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I was pretty militant with my lack of belief in God growing up.
Over the years, I'm obviously not as forward with that in day-to-day life, and still think there could be some sort of "god-like" force out there, but I certainly don't believe in an interventionist, personal god that Christians think of.
I experienced a lot of isolation and derision for growing up without a strong religious faith here in Appalachia. Several of my family are LGBTQ, and that isn't acceptable here. My best friend was gay, and ultimately committed suicide - I think the conservative religious beliefs in here certainly played a part in his mental illnesses.
Today, I look at where we are as a country and, in many ways, we are worse off than when I was in high school back in the early 2000s. I live in Tennessee, and now people are moving here from other areas largely because of the area's religious and political leanings. The people we tend to be attracting are often even more extreme than local natives.
What absolutely kills me is that this country is essentially being driven by an extremist wing of evangelical/Catholic Christian thought that maybe just 10%-20% of the people in this country actually believe in. Even if half the country is Republican, many of those people are not as extreme on the cultural issues as the political drivers are.
While I'll be the first to admit that there are great religious individuals, on a whole it seems to be doing far more harm than good these days.
What absolutely kills me is that this country is essentially being driven by an extremist wing of evangelical/Catholic Christian thought that maybe just 10%-20% of the people in this country actually believe in.
The problem isn't so much that up to 20% actually believe it, but that up to 40% or more are willing to support it because it ticks some boxes for them, even if they don't believe it; or, that it sticks it to the lib-ruhls or whoever. Or put another way, they don't understand that they are flirting with fascism and the collapse of the constitutional rule of law (de facto or actual) and that this could result in a world of hurt that could take a VERY long time to reverse.
Some believe that the elites have turned us against each other, that the polarization is engineered. I think it is not so much a plutocratic plot as a convenient gift to them that they are opportunistically leveraging, but regardless, the simple fact is that we (meaning all of us, liberals and conservatives, pious and impious, etc) used to compromise and get along and now we are at each other's throats. With that much ego invested no one can back down and it's the law of the jungle basically.
The problem isn't so much that up to 20% actually believe it, but that up to 40% or more are willing to support it because it ticks some boxes for them, even if they don't believe it; or, that it sticks it to the lib-ruhls or whoever. Or put another way, they don't understand that they are flirting with fascism and the collapse of the constitutional rule of law (de facto or actual) and that this could result in a world of hurt that could take a VERY long time to reverse.
Some believe that the elites have turned us against each other, that the polarization is engineered. I think it is not so much a plutocratic plot as a convenient gift to them that they are opportunistically leveraging, but regardless, the simple fact is that we (meaning all of us, liberals and conservatives, pious and impious, etc) used to compromise and get along and now we are at each other's throats. With that much ego invested no one can back down and it's the law of the jungle basically.
The good thing is that I think the pendulum is beginning to swing back the other way, <<cut>>. Even many moderate religious people are finding the current political/religious path not viable.
Another thing that blows my mind sometimes is how many otherwise normal, reasonable people can get totally pulled into weird rabbit holes with religion. I grew up with a guy who was one of the biggest fire breathing freewill Baptists that you will ever meet. He's held these same views for thirty years. I don't think his views have expanded one iota since we were kids.
Other than having four or five kids, the guy comes across as perfectly normal and friendly in day-to-day life. He's fine if you don't get him talking about religion, but religion is such a huge influence on him that it will spill over into his other interests. Once he gets going, he sounds completely bonkers.
Last edited by mensaguy; 09-08-2023 at 05:47 AM..
Reason: We DO NOT mention "abortion" in this forum.
Even many moderate religious people are finding the current political/religious path not viable.
It is hard to find hard numbers there but I hope you are correct that it's a meaningful sea change.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation
Another thing that blows my mind sometimes is how many otherwise normal, reasonable people can get totally pulled into weird rabbit holes with religion. I grew up with a guy who was one of the biggest fire breathing freewill Baptists that you will ever meet. He's held these same views for thirty years. I don't think his views have expanded one iota since we were kids.
Other than having four or five kids, the guy comes across as perfectly normal and friendly in day-to-day life. He's fine if you don't get him talking about religion, but religion is such a huge influence on him that it will spill over into his other interests. Once he gets going, he sounds completely bonkers.
Yep, I have seen my share of that over the years also.
so there ARE atheists who DO want to end religion.
responses in this thread confirm that.
There probably are some. And, since you're reading the thread, hopefully you are realizing that those who do feel that way have their reasons. In my opening post in this thread, I simply asked the question. You do realize, I hope, that people do have the right to want to end religion???
There probably are some. And, since you're reading the thread, hopefully you are realizing that those who do feel that way have their reasons. In my opening post in this thread, I simply asked the question. You do realize, I hope, that people do have the right to want to end religion???
i pointed out that there are atheists who DO want to end or stop religion
because there are atheists on CD who flat out continue to deny there are any.
i pointed out that there are atheists who DO want to end or stop religion
because there are atheists on CD who flat out continue to deny there are any.
and no it is not "probably." It flat out IS.
So what? Do people not have freedom of thought? Are they doing anything illegal to bring about what they think is best for the world?
i pointed out that there are atheists who DO want to end or stop religion
because there are atheists on CD who flat out continue to deny there are any.
and no it is not "probably." It flat out IS.
Naturally, you can quote them in context saying no atheist wants to stop religion?
so there ARE atheists who DO want to end religion.
responses in this thread confirm that.
I think the world/humanity/the future, would be so much better off without irrationality/supernatural faith/mass delusion and belief in myths, in so many ways. It's not that I want to kill it off because I'm evil- I would like to see it in gradual decline because I'm good, and I want more good things for us all, and less bad. Fewer rockets killing people in Israel/Palestine, etc.
A personal belief is a different matter, and that is always going to be personal, and there's no way to "manage" that, nor would we want to. Everyone has freedom of thought. The problem though is mass organized fundamentalism.
I oppose Islam and Christianity- not because they believe that an intelligent being created the universe. Obviously that's not the belief that's causing problems, and that belief can continue indefinitely as far as I'm concerned, with whoever wants to believe that. It's the rest of the organized specific dogma and social aspects, etc. I want today's religions to become like the dead ones of the distant past that we now all consider mythology- rather than people actually believing all this nonsense and taking it seriously, including literally.
Fundamentalism, and organized religion, are plagues on our world. I'd believe that even if I was not an atheist, and I'd believe that even if everyone on earth believed in the same God. Regardless of God or not, we need to all behave towards each other in a rational, secular humanist type way. And settle our disputes, and determine our public policy that way.
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