Mountain View to Ann Arbor (Grand Rapids: salaries, living in, cost of)

[scorpio516]

I grew up outside Ann Arbor. At least 4 generations of my family worked at U of M and lived in the area since the mid 1800s, my mom and I went to Michigan. Then I lived 6 years in Sac, now 6 year in New England.

Weather differences:
Much wetter in the summer in MI. Often way too humid.
Summer: South Bay is hotter. Sac is MUCH hotter. SF is much cooler. Berkeley and Oakland? Kinda similar, but often cooler and sometimes hotter.
Summer in Michigan is actually green.
The great lakes are cool, but warmer than the Pacific or Bay. Inland lakes are nice in the summer. Silver Lake and Half-Moon Lake are quite nice outside of Ann Arbor.
Michigan winters are grey. From November through March, it's cloudy more than 50% of the available hours. In December, the sun shines only 31% of the available time...

Hiking is very easy and very flat and kinda boring in MI.

DTW (Metro airport) is very close to Ann Arbor. Basically 3 towns east along I-94 Ypsilanti (Ip-suh-lan-tee) in next to Ann Arbor, then Bellville, then Romulus where DTW is. None of those other towns are as nice as Ann Arbor (or the villages West, South, or North). And they are CHEAP.

Midwestern liberal is different than California liberal. Ann Arbor is the closest, but its still labour focused instead of social issue focused liberalism.

Ann Arbor and the rest of Washtenaw county is expensive for Michigan, but cheaper than even Sacramento. A SFH in Milpitas would buy you the nicest house on the block, or something small in Barton Hills.

Metroparks are a great resource. The Huron river runs through Ann Arbor (from Dexter, starting at Portage Lake). As you go up Huron River, there are 3 Metroparks.

I'd consider there are 3 areas of Ann Arbor - campus (including North and Central), Downtown, and everything else. Downtown is very walkable. Central campus is very walkable. Downtown and central campus are next to each other. Everything outside those two areas aren't walkable.

[craig11152]

Define walkable. I've lived on the SE side since 1984 and have no problem walking other than osteoarthritis in 2 hips.

[usroute10]

Originally Posted by TheProf

Detroit?

Originally Posted by craig11152

I'm sure you know more about Detroit than I do, as do several others here. So I will leave Detroit to the "experts". When offering advice I mostly stick to what I know.

He is responding to your initial post to this thread, which touted that a positive aspect of Ann Arbor is that it's 4 hours away from Chicago and 50 minutes to Canada, but totally left out the proximity to the Detroit, which is bizarre because you have to go through Detroit to get to Canada. Even on another popular internet Ann Arbor forum, when prospective residents start threads about relocating to Ann Arbor, forum members will mention proximity to Detroit as one of the good aspects of Ann Arbor. Detroit has professional sports, major concerts acts, Broadway plays, and other impressive stuff like the Detroit Institute of Arts, Eastern Market, Belle Isle - cultural amenities that most people might enjoy that don't require a 4 hour train ride or a trip across the border.

To the OP, considering your posts on this thread, it seems like Ann Arbor would be a great fit for you, besides the weather shock. It is also a testament to Ann Arbor that a California company to opening a 2nd HQ in that town. Ann Arbor appears to be a growing tech hub. It is low crime, highly educated, racially diverse, and a pretty town in general. Plus, Michigan is on the Great Lakes and is the most beautiful state in the Midwest and has some awesome places to explore, from Traverse City to Grand Haven.

[usroute10]

Originally Posted by craig11152

Define walkable. I've lived on the SE side since 1984 and have no problem walking other than osteoarthritis in 2 hips.

Walkable in the sense that MOST people use, is an area where within 1/2 mile or so of your residence you can walk to a MAIN STREET type of district that has restaurants, bars, pharmacies, clothing boutiques, etc, etc. Basically an area that is caters to the PEDESTRIAN.

If you have to walk through large, multi-acre parking lots and sidewalk-less streets and wide streets with car traffic going a zillion miles an hour to get a store (like the Maple Village Shopping Center at the Jackson Rd/Maple Rd/I-94 area), that area is not walkable. These areas cater to AUTOMOBILE TRAFFIC.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/21...!4d-83.7837106

[MS313]

Ann Arbor itself is a great college town with plenty of amenities. Ann Arbor/ Ypsilanti hangs out on the edge of the Metro Detroit area, so there is endless things to do within a hour of Ann Arbor. The COL is sort of high but pretty good compared to Cali cost of living. But Ann Arbor isn't the most walkable city in Michigan. Detroit, Dearborn, Hamtramack, Grand Rapids, and maybe even Royal Oak is a little more walkable then Ann Arbor. Ann Arbor is a pretty walkable city though.

Overall, I think the biggest shock will be the weather. But the trade off is no earthquakes, wildfires, mudslides, less traffic, and you'll probably end up with alot more extra spending money.

[MrFantastic]

Thanks for all the great feedback everyone!! I've just had an update from management, and there will be a significant pay cut for anyone willing to relocate... approx. 30% pay reduction which is a bit of a kick in the marbles. It's understandable due to the cost of living differences. However, when considering retirement savings (401k contributions), out of state vacations, and such.. it certainly complicates things. The pay reduction really puts the transfer on more of a level playing field, so we'll see how quickly folks commit to the move, and if they decide to change the deal in the near future.

[usroute10]

Originally Posted by MrFantastic

Thanks for all the great feedback everyone!! I've just had an update from management, and there will be a significant pay cut for anyone willing to relocate... approx. 30% pay reduction which is a bit of a kick in the marbles. It's understandable due to the cost of living differences. However, when considering retirement savings (401k contributions), out of state vacations, and such.. it certainly complicates things. The pay reduction really puts the transfer on more of a level playing field, so we'll see how quickly folks commit to the move, and if they decide to change the deal in the near future.

30% pay cut? I could see why your employer might be motivated to setup in Michigan. (Due to the lower cost of living in Michigan, they can pay their Michigan employees far less). That is a considerable pay cut!!

Your services are worth less because you live in a different state? I thought it was about supply and demand?


I hope your company's terms are negotiable. I could maybe understand a 5-10% paycut, but 30% is crazy!

[craig11152]

Depending on which cost of living comparison charts you believe Ann Arbor is close to if not more than 30% cheaper than San Jose. So a 30% pay cut may be a "break even" proposition. That would raise the question of why you would relocate to the midwest to break even financially?

[craig11152]

Originally Posted by usroute10

Your services are worth less because you live in a different state? I thought it was about supply and demand?

Perhaps it is. Perhaps the supply of workers willing to do the job for 30% less is greater in the midwest.

But if a company wants people to relocate a "break even more or less" financial package isn't much of an incentive.

[MrFantastic]

Exactly Craig, I can certainly see folks making the move if they plan on retiring in the area, and would benefit from the relocation help and lower retirement costs, or if they have family in the area that they'd like to be closer too. However, most transplants would likely be moving away from friends/family to an area they probably weren't considering retiring in.