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I regard "nones" as a rough estimate of people who aren't church / mosque / whatever members and don't attend but perhaps rarely for a funeral or something. But to conflate those with atheists or even "spiritual but not religious" is not a good idea, IMO.
It is funny, I got home from the hospital not long ago and I got put on home health. Nurse comes out to do her Medicare Start of Care thing.
One of the questions is of course religious affiliation. So I got to be a "none". And to be honest, being a "none" was way less awkward to express than it would have been having to be more specific on that particular question.
Because of my own upbringing, it is hard for me to deal with strangers asking that question (except on here) simply because I feel guilty about NOT being a believer within the context of being around someone who is.
When it is just me trying to be completely honest with myself... I just can't justify glossing over issues and questions that are troubling regarding belief.
To me, when I see believers on this forum handle those things... those things just doesn't seem to bother them. I see it as rationalization and compromise. They obviously don't.
It is funny, I got home from the hospital not long ago and I got put on home health. Nurse comes out to do her Medicare Start of Care thing. One of the questions is of course religious affiliation. So I got to be a "none". And to be honest, being a "none" was way less awkward to express than it would have been having to be more specific on that particular question.
Because of my own upbringing, it is hard for me to deal with strangers asking that question (except on here) simply because I feel guilty about NOT being a believer within the context of being around someone who is. When it is just me trying to be completely honest with myself... I just can't justify glossing over issues and questions that are troubling regarding belief. To me, when I see believers on this forum handle those things... those things just doesn't seem to bother them. I see it as rationalization and compromise. They obviously don't.
some things bother you and some things don't.
for another person, they may have different things that bother them. or don't bother them.
i don't understand why that would bother you.
why would someone be "troubled" by people having different beliefs. or having a different list of "things that bother them" than you do?
It is funny, I got home from the hospital not long ago and I got put on home health. Nurse comes out to do her Medicare Start of Care thing. One of the questions is of course religious affiliation. So I got to be a "none". And to be honest, being a "none" was way less awkward to express than it would have been having to be more specific on that particular question. Because of my own upbringing, it is hard for me to deal with strangers asking that question (except on here) simply because I feel guilty about NOT being a believer within the context of being around someone who is.
When it is just me trying to be completely honest with myself... I just can't justify glossing over issues and questions that are troubling regarding belief. To me, when I see believers on this forum handle those things... those things just doesn't seem to bother them. I see it as rationalization and compromise. They obviously don't.
something else also stands out for me in the post above. the part in bold about feeling guilty around others who have different beliefs. that is quite striking.
It brings to mind something i read a little while after reading this post, the same evening. It said, "your attitude toward yourself determines your attitude toward others." the more we accept ourself and our own beliefs, the easier it is to accept others and have that live-and-let-live ease around the existence and presence of different beliefs.
it occurs to me there is a connection between bold above a person "feeling guilty" about their own beliefs.....and that same person feeling "troubled" by other people with different beliefs criticized for "rationalization and compromise."
i like that quote and will sit with it further. It most definitely is relevant to the thread topic. "your attitude toward yourself determines your attitude toward others."
I have heard that it is that way in the US - or some parts of it. It just isn't that way here. Nobody gets asked about their religion or where they go to church. It would be considered very weird if someone did.
It would be considered weird in many parts of the USA. Certainly in New Jersey or New York or the New England States. I think that is pretty much a southern thing.
something else also stands out for me in the post above. the part in bold about feeling guilty around others who have different beliefs. that is quite striking.
It brings to mind something i read a little while after reading this post, the same evening. It said, "your attitude toward yourself determines your attitude toward others." the more we accept ourself and our own beliefs, the easier it is to accept others and have that live-and-let-live ease around the existence and presence of different beliefs.
it occurs to me there is a connection between bold above a person "feeling guilty" about their own beliefs.....and that same person feeling "troubled" by other people with different beliefs criticized for "rationalization and compromise."
i like that quote and will sit with it further. It most definitely is relevant to the thread topic. "your attitude toward yourself determines your attitude toward others."
It is clear to me that many of my issues on this come from being raised a Christian and having been a fervent believer for those years.
I feel bad that I can't be one anymore when I am around friends and family that still are believers. I just see it as imprinting and while it is an uncomfortable feeling it does make me feel more legitimized in that I was sincere in my beliefs when I was a Christian.
I accept these feelings because I understand where they came from. I also understand that I changed my position on Christianity essentially because I can't rationalize certain issues regarding the religion.
And as I said. I am "troubled" by what is in the Bible. I am "troubled" by the fact that Christian doctrinal disputes. But when I say "troubled" I just mean that there are reasons that I just can't buy into it like I used to.
I'm not "troubled" that other people can't see what I see. Just don't understand how they can't see it. And am amused at how they work these issues (ie rationalize).
But perhaps I should just reemphasize the pertinent point of my post. And that is that being able to say "other" to the home health nurse was far more easier than having to say atheist/agnostic/bokononist... which is how I would actually describe myself.
But perhaps I should just reemphasize the pertinent point of my post. And that is that being able to say "other" to the home health nurse was far more easier than having to say atheist/agnostic/bokononist... which is how I would actually describe myself.
I am fortunate in that I have spent almost zero time in hospital in my lifetime, never inpatient where I was asked this question. And especially when your'e preoccupied and feeling vulnerable, I would probably do what you did ... just say "none" as it's simpler and doesn't so much risk prejudicing nursing staff against me in some subtle (lr not-so-subtle) way. It's really none of their business and just as personal a data point as "protestant" or "catholic" or whatever.
In a Bible Belt / southern hospital I might even say "protestant", lol.
It is clear to me that many of my issues on this come from being raised a Christian and having been a fervent believer for those years.
I feel bad that I can't be one anymore when I am around friends and family that still are believers. I just see it as imprinting and while it is an uncomfortable feeling it does make me feel more legitimized in that I was sincere in my beliefs when I was a Christian.
I accept these feelings because I understand where they came from. I also understand that I changed my position on Christianity essentially because I can't rationalize certain issues regarding the religion.
And as I said. I am "troubled" by what is in the Bible. I am "troubled" by the fact that Christian doctrinal disputes. But when I say "troubled" I just mean that there are reasons that I just can't buy into it like I used to.
I'm not "troubled" that other people can't see what I see. Just don't understand how they can't see it. And am amused at how they work these issues (ie rationalize).
But perhaps I should just reemphasize the pertinent point of my post. And that is that being able to say "other" to the home health nurse was far more easier than having to say atheist/agnostic/bokononist... which is how I would actually describe myself.
Reading these recent comments reminds me of an interesting interview I listened to just last night...
"And I think the biggest unifying theme is a sense that the world you're presented with in the evangelical community doesn't always align with the world that you discover as you learn and grow and maybe get to know people who are different.
But some of those themes are — sometimes, it's sexuality. Sometimes, it's politics. Sometimes, it's science, the view of science. One of the things that I was taught growing up and a lot of evangelical kids are is that the Earth is 6,000 to 10,000 years old, and that one of the reasons that so many scientists believe in evolution is because it's a way to avoid acknowledging God.
And, as I got older, I discovered that most people didn't see the world that way, that there were pieces of — really, pieces of knowledge that were missing from my childhood education. And I also discovered that isn't the only way to see the world, that many people believe in God and believe in science.
And so it's those sources of cognitive dissonance, I think, that drive a lot of people to reframe, question, reform their faith.
Sarah McCammon. The book is "The Exvangelicals: Loving, Living, and Leaving the White Evangelical Church."
I am fortunate in that I have spent almost zero time in hospital in my lifetime, never inpatient where I was asked this question. And especially when your'e preoccupied and feeling vulnerable, I would probably do what you did ... just say "none" as it's simpler and doesn't so much risk prejudicing nursing staff against me in some subtle (lr not-so-subtle) way. It's really none of their business and just as personal a data point as "protestant" or "catholic" or whatever.
In a Bible Belt / southern hospital I might even say "protestant", lol.
it is seen as relevant in a health care setting such as hospital or medical center, because health care systems recognize and acknowledge that the element "religion and spirituality" is a factor that contributes to a person's health and well being. That is why it is taken into consideration in providing patient care for people in health care systems.
I know this because i have worked for decades in health care systems and medical centers.
Do I worry about social stigma regarding my non belief? No, if it bothers someone it's their problem, not mine.
yes. in a nutshell.
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