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Old 07-14-2015, 05:51 PM
 
8,572 posts, read 8,578,600 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AuburnAL View Post
It helps some in bringing in money from federal jobs. People in the postal service, military, park service, and so on likely make significantly more than they have if they were doing the same job in an independent Puerto Rico, and there are more of these jobs available than their would be otherwise. This money in turn helps pump up the local private economy.

I'm not sure San Juan could have significantly challenged Miami to be the gateway to the Caribbean basin. Partially, not being a state gives uncertainty to any investment. Partially, Miami has better air connections to the outside world as a holdover from being the HQ of Eastern Airlines.

I definitely agree with you that an independent Puerto Rico wouldn't have been able to get this far into debt.

Well PR is clearly a failure as it is way more indebted than just about any other Caribbean territory.

Panama has evolved into a major center, precisely because it is not within the USA. So why couldn't PR?

If PR had move into independence, after a short period of the Commonwealth status, they would have been better off, as they would have had more flexibility in carving their own destiny. You do know that only US carriers can be used to ship cargo between PR and the mainland. Now how can they compete when DR and Costa Rica can ship using cheaper foreign vessels?

I don't know what will become of them, as at this point, they definitely cannot be independent, nor can they be a state, but the status quo isn't working for them.
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Old 07-14-2015, 07:41 PM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
7,800 posts, read 10,133,392 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
Which is exactly about status. If PR didn't have Mummy USA to lean on they would not have a bloated government, because they wouldn't have had the access to the US capital markets to fund it. It would have to be aggressive to attract foreign investment, and so would reduce the red tape. PRs colonial status has destroyed it, much as a similar status of the French Antilles has. It has created a culture of dependency.

By the way NY is one of the economically strongest states in the USA. NYC funds much of NYS, and NYS PAYS more in federal dollars than it receives back from the Feds. NYS is spending its OWN $$$, and we would have even more of it if we didn't have to support all of those Red States which leach off the Federal gov't.
*sigh*

You clearly know nothing about the ideology of those who support independence. Those who support independence worship Castro and Maduro ... a big indicator of how they view economic matters. They are not capitalists.
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Old 07-15-2015, 07:07 PM
 
3,804 posts, read 6,189,748 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
Well PR is clearly a failure as it is way more indebted than just about any other Caribbean territory.

Panama has evolved into a major center, precisely because it is not within the USA. So why couldn't PR?

If PR had move into independence, after a short period of the Commonwealth status, they would have been better off, as they would have had more flexibility in carving their own destiny. You do know that only US carriers can be used to ship cargo between PR and the mainland. Now how can they compete when DR and Costa Rica can ship using cheaper foreign vessels?

I don't know what will become of them, as at this point, they definitely cannot be independent, nor can they be a state, but the status quo isn't working for them.
I may be misunderstanding you, but I want to clarify. The uncertainty inherent in Puerto Rico not being a state is that no one could say for sure how it would behave as an independent country. Now an independent Puerto Rico isn't something likely to happen, but it could so any sizable investment in Puerto Rico needs to factor in the possibility of things just going crazy.

That same possibility exists in Panama, the U.S., or any nation, but countries with a track record don't tend to make 90 degree turns off their current trajectory. Panama or the U.S. In five years will likely be similar to what they are now in terms of the political and economic climate. The outside possibility that Puerto Rico could become an independent nation with relatively little warning means you can't forecast its future with as much certainty.
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Old 07-15-2015, 09:11 PM
 
Location: IN MY BED
439 posts, read 523,918 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
Well PR is clearly a failure as it is way more indebted than just about any other Caribbean territory.

Panama has evolved into a major center, precisely because it is not within the USA. So why couldn't PR?

If PR had move into independence, after a short period of the Commonwealth status, they would have been better off, as they would have had more flexibility in carving their own destiny. You do know that only US carriers can be used to ship cargo between PR and the mainland. Now how can they compete when DR and Costa Rica can ship using cheaper foreign vessels?

I don't know what will become of them, as at this point, they definitely cannot be independent, nor can they be a state, but the status quo isn't working for them.
You said it, we have evolved into a major center, precisely because we are not within the USA. As a matter of fact, when we had the Canal Zone here, the US was in direct control of the Canal and indirectly of Panama as a country and Panama couldnt develop itself as it is right now because of all the US prohibitions, rules and regulations, for one thing, we couldnt ask for nothing since we were not US citizens, but the US didnt allow us to have relations with other big countries. The US was directly involved in our politics and economy, thus, it was very difficult for Panama to evolve, but since the US is not longer involved, Panama has grown to be a major center in the region, we even have the Hub of the Americas in our International Airport, and we are begining to be recognized as the entrance to Latin America.
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Old 07-17-2015, 11:11 AM
 
Location: IN MY BED
439 posts, read 523,918 times
Reputation: 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by AuburnAL View Post
I may be misunderstanding you, but I want to clarify. The uncertainty inherent in Puerto Rico not being a state is that no one could say for sure how it would behave as an independent country. Now an independent Puerto Rico isn't something likely to happen, but it could so any sizable investment in Puerto Rico needs to factor in the possibility of things just going crazy.

That same possibility exists in Panama, the U.S., or any nation, but countries with a track record don't tend to make 90 degree turns off their current trajectory. Panama or the U.S. In five years will likely be similar to what they are now in terms of the political and economic climate. The outside possibility that Puerto Rico could become an independent nation with relatively little warning means you can't forecast its future with as much certainty.
I do not agree with you in this remark because in one year, we are going to open the new canal, that is the expansion and that will bring way more money into the Panamanian treasure, so I dont think we are going to be similar in terms of economic climate to what we are now.
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Old 07-19-2015, 11:35 PM
 
3,804 posts, read 6,189,748 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by folicure View Post
I do not agree with you in this remark because in one year, we are going to open the new canal, that is the expansion and that will bring way more money into the Panamanian treasure, so I dont think we are going to be similar in terms of economic climate to what we are now.
More money yes, but is it likely that in 5 years the government will control the economy like in Cuba or be almost entirely hands off as Hong Kong used to be?

I guess what I am getting at is that things in independent countries are generally evolutions not revolutions. This reduces the risk inherent in investing as one can generally look at today and take an accurate guess about what the near future will be like.
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