Best Leader in the world ever (university, transportation, ranking)

[Redisca]

Originally Posted by iamman

I have to find fault with Gorbachyov as a leader. He was never elected nor did the people rally behind him. Yeltsin had charisma, but did not "lead" toward continuing what he had begun. If he had created a presidential party to push his reforms the problems the west faces with Putin today would quite possibly be a moot point. If Gorbachyov, a man unwilling to committ to economic reforms had slowly begun privitization perhaps Yeltsin would have a different legacy, shock therapy would not of occured, millions would be better off, the 1990's would not of been so disasterous for the average Russian, there would be not war to distract the public in Checnya and on and on.

I think you are not giving Gorchachov enough credit. By the way -- I grew up in Russia. (Perhaps you did, too?) Anyway, based on my experience, the fact that he isn't popular -- but not widely hated -- is a point in his favor. Russians have always loved ruthless dictators. Gorbachov's main "failing" was that he wasn't one. Further, he did begin the reforms slowly -- but he had to contend with a country whose economy was already very, very tattered by the Cold War (I actually lived through the "deficit" years), and Chernobyl, in my opinion, was the trigger to the watershed. True, Chernobyl happened while he was at the helm, but I find it difficult to deem the disaster his personal responsibility. The plant was built before his time, the awful industry culture was not not something that he created or had a chance to reform, and he wasn't personally running the plant. His experiment with "Prohibition" was a mistake, I'll give you that. Bottom line, however, he did much to bring a non-violent end to the Cold War -- a feat in the days when it seemed that armed conflict with the United States was imminent -- and to usher in a more democratic government.

Originally Posted by iamman

I think Ghandi would get my vote as from the 20th century.

I think it's a mistake to idolize anyone, including Gandhi. I am not sure whether he can be deemed personally responsible for India's independence; I am more inclined to think it's the result of many people's efforts, including plenty of those who disagreed with Gandhi. There is also plenty of evidence that Gandhi was a racist who hated native Africans (so I really don't see any informed black person giving him his vote). And, he wrote in the late 1930's, that European Jews should commit mass suicide. I don't know whether he believed that suicide isn't "violence" or whether he just applied different rules to Jews -- but either way, it's disgusting to me. If my ancestors had followed his call, I would not be sitting here typing this right now. But they disobeyed Gandhi, and so I exist.

[redwine]

George Bush

[redwine]

Just kidding. I meant to say Ghandi

[StuckPA]

Originally Posted by redwine

George Bush

So you're the one who likes him...

[ixan2007]

Gandhi, Gorbachev, Kennedy and former indonesia president Soeharto ( mind you he is a dictator and his corruption is the number 1 in the world ) but he made indonesia safe at that time and we lived in prosperity and everyone was equal then. now indonesia is a crappy country that i do want to get out from

[ixan2007]

anyone know anything about maozedung?

some say he is great?

[iamman]

Originally Posted by Redisca

I grew up in Russia.

Cool, where at? I lived in the Vogla region for two years. Samara, Saratov, Kazan, Izhevsk, Orenburg and Tolyatti.

I'm not Russian, but I love Russia and enjoy learning all I can about it as a country. As a side note, I strongly disprove of the current regime, but Russia is a great place. Not because of the government or its missiles, but its kind and generous people and beautiful nature.



I don't idolize Ghandi. I was just making a judgement based on what I assumed the critera for the worlds best leader to be: how did people follow him? You can look at people like Churchill and Ghandi and see many faults. Rather than discuss who was perfect, I understood it to meant who had the natural "it" factor. Clearly, Ghandi was beloved by his people, and miraculous things were done because of their love for him. Gorbachev was maybe a great administrator, clearly a courageous man, but wasn't Yeltsin a better pure leader? After all, it was him rallying the people on the roof of a tank during the attempted coup. Gorbachev was on vacation, and probably not even the best leader of men in his own country that day.

I'm not taking anything away from his accomplishments, I just don't think men would fight for Gorbachev, rally behind him, or anything like that. There is really just no evidence of it.

[leon73]

I think is George W. Bush, because is funny, cute and goofy

[jtur88]

A couple of people who have not yet been named are Haile Selassie and the Dalai Lama.

Considering the political challenges he had to face and the survival of his country which now stands head and shoulders above all its neighbors, I would have to nominate King Hussein of Jordan .

I believe two of the most overrated were Kennedy aned Churchill.

If Kennedy had lived to serve 8 years, I'm certain he would have figured out a way to get us into a nuclear WWIII. While Churchill was a brilliant intellectual and wit, he was not admired before the war, and his reputation rests largely on the fact that he stayed in London and did his drunken Alfred Hitchcock impressions on the radio every night.

[Raggy dee Ann]

Originally Posted by Mooseketeer

Gandhi and Gorbachev,Aung San Suu Kyi, in recent memory. Non political leaders but leaders of Men , William Wilberforce and friends, Abbe Pierre , Tony Benn, the White Rose movement in nazi Germany,Martin Luther King, Rosa Parks, anybody who puts their lives and livelihoods on the line for others rather than their own selfish motives. People who have fought and still do against slavery, human rights abuses,injustice etc... These are the people we should look up to , not intellectually and morally challenged celebrities and corrupt politicians trying to line their own pockets.

What no Maggie?