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Old 01-27-2020, 12:33 PM
 
40,739 posts, read 25,186,521 times
Reputation: 13060

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollynla View Post
You are completely ignoring the fact that they want to limit magazine capacity and types of guns that are legal. Your logic of that fact that I, personally, haven't lost my rights to buy a gun, so therefore why be concerned, is ridiculous. The time to protest rights being taken away is not "after" it's done but before. How does anyone decide how many bullets to defend my life is too many? How far do we let lawmakers go in deciding what they think is suitable for it's citizens? The fact is that it's up to me, not them and I will make sure it stays that way. I'll say again, they are attempting to take away rights little by little and people like you will gladly support it.
I'm not ignoring anything. All I've offered in this conversation were perfectly reasonable statements. I'm not your enemy. I have stated that I have brothers who own guns. I have stated that taking guns away is a logistical impossibility. I'm not out marching in support of gun control.

What I am is your fellow American. And you can try to persuade me that your point of view is correct, but I will tell you right now, the way you are going about it is not persuasive at all.
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Old 01-27-2020, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Ozark Mountains Arkansas
2,133 posts, read 1,457,076 times
Reputation: 3998
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
I'm not ignoring anything. All I've offered in this conversation were perfectly reasonable statements. I'm not your enemy. I have stated that I have brothers who own guns. I have stated that taking guns away is a logistical impossibility. I'm not out marching in support of gun control.

What I am is your fellow American. And you can try to persuade me that your point of view is correct, but I will tell you right now, the way you are going about it is not persuasive at all.

The more you type, the more you contradict yourself.


I shouldn't need to persuade anyone to not infringe on my 2A rights. What an odd thing for you to say.
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Old 01-27-2020, 12:58 PM
 
40,739 posts, read 25,186,521 times
Reputation: 13060
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollynla View Post
The more you type, the more you contradict yourself.


I shouldn't need to persuade anyone to not infringe on my 2A rights. What an odd thing for you to say.
I haven't contradicted myself.

And if there is legislation pending, that you disagree with, then if you are concerned that that legislation will be made into law, it would fall to you to persuade others that your perspective against the legislation is the proper perspective.
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Old 01-29-2020, 11:44 AM
 
Location: SE corner of the Ozark Redoubt
3,081 posts, read 1,089,446 times
Reputation: 3150
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
I'm not ignoring anything. All I've offered in this conversation were perfectly reasonable statements. I'm not your enemy. I have stated that I have brothers who own guns. I have stated that taking guns away is a logistical impossibility. I'm not out marching in support of gun control...
Would you agree that taking away guns is wrong?

Would you agree that further limiting the types of guns that are legal is wrong?

Would you agree that gun registration, even if it is done in a sneaky, backdoor way, is wrong?
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Old 01-29-2020, 12:18 PM
 
40,739 posts, read 25,186,521 times
Reputation: 13060
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRex2 View Post
Would you agree that taking away guns is wrong?

Would you agree that further limiting the types of guns that are legal is wrong?

Would you agree that gun registration, even if it is done in a sneaky, backdoor way, is wrong?
No. These are absolutes, and I am a rational person that understands that we do have an issue with gun violence in this country, and that that issue needs to be addressed. We can never be an unarmed society. The decision to be armed was made at this nation's inception. Taking away guns is an impossible task. There are too many guns and too many gun owners, and too many good reasons for people needing to have guns. But taking away guns from criminals and people who pose a danger to themselves and to others does not seem unreasonable to me, especially if there is a pathway for those persons to regain their guns. Gun registration does not seem unreasonable to me, as it aids law enforcement in tracing weapons used in crimes.
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Old 01-29-2020, 01:13 PM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
74,196 posts, read 86,586,859 times
Reputation: 44622
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
No. These are absolutes, and I am a rational person that understands that we do have an issue with gun violence in this country, and that that issue needs to be addressed. We can never be an unarmed society. The decision to be armed was made at this nation's inception. Taking away guns is an impossible task. There are too many guns and too many gun owners, and too many good reasons for people needing to have guns. But taking away guns from criminals and people who pose a danger to themselves and to others does not seem unreasonable to me, especially if there is a pathway for those persons to regain their guns. Gun registration does not seem unreasonable to me, as it aids law enforcement in tracing weapons used in crimes.
DC we all agree with the danger of guns in the hands of the wrong people, but we all know the old saying is true: guns don't kill, people do and most gun fatalities involving a crime are the results of criminals having guns and they obtain them in illegal ways. If someone wants a gun they will find a way to get one. There is also the serious problem of poor home lives and poor discipline by parents. As a child, we had guns around the house. Daddy was a hunter plus X military. Our guns were not even locked up, but we were trained at a very young age we were not to touch them under any circumstances. Even my two younger brothers, who were holy tares knew guns were something only adults could touch. They did learn to shot and hunt very young, but they also were required to take gun safety lessons.
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Old 01-29-2020, 01:24 PM
 
Location: Ozark Mountains Arkansas
2,133 posts, read 1,457,076 times
Reputation: 3998
My comments are in red

Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
No. These are absolutes, and I am a rational person that understands that we do have an issue with gun violence in this country (There is an issue with violence in this country, guns by themselves are not violent), and that that issue needs to be addressed. We can never be an unarmed society. The decision to be armed was made at this nation's inception. Taking away guns is an impossible task. (although the left will try) There are too many guns and too many gun owners, and too many good reasons for people needing to have guns. But taking away guns from criminals and people who pose a danger to themselves and to others does not seem unreasonable to me (there are already rules for those on probation, otherwise criminals should be behind bars), especially if there is a pathway for those persons to regain their guns. Gun registration does not seem unreasonable to me, as it aids law enforcement in tracing weapons used in crimes (Do you think it's legally registered gun owners committing crimes?) .
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Old 01-29-2020, 01:38 PM
 
Location: SE corner of the Ozark Redoubt
3,081 posts, read 1,089,446 times
Reputation: 3150
Quote:
Would you agree that gun registration, even if it is done in a sneaky, backdoor way, is wrong?
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
No. These are absolutes, and I am a rational person that understands that we do have an issue with gun violence in this country, and that that issue needs to be addressed. We can never be an unarmed society. The decision to be armed was made at this nation's inception. Taking away guns is an impossible task. There are too many guns and too many gun owners, and too many good reasons for people needing to have guns. But taking away guns from criminals and people who pose a danger to themselves and to others does not seem unreasonable to me, especially if there is a pathway for those persons to regain their guns. Gun registration does not seem unreasonable to me, as it aids law enforcement in tracing weapons used in crimes.
OK you answered one of the questions, ignored one, and weasled on one. Let's try again.

Would you agree that taking guns (like any other life, liberty or property) from citizens, without due process is wrong?

Would you agree that further limiting the types of guns that are legal for citizens in good standing (meaning no convictions or other adjudication of violent tendencies), is wrong?

Let's add a fourth one:
Would you say that prohibiting citizens in good standing from peaceably assembling for the purpose of training with weapons and paramilitary skills an tactics, is wrong?
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Old 01-29-2020, 02:36 PM
 
40,739 posts, read 25,186,521 times
Reputation: 13060
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRex2 View Post
OK you answered one of the questions, ignored one, and weasled on one. Let's try again.

Would you agree that taking guns (like any other life, liberty or property) from citizens, without due process is wrong?

Would you agree that further limiting the types of guns that are legal for citizens in good standing (meaning no convictions or other adjudication of violent tendencies), is wrong?

Let's add a fourth one:
Would you say that prohibiting citizens in good standing from peaceably assembling for the purpose of training with weapons and paramilitary skills an tactics, is wrong?
And YOU changed the goalposts.

Due process is very important. Depriving a citizen of their rights without due process is wrong.

I have no opinion on the second question.

I think the right to assemble is guaranteed by the Constitution. As for training with weapons and paramilitary skills and tactics, I believe some restrictions are appropriate. I don't want them shooting in a playground or near a school, for instance.

This is not important to me. I don't own a gun. But I have family members who have guns, lots of guns. As long as the owner of a gun is responsible, not involved in criminal activity, and not a threat to themselves or others, I really couldn't care less. I think the people in Virginia supporting the red flag law make good points. I don't think some restrictions are unreasonable. But I am not some gun control activist, because I am a realist. We are an armed society. That decision was made over 200 years ago, and the facts are that we are not going to disarm. Period.
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Old 01-29-2020, 03:48 PM
 
Location: SE corner of the Ozark Redoubt
3,081 posts, read 1,089,446 times
Reputation: 3150
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
And YOU changed the goalposts.
I was merely clarifying what I had formerly assumed you understood.
Apparently you didn't, or you wouldn't have seen this as moving the goalposts.

Due process is very important. Depriving a citizen of their rights without due process is wrong.
If that is true, you must be against Red Flag laws, as they do just that.
I have no opinion on the second question.
Apparently you are unaware of the issue.
I think the right to assemble is guaranteed by the Constitution. As for training with weapons and paramilitary skills and tactics, I believe some restrictions are appropriate. I don't want them shooting in a playground or near a school, for instance.
Shooting near a playground would be breach of the peace, and so, would not qualify.
This is not important to me. you are naive I don't own a gun. But I have family members who have guns, lots of guns. As long as the owner of a gun is responsible, not involved in criminal activity, and not a threat to themselves or others, I really couldn't care less. I think the people in Virginia supporting the red flag law make good points. No, they don't. You either stand by your previous statement, or you do not. I don't think some restrictions are unreasonable. But I am not some gun control activist, because I am a realist. We are an armed society. That decision was made over 200 years ago, and the facts are that we are not going to disarm. Period.
We will not disarm, because we refuse to give another inch, to those who have been whittling away at our rights since before WW2. And, BTW, we want some of them back.
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