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From experience, manufacturing does not like to locate in an area that has had habitual unemployment for a few reasons.
A, People that are not used to working tend to be habitually late coming to work.
B, People that are not used to working tend to find all sorts of reasons not to come into work.
C, People not used to working tend to dislike taking directions.
D, People not used to working tend to take extended and frequent breaks.
When any of the above happens and the employee feels they are being picked on when they are counseled.
A company has to go through scads of people to find some that actually will work and follow the rules. In many cases, people who have been unemployed for long periods of time, find it is not worth the hassle to work and follow the rules. Their increase in cash flow is minimal because of the various government programs.
I can see where you are getting at, however I do not believe that it is quite as widespread as you trying to make it out to be, many people in the black belt want to work, but again there's no jobs for them to work as well as they are too poor to go anywhere else other. Even if lack of wanting to work were an issue, the human brain is surprisingly malleable, the right subconscious or even conscious advertising can change a person
I can see where you are getting at, however I do not believe that it is quite as widespread as you trying to make it out to be, many people in the black belt want to work, but again there's no jobs for them to work as well as they are too poor to go anywhere else other. Even if lack of wanting to work were an issue, the human brain is surprisingly malleable, the right subconscious or even conscious advertising can change a person
You missed my point. There is a hesitancy for companies to locate in an area that has long term unemployment because of the reasons listed. It makes it difficult and costly to put an effective staff together.
I'm not saying there are people who want to work and would make excellent employees.
I don't know harry. I think there is a realistic middle position here. I think most folks would just like to earn a decent living wage. I don't think it is a binary matter: (a) poor, or (b) wealthy. There is a whole spectrum between the two.
Oh, I agree that there is a spectrum of lifestyles and behaviors.
The situation in parts of Vermont was similar to that of parts of Alabama - worse in some ways. I use it as just one example, and to show I know the subject firsthand. One family that I was friends with had no indoor plumbing and heated with an old Ashley wood stove (ironically made by Martin Stove in north Alabama). Being poor in the south involves dealing with heat, but dealing with -30 F cold and the need for fuel to survive makes backwoods Vermont an even worse place to be poor. Add to that that most of the jobs in Vermont are NOT, by any stretch, living wage. Many couples working full time barely survive. It is a beautiful state at times, but the poor are locked into a no win hamster wheel, where the more they work, the more the expenses accrue and taxes descend. For generations, natives have had to move out of state to make a living, unless connected in some way. The poor in Alabama have it better in some ways.
The system for financial help from Vermont was (and likely still is) one where there is no safe transition from being helped into independence. Fail to make it, and you go to the bottom of the pile - if that. The safer way to survive, if you had ANY medical issue that limited your abilities, was to lie low. I knew a lovely couple that between them might have had an IQ of 90. Sweet and giving, but as far as surviving on their own or being able to work productively even in a sheltered setting? No way. People like that exist. The bodies they were born into were not upper middle class standard, and it was through NO fault of their own.
As for the Federal funds to up Medicaid in the state? That is a drug dealer's deal. Those funds are great the first year, but then the Feds DECREASE the amount until the state foots ALL the bill. It is a great way to install unrealistic expectations in the poor and at the same time have a collar and leash on the state to make it toe the line to get additional funds. Politics, and the worst of leftist ideas passed through the hands of the right, intent on making the idea even worse.
People continue to live in poor areas for many reasons, but a big one is family. If you have an ailing relative that needs care, you take care of them. Nobody else will. Moving may not be an option, especially for people with little education and few job skills. If your job gives you a bonus and your mother or aunt needs to pay a power bill, you choose between ethics and family or making it out (MAYBE) on your own and being disowned.
Our country has grown up with myths such as Horatio Alger stories, bootstrap success, Puritan work ethic (actually as much invoked by early mill owners as any religion), being part of "Team U.S.A." and waving the flag no matter if your ancestors were killed by the U.S. army of forced to walk to Oklahoma, or you weren't allowed to vote for those who might guide your destiny because of race.
Until you get out of your easy chair, turn off the idiotic radio, set your prejudice aside, and get out among the poor, the gravity of the issues can be easy to dismiss. Some of those issues are going to get worse, as the jobs that the poorly educated can do go away. It already has happened in agriculture, which used to support millions of people and now is nearly completely mechanized, to the point that one man can do the work of two hundred. Fast food is heading that way.
The deepest pit that can be made is the pit of ignorance. Look at the relative wealth and power of any decent university town and compare that to a rural area with poor schools. Educate properly and a desire for improvement gets instilled. Without that desire, dust settles over an entire area.
From experience, manufacturing does not like to locate in an area that has had habitual unemployment for a few reasons.
A, People that are not used to working tend to be habitually late coming to work.
B, People that are not used to working tend to find all sorts of reasons not to come into work.
C, People not used to working tend to dislike taking directions.
D, People not used to working tend to take extended and frequent breaks.
When any of the above happens and the employee feels they are being picked on when they are counseled.
A company has to go through scads of people to find some that actually will work and follow the rules. In many cases, people who have been unemployed for long periods of time, find it is not worth the hassle to work and follow the rules. Their increase in cash flow is minimal because of the various government programs.
From experience - there most certainly ARE some people that make it impossible for a business to survive. I once was put in as a troubleshooter manager at a theatre in North Miami Florida. The staff was as bad as you describe and worse. Trying to get them to do even basic work was impossible, and theft was rampant. They eventually quit en-mass, thinking they could dictate the rules. They were replaced within the space of an hour (I didn't rise in the industry by being a fool) and it was only a blip. What DID happen though was that no subsequent manager could stop the theft, and the reputation of the location was destroyed by shoddy customer service, forcing it to close. Another location literally blocks away was able to continue, because it had enjoyed consistently good management and the thieves knew not to even apply for work there.
Siting of any industry has to take into account the available workforce. It is possible to do so in an impoverished area, but by no means easy. Many have tried and failed. Even Magic Johnson failed in his attempts.
Taking away survival funding is simply cruel, and is more likely to increase crime than have a positive effect. Taking a single generation from abject poverty and a tradition of family above all, to a hungry for jobs up-and-comers is a fool's errand.
Ultimately, most plans that might work get meddled with until they don't work. That seems to be a theme in U.S. politics. Better to keep things stable and plop opportunities for real education in the area.
Generational poverty is perpetuated by those in poverty lol....it's self-fulfilling and cyclical.
Breaking this cycle is an enormous task but some suggest that a "stick and carrot" method is viable. Perhaps we all need to think less, and do more about acknowledging the genesis of "generational poverty". Generational poverty is quite different than "becoming impoverished".
The former smacks of permanence, the latter, not necessarily so....it could be temporary.
I like the idea of re-educational formats in the public and private sector. It starts with self-concept, community shaming, local community vocal condemnation....from the pulpit for starters. The church must start "preaching" self-reliance, self-respect, marriage, no out-of-wedlock births, teaching how to be a "man", a "real woman" (not a baby machine).
The community church should insist that its flock take classes in standard American English, how to address others, how to be an example to your next door neighbor AND your spouse and/or children.
Reading and writing correct English - spoken about this necessity from the pulpit.
The pulpit is not doing its job in addressing sub-cultural behavior and lifestyle. It doesn't condemn it. It pays lip service on Sundays. There are no outcries for self-reliance, self-respect and respect for each other.
Education is free and schools have failed. Schools are fine....."Training" is better. Apprenticeships are excellent and need to be implemented on a large scale.
Handouts don't work forever unless there are laced with heavy, long term specific requirements. Again, stick and carrots.....perhaps more stick than carrot...
People have to decide for themselves which choice to make bottom line, but they have to be aware of the rewards and pitfalls .
Neighbors need to shun anti-social behavior, language, and lifestyle, then learn a thing called "shaming" in order to shape the collective's behavior.
Until the collective refuses to use proper language, ethics, morals and foundational values then refuse to be held accountable, this vicious cycle of poverty will be forever embedded in the region.
They must embrace transformation - it's on them, first....with the example of leadership from their OWN ranks, and the support of the greater community.
Believe it or not, condemnation and shaming can be a positive motivator, but it MUST come from within.
Oh, I agree that there is a spectrum of lifestyles and behaviors.
The situation in parts of Vermont was similar to that of parts of Alabama - worse in some ways. I use it as just one example, and to show I know the subject firsthand. One family that I was friends with had no indoor plumbing and heated with an old Ashley wood stove (ironically made by Martin Stove in north Alabama). Being poor in the south involves dealing with heat, but dealing with -30 F cold and the need for fuel to survive makes backwoods Vermont an even worse place to be poor. Add to that that most of the jobs in Vermont are NOT, by any stretch, living wage. Many couples working full time barely survive. It is a beautiful state at times, but the poor are locked into a no win hamster wheel, where the more they work, the more the expenses accrue and taxes descend. For generations, natives have had to move out of state to make a living, unless connected in some way. The poor in Alabama have it better in some ways.
The system for financial help from Vermont was (and likely still is) one where there is no safe transition from being helped into independence. Fail to make it, and you go to the bottom of the pile - if that. The safer way to survive, if you had ANY medical issue that limited your abilities, was to lie low. I knew a lovely couple that between them might have had an IQ of 90. Sweet and giving, but as far as surviving on their own or being able to work productively even in a sheltered setting? No way. People like that exist. The bodies they were born into were not upper middle class standard, and it was through NO fault of their own.
As for the Federal funds to up Medicaid in the state? That is a drug dealer's deal. Those funds are great the first year, but then the Feds DECREASE the amount until the state foots ALL the bill. It is a great way to install unrealistic expectations in the poor and at the same time have a collar and leash on the state to make it toe the line to get additional funds. Politics, and the worst of leftist ideas passed through the hands of the right, intent on making the idea even worse.
People continue to live in poor areas for many reasons, but a big one is family. If you have an ailing relative that needs care, you take care of them. Nobody else will. Moving may not be an option, especially for people with little education and few job skills. If your job gives you a bonus and your mother or aunt needs to pay a power bill, you choose between ethics and family or making it out (MAYBE) on your own and being disowned.
Our country has grown up with myths such as Horatio Alger stories, bootstrap success, Puritan work ethic (actually as much invoked by early mill owners as any religion), being part of "Team U.S.A." and waving the flag no matter if your ancestors were killed by the U.S. army of forced to walk to Oklahoma, or you weren't allowed to vote for those who might guide your destiny because of race.
Until you get out of your easy chair, turn off the idiotic radio, set your prejudice aside, and get out among the poor, the gravity of the issues can be easy to dismiss. Some of those issues are going to get worse, as the jobs that the poorly educated can do go away. It already has happened in agriculture, which used to support millions of people and now is nearly completely mechanized, to the point that one man can do the work of two hundred. Fast food is heading that way.
The deepest pit that can be made is the pit of ignorance. Look at the relative wealth and power of any decent university town and compare that to a rural area with poor schools. Educate properly and a desire for improvement gets instilled. Without that desire, dust settles over an entire area.
Siting of any industry has to take into account the available workforce. It is possible to do so in an impoverished area, but by no means easy. Many have tried and failed. Even Magic Johnson failed in his attempts.
This is kinda sorta Amazon's MO but they tend to stick to metro areas... and help themselves to some corporate welfare in the process.
Quote:
Taking away survival funding is simply cruel, and is more likely to increase crime than have a positive effect. Taking a single generation from abject poverty and a tradition of family above all, to a hungry for jobs up-and-comers is a fool's errand.
Ultimately, most plans that might work get meddled with until they don't work. That seems to be a theme in U.S. politics. Better to keep things stable and plop opportunities for real education in the area.
It is cruel. Diabolical really. The only thing left to do after that would be to make it harder for them to vote by reducing options and imposing extra restrictions designed to be difficult for people with less ways to cope with.
Well when the “woke hate America blame everyone else” mindset is rampant then there will always be problems. There has always been poverty and always will be. There is a generation and people in all generations
who don’t want to work and feel they deserve to be taken care of by someone else. Some of the hardest working people in Alabama ARE in the Black Belt , they do and need help to succeed. Right now in most of Alabama and the country if you want a job you can get one.
Brother, you are very much out of touch of the going ons’ in this world, it’s not as simple as “go get a job”. This is the real world, not 1+1=2
I don't think I am out of touch with the "going ons'" but I may be out of touch with these types of people's mindsets. In business when the market shifts or situations change, we adapt and find new ways to keep the revenue stream going. It is similar in principle. We could just sit here, do nothing and let the business run right into the ground but we don't. We find a way to solve the problems and keep moving forward. I just don't have any empathy for people that won't help themselves. Why should we fix their problems for them? Everyone has choices to make in life that impact where life takes them. Some choose to basically do nothing about their situation and live in poverty. I would bet I could go to either one of those areas you mention, drive around for 20 minutes and take pictures of help wanted signs. Would they be great jobs with high income, no probably not but they would be a better job than none at all and would provide the mechanisms needed to then escape poverty.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AU HSV
Well when the “woke hate America blame everyone else” mindset is rampant then there will always be problems. There has always been poverty and always will be. There is a generation and people in all generations
who don’t want to work and feel they deserve to be taken care of by someone else. Some of the hardest working people in Alabama ARE in the Black Belt , they do and need help to succeed. Right now in most of Alabama and the country if you want a job you can get one.
Exactly. There are plenty of jobs available and businesses practically begging for people to come to work. If someone wants a job, they can find one any day of the week.
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