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Typical Americans not living in the larger cities are similar to people in inland China, know little and don't care about HK. Of course people in Shenzhen don't care about Macau, caring about HK more. People in an inland province may only care about the famous HK movie stars or singers they like, don't know about the problems and politics of HK.
I would say that actually, these days, Americans and Westerners in general are probably more aware of the differences or issues between mainland China and HK due to media exposure since 2014, even more so in the last year and a half or so. Macau less so because there hasn't been as much resistance or controversy around Beijing's policies with it.
Of course generally no one is going to be able to tell an HK'er from Mainlander from a Taiwanese person just by looking, but in the US, for most of my life going back to the 80's and 90's, young people I knew would say they were from HK or Taiwan before they said Chinese, even if they were US-born. They wouldn't hide from being ethnically Chinese but their identity had less in line with being Chinese due to the CCP's method of rule over the last half of the 20th century, and how in many cases their families fled.
I haven't lived in the US since 2014, but it seems like that's more the case now than it was even back then because of tensions between China and those places and the US.
first part, not really, especially the americans/westerners that has never been to china/hong kong
second part. well, if obviously impossible to tell ethnicity by looking other than they are asian. But it's quite easy to tell apart if a chinese is from mainland, hong kong or taiwan if you interact with them in just a short amount of time. I'm not sure what you mean by "hiding ethnicity", ethnicity is not determined by where you came from, citizenship, or what you're identify yourself as.
well, come back to the US sometimes and visit the places where chineses live, you can see the vast majority of the new immigrants are from the mainland.
Basically, Taiwanese-Americans who would check the "Chinese-America" box during US census are either dead/dying or are under pressure to do so (grade school tantrum from PRC netizens, mob-like boycott etc.).
My question to you is, do you identify as being a 汉人，唐人，or 华人？Would you be fine if an American referred to you as a Taiwanese Han person? I'm assuming you're not an Aborigine or expat in Taiwan.
Of course generally no one is going to be able to tell an HK'er from Mainlander from a Taiwanese person just by looking, but in the US, for most of my life going back to the 80's and 90's, young people I knew would say they were from HK or Taiwan before they said Chinese, even if they were US-born. They wouldn't hide from being ethnically Chinese but their identity had less in line with being Chinese due to the CCP's method of rule over the last half of the 20th century, and how in many cases their families fled.
I haven't lived in the US since 2014, but it seems like that's more the case now than it was even back then because of tensions between China and those places and the US.
I currently live in America, and I think whether or not you Taiwanese or Hong Kongers mark themselves as ethnic Chinese on the US Census really depends on whether they were actually born in Taiwan or HK or they were born in the US with Taiwanese or HK parents.
I think if you are an American born Taiwanese or Hong Konger, you are more likely to mark yourself as Chinese on the Census. Because you understand that the Census is asking for ancestry, not nationality, that Chinese on the census means of Chinese ancestry, not necessarily Chinese nationality. You are also probably further removed from the Taiwanese and HK independence movements, and are probably more chill and apolitical with interacting with American born kids whose parents are from the Mainland, who you see as just as American as you. After all, you all identify as American first, and ethnic Chinese second. No big deal.
However, if you were born in Taiwan or Hong Kong and you immigrated to America, you would be more likely to mark yourself as Taiwanese, Hong Konger, or other Asian. As an immigrant, you are more likely to perceive the Census as asking for nationality rather than nationality. So of course you don't identify as Chinese. You believe Taiwan and HK are their own countries, so you identify as Taiwanese or Hong Konger. And, especially with Hong Kongers, you have seen hordes of lower class Mainlanders descend upon your city and ruin it with their rudeness. Unlike your kids born in America, who have far fewer encounters with Mainland Chinese, you feel incredibly different from Mainlanders.
So what do you guys think? I was born in America to HK parents, I support democracy and HK independence, but I understand that the US Census is asking about ethnicity, not nationality, so I have no problem with marking myself as Chinese. However, after hearing yesterday about the moment to write in Hong Konger instead, I will do so next Census, to support HK independence. Still, I know that when Americans ask me what Asian I am, and I say American born Chinese, they treat me as fully American and know that I have no affiliation at all with China except that my ancestors are from Guangdong province. That's what's great about America, the moment you become a US citizen, you are 100% American, and people don't suspiciously treat you as some strange evil foreigner.
Pretty sure most mainland Chinese studying in western countries identifying as Chinese dislike the HK and Taiwan Chinese without the same identity in the same western country. They don't talk to the other groups when studying in the same class. But if the HK or Taiwan Chinese tell their mainland schoolmates they have both Chinese and HK/Taiwan identites, they can be friends in western countries.
first part, not really, especially the americans/westerners that has never been to china/hong kong
I've seen discussion online from people in middle America and the south who have suddenly taken an interest in HK because of news exposure and Trump's making it an issue he can use to look "strong" on, for standing up to China. My point was that people are more aware of it than they were before, not that everyone on Main Street Tupelo is discussing the finer mechanations of the Sinosphere.
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second part. well, if obviously impossible to tell ethnicity by looking other than they are asian. But it's quite easy to tell apart if a chinese is from mainland, hong kong or taiwan if you interact with them in just a short amount of time. I'm not sure what you mean by "hiding ethnicity", ethnicity is not determined by where you came from, citizenship, or what you're identify yourself as.
I think you're just being oversensitive about my comments because you perceive me to be antagonistic towards China or the Chinese, for whatever reason. My comment was literally that HK/TW people "wouldn't hide from being ethnically Chinese." I am acutely well aware of the differences between ethnicity, and nationality.
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well, come back to the US sometimes and visit the places where chineses live, you can see the vast majority of the new immigrants are from the mainland.
My experiences in the Chinese enclaves of LA/OC, the Bay Area, and Boston over my last couple trips back home support this, but then, I never said that this wasn't the case... I noticed this from the late 00's onwards, but even in the late 99's/early 00's, before China's economy improved and they found themselves with the means to emigrate, there still seemed to be more mainlanders coming over than there were HK/TW folks. Up until the late 00's though, most of those immigrants seemed to still be working class whereas now they tend to be middle-or upper class.
We hope to move back to the US in the coming months.
... And, especially with Hong Kongers, you have seen hordes of lower class Mainlanders descend upon your city and ruin it with their rudeness. Unlike your kids born in America, who have far fewer encounters with Mainland Chinese, you feel incredibly different from Mainlanders.
So what do you guys think? I was born in America to HK parents, I support democracy and HK independence, but I understand that the US Census is asking about ethnicity, not nationality, so I have no problem with marking myself as Chinese. However, after hearing yesterday about the moment to write in Hong Konger instead, I will do so next Census, to support HK independence. Still, I know that when Americans ask me what Asian I am, and I say American born Chinese, they treat me as fully American and know that I have no affiliation at all with China except that my ancestors are from Guangdong province. That's what's great about America, the moment you become a US citizen, you are 100% American, and people don't suspiciously treat you as some strange evil foreigner.
It is funny how the relics of the past perpetuate itself on and on. Wonder if you are going to pass your biases on to your children
For example- you are born in the US and 100% American, have not lived in China or Hong Kong (maybe just visiting)
Yet, you are feeling that Hong Kong Chinese are somehow superior to Mainland Chinese ( I would simply called it different culturally? in their manners, etc.)
On the other hand, you are very proud that we don't do it in America!
To be a 100% American- is not enough to have a US passport by birth.
It is the way of thinking, the way of life, accepting our differences, not separating people by a lower/higher classes. (We are not British after all!)
You are bringing politics into something what supposedly should be apolitical ( and I understand, that it is not- due to stupid Census questions breaking down people in subcategories - I just don't understand as a taxpayer why do we need to count Taiwanese separately - it is not an ethnicity. Having several categories of Asians, Chinese, etc. just does not make sense! )
If I were you, as a young American I would just write down that you are an American. That's all!
"Divide and conquer" we should not be!
... And, especially with Hong Kongers, you have seen hordes of lower class Mainlanders descend upon your city and ruin it with their rudeness. Unlike your kids born in America, who have far fewer encounters with Mainland Chinese, you feel incredibly different from Mainlanders.
So what do you guys think? I was born in America to HK parents, I support democracy and HK independence, but I understand that the US Census is asking about ethnicity, not nationality, so I have no problem with marking myself as Chinese. However, after hearing yesterday about the moment to write in Hong Konger instead, I will do so next Census, to support HK independence. Still, I know that when Americans ask me what Asian I am, and I say American born Chinese, they treat me as fully American and know that I have no affiliation at all with China except that my ancestors are from Guangdong province. That's what's great about America, the moment you become a US citizen, you are 100% American, and people don't suspiciously treat you as some strange evil foreigner.
It is funny how the relics of the past perpetuate themselves in perpetuity. Wonder if you are going to pass your biases on to your children
For example- you are born in the US and 100% American, have not lived in China or Hong Kong (maybe just visiting)
Yet, you are feeling that Hong Kong Chinese are somehow superior to Mainland Chinese ( I would simply called it different culturally? in their manners, etc.)
On the other hand, you are very proud that we don't do it in America!
To be a 100% American- is not enough to have a US passport.
It is the way of thinking, the way of life, accepting our differences, not separating people by a lower/higher classes. (We are not British after all!)
You are bringing politics into something what supposedly should be apolitical ( and I understand, that it is not- due to stupid Census questions breaking down people in subcategories - I just don't understand as a taxpayer why do we need to count Taiwanese, separately - it is not an ethnicity. Having several categories of Asians, Chinese, etc. just does not make sense! )
If I were you, as a young American I would just write down that you are an American. That's all!
You are making too much out of it and confirming your already existing bias.
"Divide and conquer" we should not be!
It is funny how the relics of the past perpetuate themselves in perpetuity. Wonder if you are going to pass your biases on to your children
For example- you are born in the US and 100% American, have not lived in China or Hong Kong (maybe just visiting)
Yet, you are feeling that Hong Kong Chinese are somehow superior to Mainland Chinese ( I would simply called it different culturally? in their manners, etc.)
On the other hand, you are very proud that we don't do it in America!
To be a 100% American- is not enough to have a US passport.
It is the way of thinking, the way of life, accepting our differences, not separating people by a lower/higher classes. (We are not British after all!)
You are bringing politics into something what supposedly should be apolitical ( and I understand, that it is not- due to stupid Census questions breaking down people in subcategories - I just don't understand as a taxpayer why do we need to count Taiwanese, separately - it is not an ethnicity. Having several categories of Asians, Chinese, etc. just does not make sense! )
If I were you, as a young American I would just write down that you are an American. That's all!
You are making too much out of it and confirming your already existing bias.
"Divide and conquer" we should not be!
haha good one.
OP, when your ancestors arrived to hong kong, does those "hong konger" think they are "lower class Mainlanders descend upon their city and ruin it" ?
or when your parents arrived to america, does the "americans" think they are "lower class Mainlanders descend upon their city and ruin it"
you think you are 100% american because you're born here? not a chance, especially with the anti chinese sentiment these days.
for the people in the US, there are so many misunderstanding about the census here I won't even bother to correct. I will just ignore if you're not in the US.
I would mark American on the Census if I could, but the Census is asking about ancestry, so I mark myself as Chinese. But like I said, I will mark myself as Hong Konger next time by writing in my preferred identity.
Most people who mark themselves as having American ancestry on the Census are white, and I'm not white, so doesn't make much sense.
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