Arizona budget passes; cuts total $1.1 billion (Sun City: low income, insurance, daycare)

[homlish560]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

I am sick of retirees moving here and opposing everything that would make this state a better place for those of us who still have to live here after they have "passed". Their attitudes, like yours, that they have done enough are ruining this state. I would like to see Arizona be a decent place with quality education and opportunity for its citizens. I don't like these people coming here and denying to our citizens the same privileges they and their children enjoyed in wherever they came from. How many threads do we see where people remark that AZ is near last in education? Retirees coming down here and voting against every education initiative is part of the reason we are near last. Education matters to newcomers, to businesses that look to move here, to educated people considering employment here. It is important to the well-being of our state. Skinflint, me-first, retirees are worse than the illegals in my book. They don't give a damn about Arizona and want it run as their low-tax playground. Sorry, that is the way I feel and I am not changing my opinion about it.

Retired or not - lots of people are here from somewhere else and came here because the Tax rates are lower, among other reasons.

California is facing nearly the same Budget problems as Arizona and they are over-taxed so much that it's impossible to keep much of what you make. Cost of Living is outrageous!!!!! That's 1 of the reasons I moved out of Cali - and being 34 y.o., I'm no Retiree!!!!!!

I want to see Arizona as a Quality-Education State too and I hate all these cuts as much as you do, but let's face it ------

Education is very costly and child-free people are paying along with everyone else to educate everyone's kids. I think it should be only the people with kids in School that pay the Education Taxes.

In no way am I a Right-wing Republican either - I don't mind paying some Taxes for Civic improvments if it amounts to just a few pennies out of the dollar.

But facts are facts - we're in a deep Recession and we all have to make Sacrifices. Smug attitudes like yours that slam Retired people won't get us anywhere!!!!!!!

[shiphead]

Originally Posted by homlish560

Retired or not - lots of people are here from somewhere else and came here because the Tax rates are lower, among other reasons.

Education is very costly and child-free people are paying along with everyone else to educate everyone's kids. I think it should be only the people with kids in School that pay the Education Taxes.

In no way am I a Right-wing Republican either - I don't mind paying some Taxes for Civic improvements if it amounts to just a few pennies out of the dollar.

But facts are facts - we're in a deep Recession and we all have to make Sacrifices. Smug attitudes like yours that slam Retired people won't get us anywhere!!!!!!!

I talked about this the other day. I don't know why people, like myself, that decide to not have kids, have to pay for a family of 12. Agreed about civic improvements. I would love an expanded transit system around the area. Buses are great, but always late.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by homlish560

Retired or not - lots of people are here from somewhere else and came here because the Tax rates are lower, among other reasons.

California is facing nearly the same Budget problems as Arizona and they are over-taxed so much that it's impossible to keep much of what you make. Cost of Living is outrageous!!!!! That's 1 of the reasons I moved out of Cali - and being 34 y.o., I'm no Retiree!!!!!!

I want to see Arizona as a Quality-Education State too and I hate all these cuts as much as you do, but let's face it ------

Education is very costly and child-free people are paying along with everyone else to educate everyone's kids. I think it should be only the people with kids in School that pay the Education Taxes.

In no way am I a Right-wing Republican either - I don't mind paying some Taxes for Civic improvments if it amounts to just a few pennies out of the dollar.

But facts are facts - we're in a deep Recession and we all have to make Sacrifices. Smug attitudes like yours that slam Retired people won't get us anywhere!!!!!!!

An educated nation is desirable - democracy and civil order depend on it. You benefit from an educated populace just like you benefit from roads or civic structures (not sure about that one, but anyway). For example, the young doctor who takes care of you when you are sick is likely the product of public education - maybe in a more progressive country like India. That computer you type on is the invention of an educated mind. Besides, all those kids you are funding now are going to be paying your medicare or the bills you leave behind for it. Is that right? Maybe they think YOU should pay the full fare. You don't and shouldn't get a checklist along with your tax bill. Somebody paid for you, too. And likely they did it without carping and moaning like the boomer old farts do.

[adolpho]

A proper amount of student discipline would not have to cost one cent more. I was between homes last Fall, and was substitute teaching in Northern Virginia. They spent 13,000 per student, per year. It was just as bad as the schools here. Teachers that survive, are the ones that turn their backs on bad conduct. Newer teachers are stuck with the worst kids. Illegal immigrants slurp resources like a dehydrated camel.

[homlish560]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

An educated nation is desirable - democracy and civil order depend on it. You benefit from an educated populace just like you benefit from roads or civic structures (not sure about that one, but anyway). For example, the young doctor who takes care of you when you are sick is likely the product of public education - maybe in a more progressive country like India. That computer you type on is the invention of an educated mind. Besides, all those kids you are funding now are going to be paying your medicare or the bills you leave behind for it. Is that right? Maybe they think YOU should pay the full fare. You don't and shouldn't get a checklist along with your tax bill. Somebody paid for you, too. And likely they did it without carping and moaning like the boomer old farts do.

Can't argue with any of that, Educaton is 1 of our Civic duties.

I just think the bigger Families should pony up a little more and the child-free people should be taxed less because they use less services!!!!!!

My problem is with the 'old farts' label. They are your Parents and Grandparents and other Elders that make sacrifices. I don't see why they're picked on so much. I mean, what did they ever do to you?????

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by adolpho

A proper amount of student discipline would not have to cost one cent more. I was between homes last Fall, and was substitute teaching in Northern Virginia. They spent 13,000 per student, per year. It was just as bad as the schools here. Teachers that survive, are the ones that turn their backs on bad conduct. Newer teachers are stuck with the worst kids. Illegal immigrants slurp resources like a dehydrated camel.

I agree with you and money is not going to fix that. Nobody gives a flip about anything but themselves anymore - from the little brats who disrupt classes to the teachers who are just there for the paycheck to the bloated ticks in the administration, to the school board members pushing a social agenda. It's just another manifestation of the me-first, self-indulgence that pervades our society. It is not substantively different from the attitude that I shouldn't have to pay taxes because I don't use this or that service. It is what America has become and I don't have an answer for it - maybe a prolonged depression. Do you?

We desperately need to find a way to do a better job educating our kids - particularly the burgeoning minority population that is replacing us or we are going to face economic devastation down the road as our competitive strength evaporates. What we see happening in Arizona - large numbers of barely literate dropouts coming of age - is going to sweep over the country in the coming decades.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by homlish560

Can't argue with any of that, Educaton is 1 of our Civic duties.

I just think the bigger Families should pony up a little more and the child-free people should be taxed less because they use less services!!!!!!

My problem is with the 'old farts' label. They are your Parents and Grandparents and other Elders that make sacrifices. I don't see why they're picked on so much. I mean, what did they ever do to you?????

I happen to be one of them. I too am a retired boomer. That doesn't blind me to what our generation has turned into - all about money and consumption and self-gratification at the expense of you-name-it. We ought to be ashamed. What happened to us on the way from Woodstock to Sun City? I think we owe the next generation the same shot at the good life we had. They may not get that - many dark clouds are gathering. But if they fail it should not be because we were too tight to pitch in another hundred bucks a year to school them.

[KevK]

Originally Posted by whitem3

State lawmakers delivered on Gov. Jan Brewer's promise to end the days of "expanded government," passing a budget Thursday that eliminates programs and cuts $1.1 billion in spending.

Arizona budget passes; cuts total $1.1 billion

The Republicans always attack the poor and children. Did anybody expect anything different?

[KevK]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

Sadly, you are not alone. Too many share your selfish viewpoint and that is the reason why the US children are no longer competitive with even those in developing Communist countries. Until the "me" generation took over, we valued education. The school was the nicest building in town next to the bank. Folks pitched in with the expectation that it would be better for those who followed than it was for themselves. Today, it's all about selfishness, trading in the hopes of the next generations so you boomers can have a few more bucks to spend on the golf course or the buffet or waste in the Indian casinos. Your generation has always been self-indulgent and irresponsible. When you are gone, the US will be a better place.

The US will never be a better place. It has seen its best days and is now on a path to permanent decline- just like the UK was a few centuries ago and Rome before that. We got fat, lazy, selfish and ugly- just like they did.

[BestintheWest]

and who pays for this


The Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR): The Costs of Illegal Immigration to Arizonans: Executive Summary