Chinese tennis player Peng Shuai missing after sexual assault allegations made against Zhang Gaoli (speak, influence)
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But China is not Afghanistan and has a reputation to uphold. Being caught disappearing the victims of sex scandals is not a good look for China and should be condemned.
What reputation? China's reputation is that it's trash. It's one of the worst human rights offenders in the world, not that much better than Afghanistan. Everybody knows that.
What reputation? China's reputation is that it's trash. It's one of the worst human rights offenders in the world, not that much better than Afghanistan. Everybody knows that.
I get that you have an ax to grind.
1 year ago, some countries wanted to learn from from China on how to handle Could.
2 years ago, China was lecturing the US on climate change and evironmentalists all over the world agreed.
10 years ago, Taiwanese were voting for KMT and many talked about how China is the future.
You don't lose your reputation in a few years, it declines over time. Each incident like Peng Shuai make more and more people anti-China.
I do not. It's a well-known fact that China is one of the most egregious human rights offenders in the world. It's literally what China is known for.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon
1 year ago, some countries wanted to learn from from China on how to handle Could.
No, they didn't want to learn from China on how to handle covid. They wanted to learn from countries less affected by covid on how to handle covid and almost all of them were Asian countries. It had nothing to do with China at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon
2 years ago, China was lecturing the US on climate change and evironmentalists all over the world agreed.
2 years ago Trump was in office. The mainstream media hated Trump (which he totally deserved) so everyone else was good by default. It had nothing to do with China.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon
10 years ago, Taiwanese were voting for KMT and many talked about how China is the future.
That's because those voters were/are idiots and China always tries to affect election outcomes in Taiwan via all sorts of dirty channels. The general public in Taiwan are incredibly stupid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon
You don't lose your reputation in a few years, it declines over time. Each incident like Peng Shuai make more and more people anti-China.
China never had a good reputation to begin with. People are just more aware of its bull**** now thanks to covid and its childish behaviours.
Last edited by Greysholic; 11-23-2021 at 12:24 AM..
I don't get what you are trying to say. Sure, China is not the only country who cover up sex crimes for powerful people with good connections.
But China is not Afghanistan and has a reputation to uphold. Being caught disappearing the victims of sex scandals is not a good look for China and should be condemned.
Obviously I was saying China is not the only country which does not allow negative comments on national leaders/symbols in public. I don't see how you could misunderstand my statement so much.
How do you know it is a sex crime? How do you know it is a cover-up? China also has the "innocent until proven guilty" principle. Letting public opinions hijack the legal process may be common in the US, but it is not necessarily the optimal conduct.
All I am saying is I need to see more evidence to judge. Why do you guys blindly believe what a person says in a (deleted) blog, as if people never made false accusations? In fact we are not even sure who wrote that blog.
Obviously I was saying China is not the only country which does not allow negative comments on national leaders/symbols in public. I don't see how you could misunderstand my statement so much.
By itself, your comment is just whataboutism. Other countries treating sexual assult victims bad do not excuse China.
And it is the whole system that matters. While Saudia Arabia treats sexual assault victims horrible, it is also known for upholding agreements, which China isn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bettafish
How do you know it is a sex crime? How do you know it is a cover-up? China also has the "innocent until proven guilty" principle. Letting public opinions hijack the legal process may be common in the US, but it is not necessarily the optimal conduct.
All I am saying is I need to see more evidence to judge. Why do you guys blindly believe what a person says in a (deleted) blog, as if people never made false accusations? In fact we are not even sure who wrote that blog.
We know it is a cover-up because they forged an email and a WeChat moment and only released it on western social media while censoring anything about her in Chinese social media. They also didn't let anyone contact her for weeks.
And China's legal system is terrible, even if you compare it to countries with similar levels of development. It is corrupt, there is no judicial independence, you do not have right to a lawyer and there is certainly no innocent until proven guilty. It also has a nearly 100% conviction rate, which is extremely worrying. Lots of people get charged for crimes they never committed, and there is no attempt to improve the legal system.
It is not just me, if I ask anyone I know in China if I should pursue something legally, then they will heavily discourage me, because they know the legal system is not working. No one goes around talking about how China has "innocent until proven guilty" like you do.
Similar to other countries with weak legal systems, the real reason it won't let "public opinions hijack the legal process" is to protect the elite.
1) It is truly a rumor. There is no sufficient evidence, and the only thing we know is a blog post, which has been deleted.
Neither the alleged victim nor the alleged criminal said anything more.
2) Apparently logic is not your strength. How can you make a conclusion involving the term "any" (a global quantifier), based on my observation of a specific Taiwanese gay man who has been posting here for years? (In the past he clearly stated that he hates China and wants China to be nuked). I said he may not understand women well, but it does not entail a dismissal of "any" claim of rape. I understand you intended to polarize my statement to make it false, but such a tactic is rather distasteful.
You let your hatred against China government cloud your judgement. That is ok, but I don't follow that path.
What I say is, without more evidence, it is a rumor. Period.
So a woman writing "Why did you have to come back to me, took me to your home to force me to have sex with you?" is just a rumor? Well you just set the womens rights movement back several centuries. Rapists the world over applaud your opinions. Yes the blog was deleted and no more mention of the accusations in China, we all know why. Oh we also have your comment that those of a certain sexual preference are not worthy to comment. There is so much wrong with what you wrote.
Rumors need to be dismissed, accusations such as the one in our topic need to be investigated. I am all for "innocent before proven guilty" but it seems that this accusation will never see any further action in China.
By itself, your comment is just whataboutism. Other countries treating sexual assult victims bad do not excuse China.
And it is the whole system that matters. While Saudia Arabia treats sexual assault victims horrible, it is also known for upholding agreements, which China isn't.
Read again. Geez that statement was not even particularly about sexual assault, but criticism of national leaders/symbols in general.
The point is, China does not allow such discussions in public, so silencing the discussions is not abnormal in China. Using it as an indication of being guilty is invalid.
[quote=Camlon;62370124We know it is a cover-up because they forged an email and a WeChat moment and only released it on western social media while censoring anything about her in Chinese social media. They also didn't let anyone contact her for weeks.[/QUOTE]
See above.
Also speculations are not evidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon
And China's legal system is terrible, even if you compare it to countries with similar levels of development. It is corrupt, there is no judicial independence, you do not have right to a lawyer and there is certainly no innocent until proven guilty. It also has a nearly 100% conviction rate, which is extremely worrying. Lots of people get charged for crimes they never committed, and there is no attempt to improve the legal system.
It is not just me, if I ask anyone I know in China if I should pursue something legally, then they will heavily discourage me, because they know the legal system is not working. No one goes around talking about how China has "innocent until proven guilty" like you do.
Similar to other countries with weak legal systems, the real reason it won't let "public opinions hijack the legal process" is to protect the elite.
You cannot make general statements for a specific event.
No evidence, no guilt. Be patient and wait.
So a woman writing "Why did you have to come back to me, took me to your home to force me to have sex with you?" is just a rumor? Well you just set the womens rights movement back several centuries. Rapists the world over applaud your opinions. Yes the blog was deleted and no more mention of the accusations in China, we all know why. Oh we also have your comment that those of a certain sexual preference are not worthy to comment. There is so much wrong with what you wrote.
Rumors need to be dismissed, accusations such as the one in our topic need to be investigated. I am all for "innocent before proven guilty" but it seems that this accusation will never see any further action in China.
How do you know what she wrote on the blog is truth, without more investigation? We are not even sure who wrote that. (Maybe a political enemy of Zhang Gaoli?)
Do you know Zhu Jun, a famous anchor of China Central Television lost his job because some woman made a false sexual assault accusation against him? After a length lawsuit, he is found not guilty, but he lost his job and fame. Many women can be irrational with bad intentions.
I am not saying Peng Shuai is one of them, but they exist, so we must be cautious.
Read again. Geez that statement was not even particularly about sexual assault, but criticism of national leaders/symbols in general.
The point is, China does not allow such discussions in public, so silencing the discussions is not abnormal in China. Using it as an indication of being guilty is invalid.
See above.
Also speculations are not evidence.
You cannot make general statements for a specific event.
No evidence, no guilt. Be patient and wait.
We all know that China protect its elites from criticism and scandals. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't condemn them when the CCP disappear a victim to protect its elites.
And if it is a fake claim, then he can sue her for damages. But he is not doing that, he using the state power to disappear her.
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