are a little disgusted with American culture and feel that it is destroying our society. Is this correct? I lived for a while in Italy and was relatively integrated because my boyfriend is Italian. I lived in Tuscany, if that helps a little.

One thing must be said: the crappy, demoralizing American culture has arrived in Italy. You'll see that the children there are not much different from the children here. They watch reality television and they're just as obsessed with pop culture and celebrity. You'll even find that a lot of the reality shows are American reality shows done alla italiana. The highschool students are just as zombified by MTV and crap tv as they are here. Sorry to disappoint. Italians have a very strange and complex relationship with America and American culture. One the one hand, they hate it and feel that America has done much wrong to Italy, especially in the years following WWII and the cold war. On the other hand, they're obsessed with American culture and it's very COOL over there.

In my limited opinion, Italian children start having sex really early too. Most of my Italian friends started having sex really early, much earlier than my American friends. So that probably won't be any better in Italy.

As for the quality of life, I guess it's what you make of it. You should avoid big cities like Rome, Milan, Florence, Venice, etc because you have the same problems there as you would in big cities anywhere. The traffic is much worse in these cities and the restrictions and limitations they have for parking, owning a car, and driving are ridiculous and will make your life much harder. But in the smaller cities and town, this isn't as big a problem. But you have to consider that in the bigger cities, you don't really need a car whereas in the smaller cities you do.

I would say that Italians tend to enjoy life more. They have more vacation days and everyone takes them, unlike here. Life is a little less focused around a job and money, but money is a big concern no matter where you go. Someone posted that if you are a teacher you would make between 1200-1500 euro a month and that is not true. My boyfriend's mother has been a high school teacher for about 30 years and she is at the top of the pay scale and makes just over 1300 a month. Starting wages are much lower and it's hard to enter into the public school system if you don't have any contacts.

As for immigrants, I would say that Italians are not hostile to immigrants but they are definitely annoyed. If you are of darker complexion, you may run into problems because generally Italians tend to consider North Africans as the scum of society along with Albanians, Romanians, and gypsies. They are horribly racists towards these groups of people and treat with contempt and disgust. I, myself, am of Asian descent and felt well ostracized by the Italians. Everyone treated me as if I was from a third world country trying to get a man by any means to escape my horrible, poor, and desperate life. You'll definitely get stares, comments, questions, but no one was every hostile or violent towards me. If you learn Italian really well, it will be easier to integrate and since your wife is part Italian it should make it easier. You have to remember that immigration in Italy only started around the '70's and only 2 percent of the entire population are immigrants. They're just not used it yet, but it is changing. The north is less tolerant than they are in other parts of Italy.

I lived in Florence, Sienna, and Colle di Val d'elsa and Tuscany is so insanely expensive that the quality of life is questionable. Having said that, in other parts of Italy I know that people get along just fine with average jobs and they don't really have more than one. The south is poorer than the north, so if you're looking to get away from the poor conditions of miami, you may not want to go too far south. Jobs are relatively scarce and it may be very difficult to find a secure post. The advantage of having such a powerful influence on Italy is the number of bilingual schools there. There are a lot of bilingual schools, mostly English/Italian, but there are French/Italian schools, and possibly even Spanish/Italian schools. You may want to look into that.

An important thing to remember: be ready for absolute CHAOS! The administration and bureaucracy is a mess and everything so disorganized. no matter how organized you are, be ready for trouble. Nothing will work out the way you want it to and everything will take about 15 times as long as you anticipated. Beware of the Questura, the immigration control office, and don't base the rest of your experience off of this place. It is the most racist and hateful place in Italy. They treat you like crap and it will help to have your American passport out, in plain sight, because they start treating you better once they see that you're a American. It's true, I got yelled at, pushed around, cursed at, and forgotten for days until I show one of the guards my passport and it was really easy from then on out. Relatively easy. Don't expect anything to be easy over there... just be prepared and you should be fine. If you have any more questions contact me. Hope this helped

[Caro257]

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

I am a dual citizen Venezuelan/U.S. American. My fiancee is Venezuelan/Italian (born in Caracas and daughter of two Italians immigrants that moved to Venezuela in the 60s, she has both passports EuroItalian/Venezuelan).

Now... If we get married and move to Italy, I will be able to acquire the EuroItalian citizenship after 6 months.


How would you compare the quality of life in Italy versus the quality of life in USa

I dont have a $$$ reason to move overseas, since I make almost $50,000 a year (I am a 26 year old secondary teacher) and she makes $35,000 (she is 29).

Our main reason is to live in an environment were family values, culture, and friends would be the priorities in our lives and the people around us. I believe that Europeans, specially Italians seem to be more family oriented compared to U.S. Americans who have $$$ as their most important priority.


Now, any info about Italy would be greatly apreciated...

How Italians treat legal immigrants??

What is the minimum wage in Italy??

What is the quality of life in Central/Southern Italy compared to USA?

Are 2 minimum wages in Italy enough to have a decent life there. (Apartment/rent, food, basic expenses and the ability to maybe save a few euros monthly)????

Do Italians MUST own a vehicle in order to commute to and from work???? in Miami you must OWN a car.... the public transportation is terrible.


Which Italian cities would you recommend....

Thanks in advance for the info....

As a European/American I’d say move if you have an opportunity. I was born and grew up in Europe and when I took my husband (born in US) to visit, he didn’t want to leave!

Life is so much more pleasant, slower paste, and people are very nice. Three of my family members are still living there, one 50 miles away from Rome, the others in Sicily and they couldn’t be happier.

You are operating on Euros so you’ll get less dollars but once you find employment you will be good to go.

If you don’t believe it just ask around those old Italian immigrants that will regret for the rest of their lives they came here in a first place.

If I had a job or my husband would be sent there for work I’ll go along in a jeppie

[WiseRoman]

baboo you have your ideas a bit confused :P
Questura is not a racist place, they are arrogant with everybody, also with Italians.
I said 1200-1500 because is what you get at maximum when you start. Your friend's mother worked for 30 years, he still has to start, how do you pretend to get 1500 euros when you start when people that are there from 10 years get 1300?
Wage is low but it also depends on what you do, but he opted for teaching, so 1200-1500 if you are lucky is what he's gonna earn.
About traffic it's true as i also said, but in Italy scooters are the most used vehicle, so if you get one you can go wherever you want without having traffic causing problems. The most guys are stupid, conditioned by television, but there is also a big part which isn't. The one having problems with America are just the same racist guys. People here consider as you said especially Romanians and gypsies as scum...well it's true but there is a motivation. The most crimes made by foreign people in Italy is made by Romanians and like 95% of gypsies steal, rob and whatever, so it's a normal opinion. If you are a simple person, who works, don't go drinking and arguing with people, you wont finish in a hospital. However don't go to North Italy, because a minority are against most of the Italians too and immigrants. Rome is the perfect place if you want a big and cool city and easy to live. Just a get a house for rent in the suburb and everything's gonna be easy.

[Shanisong]

Are you very familiar with the Permesso di Soggiorno? I need to hire someone who's fluent in Italian and can help with filling this form out. My email is shanibastiany@aol.com if you can help or know anyone who can...

[Simonprog]

Dear Eduardo,

Economy in Italy is stagnating. In the big cities you can make more money... but that means living, probably, very far from the centre where most of businesses are.

You can try the "counties" where the majority of Italians leave, like me, but thanks to some obscene laws from 2003 the "minimum wage" in italy means instability, very low wages and absolutely no hope of career or whatever.

If you have money (or are coming here working for a foreign company or having a good profession already estabilished with customers and works) and want to live in a sunny place, with warm climate and people and, especially, excellent food and wine... welcome to Italy!

But if you want to come here to work as an employee, you will discover hell.

[jja100]

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

I am a dual citizen Venezuelan/U.S. American. My fiancee is Venezuelan/Italian (born in Caracas and daughter of two Italians immigrants that moved to Venezuela in the 60s, she has both passports EuroItalian/Venezuelan).

Now... If we get married and move to Italy, I will be able to acquire the EuroItalian citizenship after 6 months.

You are correct, you would receive citizenship after 6 months. This is a must to even be able to work in the EU... you must be a citizen.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

How would you compare the quality of life in Italy versus the quality of life in USa

I dont have a $$$ reason to move overseas, since I make almost $50,000 a year (I am a 26 year old secondary teacher) and she makes $35,000 (she is 29).

Quality of life is way better in Italy but this comes at a cost... and the cost is high taxation and low income jobs. Not to say that you can't have a good quality of life with less income but if the income is too little to even buy the basic necessities and pay the bills than that isn't much of a quality of life. I would recommend that you go to the US... build a nestegg and then go to Europe to retire. You seem to make very good money between the both of you. If you can limit your expenses, invest and remove debt you will be on your way to living a very comfortable life anywhere you choose.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

Our main reason is to live in an environment were family values, culture, and friends would be the priorities in our lives and the people around us. I believe that Europeans, specially Italians seem to be more family oriented compared to U.S. Americans who have $$$ as their most important priority.

You will find the culture and friends in Italy but family values? Divorce in Italy is just a rampant as the US or worse. Infidelity is extremely high but hey... we are Latin, its genetic I think

Although I will say that the more south you go the more conservative it gets in Italy.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

How Italians treat legal immigrants??

Italians are typically very friendly and treat people very well for the most part.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

What is the minimum wage in Italy??

Higher than the US. Socialist countries typically deny you high incomes and tax high on what little you make in return for benefits. Unfortunately if you don't use those benefits because you are healthy or don't have children then you can see how ridiculous it sounds.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

What is the quality of life in Central/Southern Italy compared to USA?

Well I would stay out of south Italy. It is extremely poor and job opportunities are slim to non. Central Italy is better with Rome and Pescara. Firenze is more touristy than business.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

Are 2 minimum wages in Italy enough to have a decent life there. (Apartment/rent, food, basic expenses and the ability to maybe save a few euros monthly)????

This depends... are you going there with enough capital to pay for a home in cash? If you can purchase a home you will not have to pay property tax on your prima casa. Thanks to Berlusconi. After you purchase a home in Italy for cash life becomes really easy at that point.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

Do Italians MUST own a vehicle in order to commute to and from work???? in Miami you must OWN a car.... the public transportation is terrible.

No, most Italians work and live in major cities that offer public transportation that is sufficient. Europe doesn't really have "suburbs" like the US where you can own land, commute to work, and make the same money that you would in a city.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

Which Italian cities would you recommend....

Milan, Milan, Milan, Milan, Milan if you want to have any chance in making good money and finding a job. Milan pretty much carries the whole country and the city itself carries 1/5th the GDP of the whole nation! It is not however the best city for quality of life or raising a family and that is the rub.

Originally Posted by Eduardo983

Thanks in advance for the info....

Your quite welcome.