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One thing I've noticed about Korean-owned/Korean vs Chinese and also general oriental grocery stores (also commonly owned by Vietnamese) here in Australia is the former is often a lot cleaner, aisles are more spacious, and just seemingly more hygienic in general. Of course while there's overlap the latter tends to have more Korean and Japanese products, while the general oriental stores have more products from South-East Asia as well as Chinese. Also, I've noticed the Korean places will invariably have an eftpos machine and often accept credit cards, whereas the Chinese/general ones often do not, and only accept cash. Is this a difference in how they do business? Would you say Koreans have a reputation for being more honest than Chinese, like the Japanese? Do you think these differences reflect different cultural values or am I looking too much into it?
Yeah, Korean and Japanese markets are cleaner, neater, more spacious but more organized, the stores don't smell raw meat and fish. Chinese accepting cash only means they can also cheat on tax by either filing the lower amount of cash they actually generated or by filing the higher amount of cash they actually generated to laundry money earned from other illegal business. "Dirty money" becomes "clean money" earned from legitimate business. Triads pretend to set up these kinds of store front business to laundry their money. Moreover, by not accepting credit/debit cards, they can avoid paying percentage fee to the bank. It's true that the Chinese come up with a lot of business tricks to go around the system. In a corrupted gov't like Chinese gov't, the practice works wonder!
Part of it is probably the conditions the people who run the place are used to. China is not a developed country, and so a lot of things over there do look shabby and messy and of substandard conditions compared to what we are used to in the developed world, and so you generally see that in the condition of the stores here in the states. We notice it 100% of the time when we go shopping at these places (my wife is Chinese, by the way)- the Chinese ones are more run down- they don't put money into keeping them up or perfectly clean, because to them it doesn't matter- as long as the core things such as lighting, freezers, fridges, etc. work and food can get sold- that's all that matters. But Korea and Japan are fully developed nations with standards more similar to what we are used to, and so more attention is paid to more of these other details.
You can say the is the same with Chinese-Viet Vs Korean-Jpn restaurants, although there's exceptions to everything. Aside from standard of living, it is also a difference in image. Koreans tend to care alot about their image, general appearance (plastic surgery?), driving BMWs, Chinese... not so much. I think viet restaurant, supermarket are at a level worse than chinese imo.
However China is changing rapidly. The ones who own business in other countries probably immigrated long time ago. The recent wave of young chinese immigrant are more educated and have higher standard of living than their predecessors
You can say the is the same with Chinese-Viet Vs Korean-Jpn restaurants, although there's exceptions to everything. Aside from standard of living, it is also a difference in image. Koreans tend to care alot about their image, general appearance (plastic surgery?), driving BMWs, Chinese... not so much. I think viet restaurant, supermarket are at a level worse than chinese imo.
However China is changing rapidly. The ones who own business in other countries probably immigrated long time ago. The recent wave of young chinese immigrant are more educated and have higher standard of living than their predecessors
Yeah, the difference between a Chinese grocery that has been the sole family business for 30+ years and a place owned by younger, more recent immigrants is like night and day. You can see it quite readily in places like LA and SF, where you have places that are fairly ramshackle and date back decades, filling most of the stereotypes of what a Chinese market is like, and then you have a fairly slick new bubble tea place that's thoroughly modern, or a cosmetics shop that is cleaner than an ER, or a well-organized and clean Chinese grocer.
Generally, the truth is that poverty is associated with filth and mess. Look around the world and you will see this. China has only been seriously developing for the last 30years, which is just maybe one generation from poverty and even starvation. The reasons why Chinatowns are often so filthy are because of poverty, cultural tolerance for filth due to poverty and a general acceptance of being good enough. Once you get into prosperity, and people have money to send on looks and clothes and they start to demand better service and cleaner environment, then you will see dramatic changes. Take a look at black and white photos of japan in the 1860's or Korea during the Korean War and you will see atrocious filth. Both of those countries were never as clean as they are today. Same with HK and Taiwan Singapore etc. look at Chinese cities like Beijing and Shanghai and you will see a big difference too.
Here's the pure economics of why Chinese vs Korean supermarket differs:
-- China is the most populous nation in the world, with great number of overseas residents, even in Australia. Chinese supermarkets can sustain economically by attracting only Chinese customers. In fact, that is their business model - to offer things that Chinese customers cannot find in a conventional supermarket. In a Chinese supermarket, customers don't come for the presentation, they come for the products.
-- South Korea is 3% of the Chinese population. A Korean supermarket in a foreign country cannot thrive economically by only attracting Korean customers. Therefore they need to branch out and attract customers of other ethnicity; this means their stores need to be clean, well lay-out, accept credit cards, etc; in order to draw non-Koreans into their stores.
Bottom line is that Chinese supermarkets are what they are because they can get away with it - lack of competition means their customers have little choice but to frequent their markets, despite the messiness. If Korean or any other super markets can get away with what the Chinese market can get away with, they would do that, but alas, they cannot.
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Here's the pure economics of why Chinese vs Korean supermarket differs:
-- China is the most populous nation in the world, with great number of overseas residents, even in Australia. Chinese supermarkets can sustain economically by attracting only Chinese customers. In fact, that is their business model - to offer things that Chinese customers cannot find in a conventional supermarket. In a Chinese supermarket, customers don't come for the presentation, they come for the products.
-- South Korea is 3% of the Chinese population. A Korean supermarket in a foreign country cannot thrive economically by only attracting Korean customers. Therefore they need to branch out and attract customers of other ethnicity; this means their stores need to be clean, well lay-out, accept credit cards, etc; in order to draw non-Koreans into their stores.
Bottom line is that Chinese supermarkets are what they are because they can get away with it - lack of competition means their customers have little choice but to frequent their markets, despite the messiness. If Korean or any other super markets can get away with what the Chinese market can get away with, they would do that, but alas, they cannot.
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Wow, never saw it that way. Thanks for a new perspective! It also then follows that over time, as the general Chinese population changes its outlook due to economic development and prosperity, they will demand more than just products.
This explains why the Chinese have this "we are the world" attitude, and could care less what others think of them. China indeed had been the world for thousands of years....
The stereotype only holds if you only shop at those old Chinatowns.
Here in Toronto, the grocery stores in Chinatown are exactly like what you described: dirty, crowded, noisy, many don't accept credit cards (for lower cost etc). However, if you visit those stores in regions where more recent Chinese immigrants live such as Markham, most are spacious, very clean and have excellent quality and selections. Credit cards are widely accepted.
Chinatowns are run by old generation Chinese immigrants from Guangdong and mostly Fujian. It simply doesn't reflect the new trend any more. New Chinese immigrants have little desire to shop at Chinatowns (except for students).
As for Korean stores in K-town, they are marginally better than Chinatowns but not by much.
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