Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Other than Teofilo Stevenson, I don't know of any famous Afro Cuban who is a descendant of British West Indians.
And what does that mean? First you admit that you are limited in what you know and secondly as I told you many have married Cubans and so you cannot measure the numbers with West Indian/Haitian background just by the last name. Most Cubans of Antillean background will be the grand/great grand children of the migrants by now.
In 1953 they accounted for roughly 10-15% of the black population, as we can safely assume that almost none of them would have been mulatos, given the privileged position that those groups would have enjoyed in their homelands.
And what does that mean? First you admit that you are limited in what you know and secondly as I told you many have married Cubans and so you cannot measure the numbers with West Indian/Haitian background just by the last name. Most Cubans of Antillean background will be the grand/great grand children of the migrants by now.
In 1953 they accounted for roughly 10-15% of the black population, as we can safely assume that almost none of them would have been mulatos, given the privileged position that those groups would have enjoyed in their homelands.
I became quite interested in this subject due o the fact that m mother, now deceased, told us that she did not know her father as he went to Cuba from Jamaica and never returned. I have wondered since then what happened to him and more importantly, did he have family over there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MelismaticEchoes
None of what you said adds or takes away from what I was stating. Read the comment I was responding to.
I was pointing out that many in Cuba did and still say that Afro Cubans are not really Cuban and that they are mostly Haitians and Jamaicans and that Afro Cubans are not true Cubans because they are from Haiti and Jamaica.
Yes most Cuban blacks are descendants of the more than 2 million slaves imported to Cuba between 1492 to 1886.
And I just said that racism has always existed in Cuba. I was just pointing out that Cuba had Jim Crow like policies and strong segregation for much of it's history. Castro tried to turn it around but blacks and ppl of color still lag behind compared to whites etc. There is also lots of classism and class inequality,
And there are still Jamaican and Haitian and other Anglophone Caribbean descendants still living in Cuba.
Many Cubans refer to some blacks as "Palestineans" to signify if they are blacks of Jamaican and/or Haitian descent.
Many ppl are ignorant because most Afro Cubans descend from Spanish speaking Hispanicized Africans that came during the colonial period.
Actually the situation of race relations in Cuba resembled Panama in regards to perception of it's black population. In Cuba, many white elites talked about how blackness was confined to Haitians and Jamaicans due to many black laborers from other islands and nations coming to Cuba.
And Cuba had Jim Crow like segregation. Cuba was extremely racist.
And most Afro Cubans didn't support Marcus Garvey or join his clubs or racist ideologies. Most Afro Cubans, especially one's of success and elite took more of a WEB DuBois approach to things and sought to integrate and assimilate and be proudly Cuban while at the same time being black, mulatto, pardo, or person of color etc.
Marcus Garvey was not very fond of Afro Cubans. Keep in mind that Garvey did not like Latin blacks or Catholicism and felt their culture was devil like etc and went against his views. He also was not a big fan of African Americans.
Marcus Garvey had self hating hypocritical complex. He also didn't like light skinned and mixed individuals very much.
Garvey was more interested in working with the Afro Caribbean diaspora particularly those from English speaking countries.
Marcus Garvey clashed with W.E.B. Du Bois because Garvey publicly accused Du Bois of being the self hating Afro American when Du Bois labeled Garvey as the short fat ugly black man. Garvey said that Du Bois had so much hate for the black blood in his veins that he had only the lightest of colored people in his office because he viewed anything blackness as a hideous ugly monstrosity that had to be assimilated and miscegenated out of existence. Marcus Garvey didn't hate light skinned black folks he just viewed some of them of not having class consciousness in the Marxist term by thinking their interests were better served by being assimilated into a caste racist social stratum that was on the side of the exploiters of the poor and poverty stricken as opposed to forming a self reliant and self sufficient community that would be immune to racism economically and culturally. Garvey viewed them by trying to assimilate they were making themselves more dependent on an ethnic group whose history of racial interrelationships were not all too great to begin with. Garvey thought it was foolish because in the future whites could decide to change their tune and become more antagonistic in their feelings towards blacks. If your economic well being is dependent on the good graces of a different ethnic group then what will happen if that ethnic group becomes indifferent or outright hostile? Marcus Garvey stated that ethnic groups should not compare themselves to other ethnic groups in an effort to form a standard of beauty as a pattern for themselves. Garvey believed if an ethnic group uses a standard of beauty defined by standards of another ethnic group then one group will automatically fill superior and the other inferior because each group has certain defining different outward physical characteristics. One example would be Hitler and his Aryan race superiority ideals that led him into one of the worst destructive conflicts and genocide in world history. Garvey denounced folks who went through bleaching processes and hair straightening escapades as the self haters because in those processes they are trying to deny who they naturally are as if they have something to be ashamed of. Marcus Garvey teachings was the genesis and forerunner of the " Black is Beautiful " movement that came to fruition in the 1960's and 70's.
Many would say the island was corrupt prior to Castro's revolution, but those who oppose the revolution attempt to have others think that Cuba was an economic frontier.
I think you have to talk to people who really tell you the true. The Castro's Brother are to criminal who turned Cuba in there own business and the Cubans in slaves, for that reason cubans die on the see looking for freedom and a normal quality of life.
I'll tell you one thing. When it becomes legal for U.S. folks to go there it'll be Boom time.
100% right on.....
A few reasons:
1. Many Miami based Cubans have established themselves in businesses/made plenty of money and would love to return and resurrect their island.
2. Businesses recognize that it is only 90 miles from America and it easily could be a resort destination (either direct resort investment or ancillary businesses to support the turn around)
3. Proximity to mainland US is easy for transport of goods/people.
4. Cubans will be clamoring for investment, probably the earliest investors will score the best deals.
Canadians and Europeans regularly go to Cuba for vacation. The US citizens just have to go to a 3rd country going/leaving Cuba (Mexico/Bahamas).
Cuba was wracked by violence and revolution even before the Spanish-American War.
That continued through its being returned to home rule and beyond.
Batista and his cronies ruled with the help of external financial support by American businessmen, legit and otherwise.
The Castro Brothers and Guevera had popular support in the country when they first took Havana.
The Castros were Communists, though, and the US would not truck with them.
The long-standing embargo in the US is ridiculous, but it will not end until the Brothers Castro are dead and buried.
A bit if trivia. My wife was in Cuba when Castro marched on Havana. Raul's bodyguards tried to recruit her for the revolution. She refused, and was allowed to return home.
1. Many Miami based Cubans have established themselves in businesses/made plenty of money and would love to return and resurrect their island.
2. Businesses recognize that it is only 90 miles from America and it easily could be a resort destination (either direct resort investment or ancillary businesses to support the turn around)
3. Proximity to mainland US is easy for transport of goods/people.
4. Cubans will be clamoring for investment, probably the earliest investors will score the best deals.
Canadians and Europeans regularly go to Cuba for vacation. The US citizens just have to go to a 3rd country going/leaving Cuba (Mexico/Bahamas).
However many Cuban Americans will realize that they aren't really Cuban, and will have little tolerance for the inefficiency and corruption that will bedevil that island as it transitions from Castroite communism. The Cuban Americans with the most capital and business expertise are derived from the earliest waves, and most of them are not only US born, but were raised by people are arrived from Cuba as kids, and therefore know little of it, and what they do no is irrelevant.
When attempting to see what Cuba will be like, think Russia. And the level of crime will make the South Bronx look like a church. Frustrated people, freed from being controlled by a brutal police force will run crazy, and a market oriented economy will surely leave many of them out.
Some Cuban exiles however think that Castroism will end suddenly and the country will quickly revert back to what it was in 1956.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jamaicans in Cuba
