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Old 09-15-2008, 08:32 PM
 
Location: In The Deep Blue Sea
102 posts, read 351,015 times
Reputation: 52

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Perry Marshall - Origin of the Universe

I'm curious to see what the atheists/agnostics think of this. If you are interested, click on the link to learn more. I'm not trying to make any of you believe, I just want to see what you think of this. Even the believers should take part in this. I am a Christian, and taking part in this made me believe in God even more than I did before.

Last edited by crayfish; 09-15-2008 at 09:23 PM..
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:06 PM
 
Location: An absurd world.
5,160 posts, read 9,191,712 times
Reputation: 2024
I didn't read too much, but I laughed at how the guy was trying to argue that Stephen Hawking's discoveries backed up his beliefs. Stephen Hawking has said before numerous times that if you understood how the universe worked, you'd know there really is no place for a creator.

In the words of Penn Jillette, "Bull#%*$ !"
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:27 PM
 
Location: In The Deep Blue Sea
102 posts, read 351,015 times
Reputation: 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haaziq View Post
I didn't read too much, but I laughed at how the guy was trying to argue that Stephen Hawking's discoveries backed up his beliefs. Stephen Hawking has said before numerous times that if you understood how the universe worked, you'd know there really is no place for a creator.

In the words of Penn Jillette, "Bull#%*$ !"
I guess, according to Stephen Hawking, I don't understand how the universe works.
I believe in God, and I don't see how anything could have come into existence without some kind of god. Again, I'm not trying to make you believe in anything. What I said here is just what I believe.
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Old 09-15-2008, 10:26 PM
 
Location: Richland, Washington
4,904 posts, read 6,029,803 times
Reputation: 3533
What is this 'atheist riddle,' he doesn't even say what it is. Also, he doesn't give any substanive evidence that empirically proves a divine entity had anything to do with the origins of the universe, he's just labeling his ignorance because he doesn't understand something.
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Old 09-16-2008, 03:02 AM
 
2,630 posts, read 4,948,503 times
Reputation: 596
Quote:
Originally Posted by crayfish View Post
I guess, according to Stephen Hawking, I don't understand how the universe works.
I believe in God, and I don't see how anything could have come into existence without some kind of god.
Well when I think of a god what usually comes to my mind is a sentient, intelligent being with incredible powers but the universe is so empty that I really doubt something like that had a hand in making it. The only living things we know exist are those on earth and frankly we are just pathetically small and insignificant. Because of how big the cosmos is compared to us; It seems to me that life itself is just an anomaly, a mistake, a curious occurrence as opposed to a creation by a being who had life in mind or which even experiences some form of "consciousness". I reject theism on these premises.
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Old 09-16-2008, 06:59 AM
 
428 posts, read 1,633,572 times
Reputation: 293
As I recall, Einstein's comment about his "biggest blunder" referred to his positing of a "cosmological constant" to explain the data that seemed to show the universe expanding, which he later refuted. I may not have that exactly correct, but he wasn't talking about anything remotely related to "God". When Einstein spoke of "God" (which he did on many occasions) he meant "the order inherent in the universe", not a Judeo-Christian creator. In fact that's what nearly all the astrophysicists/cosmologists mean when they are trying to sound impactful and dramatic (The "God" Particle, etc).

Truth is, no one knows exactly what created the universe, or why. If you claim it's not possible without a God, you are stuck with explaining what created God. If there was no creator of God, you are back at square one--someone omnipotent springing out of...nothing. If an all-powerful God could spring out of nothing to create the universe, then so could the universe itself.

Teresa
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Old 09-16-2008, 07:29 AM
 
Location: In The Deep Blue Sea
102 posts, read 351,015 times
Reputation: 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mozart271 View Post
As I recall, Einstein's comment about his "biggest blunder" referred to his positing of a "cosmological constant" to explain the data that seemed to show the universe expanding, which he later refuted. I may not have that exactly correct, but he wasn't talking about anything remotely related to "God". When Einstein spoke of "God" (which he did on many occasions) he meant "the order inherent in the universe", not a Judeo-Christian creator. In fact that's what nearly all the astrophysicists/cosmologists mean when they are trying to sound impactful and dramatic (The "God" Particle, etc).

Truth is, no one knows exactly what created the universe, or why. If you claim it's not possible without a God, you are stuck with explaining what created God. If there was no creator of God, you are back at square one--someone omnipotent springing out of...nothing. If an all-powerful God could spring out of nothing to create the universe, then so could the universe itself.

Teresa
This might help answer your question about where God came from.
Where did God come from?
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Old 09-16-2008, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Montrose, CA
3,012 posts, read 8,937,216 times
Reputation: 1973
I call shenanigans on the so-called atheist's riddle:

"An essential property of language is that any word can refer to any object. That is not true in genetics. The genetic code which maps codons to proteins could be changed, but doing so would change the meaning of all sequences that code for proteins, and it could not create arbitrary new meanings for all DNA sequences. Genetics is not true language.

The word frequencies of all natural languages follow a power law (Zipf's Law). DNA does not follow this pattern (Tsonis et al. 1997).

Language, although symbolic, is still material. For a word to have meaning, the link between the word and its meaning has to be recorded somewhere, usually in people's brains, books, and/or computer memories. Without this material manifestation, language cannot work."

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB...
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Old 09-16-2008, 08:57 AM
 
Location: In the North Idaho woods, still surrounded by terriers
2,179 posts, read 7,036,697 times
Reputation: 1014
Quote:
Originally Posted by crayfish View Post
This might help answer your question about where God came from.
Where did God come from?
God came only from the mind of man.
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Old 09-16-2008, 09:20 AM
 
Location: Missouri, USA
789 posts, read 1,337,585 times
Reputation: 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by crayfish View Post
This might help answer your question about where God came from.
Where did God come from?
This uses the Bible as evidence to make the claim that God is everlasting. There is no evidence to say the Bible is actually true so I reject the claim. You need to prove to me that either the Bible is 100% true or that God exists without the Bible used as evidence.
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