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I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I'm just curious . If they have made up their minds that God doesnt exist, then how can they be open to His love?
The problem is, a lot of what Atheists believe is not any different than what most other Atheists believe. So in a sense, they really aren't free thinkers, they think just like everyone else that thinks as they do.
So if they see a person who has spiritual convictions of any kind- how does that make them necessarily closed minded? If you have found what you believe to be true in your heart, why does that mean you cant be open to hear other points of view?
What I feel in my heart, is not limited to my mind. But I just don't see how Atheists can be free thinkers if they shut the door on our Lord. They just follow the ways and thinking patterns of our worldly Godless society.
"There is now substantial evidence from cognitive neuroscience that humans readily find patterns and impart agency to them." Why People Believe Invisible Agents Control the World: Scientific American
So you see, we atheists appreciate the science and beauty of the whole world without resorting to some sort of childlike need to believe in a Driver of the "Car".
I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I'm just curious . If they have made up their minds that God doesnt exist, then how can they be open to His love?
Well, for me it has not been as though i simply decided not to believe, it is based more in the fact that mankind has invented hundreds of gods through out history. Not one more likely then the other, so how am I to know your god exists or not? Following these lines of thought and questioning what i am told of my destiny, the supreme ruler of the universe, or what will happen to myself after I die is one way I consider my self a free thinker.
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Originally Posted by Richmonder27
The problem is, a lot of what Atheists believe is not any different than what most other Atheists believe. So in a sense, they really aren't free thinkers, they think just like everyone else that thinks as they do.
I would ask you, what is it do you think atheists believe in? And why do you think we all believe this?
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Originally Posted by Richmonder27
So if they see a person who has spiritual convictions of any kind- how does that make them necessarily closed minded? If you have found what you believe to be true in your heart, why does that mean you cant be open to hear other points of view?
Well, it would be how one has come about these spiritual convictions, now wouldn't it? Where they hammered into the individual, who was never told, or encouraged to question these beliefs? Have they been sought mindlessly, without possibly considering any other viable options? Then yes, I would see this individual as close minded.
But, i have found that if their spiritual connections are formed from their own willingness to believe, and understanding of others as well, they tend to be much more accepting, an usually make for more enjoyable conversations.
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Originally Posted by Richmonder27
What I feel in my heart, is not limited to my mind. But I just don't see how Atheists can be free thinkers if they shut the door on our Lord. They just follow the ways and thinking patterns of our worldly Godless society.
Again, your lord, is not the lord of most of the people on this earth. And your very last sentence could be considered to be somewhat close minded, do you really know what the "thinking patterns of a worldly godless society" are? If so, please share, I'm sure many individuals here would like to be told what they believe.
Just like gays come out of hetero relationships sp. the offspring, so too do the majority of atheists come from religious families.
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Originally Posted by Richmonder27
I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I'm just curious . If they have made up their minds that God doesnt exist, then how can they be open to His love?
For most of us, your god of the bible has failed the litmus test.
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The problem is, a lot of what Atheists believe is not any different than what most other Atheists believe. So in a sense, they really aren't free thinkers, they think just like everyone else that thinks as they do.
Quid Pro Quo. We see the same with chritsians, they too tend to believe the same thing yet you all fight over who is the real deal, atheists are allowed differing POV as ther is no one single thing we adhere to except that there is no god(s)
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So if they see a person who has spiritual convictions of any kind- how does that make them necessarily closed minded? If you have found what you believe to be true in your heart, why does that mean you cant be open to hear other points of view?
Not what the believe, what they postulate.
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What I feel in my heart, is not limited to my mind. But I just don't see how Atheists can be free thinkers if they shut the door on our Lord. They just follow the ways and thinking patterns of our worldly Godless society.
Your book says you are not of this world. Best pack away that PC, and go live in a cave. I am sure you will have a fulfilling life there.
I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I'm just curious . If they have made up their minds that God doesnt exist, then how can they be open to His love?
I'm a friendly Atheist. I want to clear some misconceptions. It's a misconception that you have that you think atheists have declared that there is no God / he doesn't exist. This is true in SOME CASES, and these atheists are what are known as 'strong atheists.' The distinction is important, because there is also a grouping of atheists which could be deemed as 'weak' atheists which are almost like agnostics, and I am one of those. I am atheist, but I just don't happen to believe in God but I DO NOT declare that a God or Gods couldn't exist - I just don't happen to believe in them. Agnosticism is a term which was coined in the mid 19th century, and quite frankly, it's really messed up the former, basic, and great term of atheism, which you should just declare is a person who is WITHOUT theism. You'll have to dig deeper into each atheist to see if they truly declare that no God exists. Sorry for the long explanation, but this is a truly great misconception in Christiandom which gets debates off on the wrong foot right away.
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Originally Posted by Richmonder27
The problem is, a lot of what Atheists believe is not any different than what most other Atheists believe. So in a sense, they really aren't free thinkers, they think just like everyone else that thinks as they do.
I think this is really iffy. Do you think the same as all of your theistic breathren, both religiously and politically? I wouldn't think so. I think all people think based on their experiences -- there are some people who question less than others and others who question more -- and based on their experiences in life will decide what they think on issues. It's important to understand that Atheists are very unorganized - FAR LESS organized than any religious organization, for sure - so I'm unsure where we'd get our collective facts.
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Originally Posted by Richmonder27
What I feel in my heart, is not limited to my mind. But I just don't see how Atheists can be free thinkers if they shut the door on our Lord. They just follow the ways and thinking patterns of our worldly Godless society.
I think it's awesome that you have something that makes your day better and that you use to learn and to live and all that jazz and you seem like a good person and I respected your questions in this post. I believe they are posed in a respectful manner -- albeit I think there are some misconceptions at the core -- but nevertheless, I hope to clear them up. I hope in reading my post, you'll see it a LITTLE bit differently for some atheists. I would disagree about the Godless society, though. There are over 700,000 worldwide religions and our country, in particular, is dominated by modern Christianity. I would say that it's pretty godfilled society we live in, in fact. But I digress...
Just like gays come out of hetero relationships sp. the offspring, so too do the majority of atheists come from religious families.
For most of us, your god of the bible has failed the litmus test.
Quid Pro Quo. We see the same with chritsians, they too tend to believe the same thing yet you all fight over who is the real deal, atheists are allowed differing POV as ther is no one single thing we adhere to except that there is no god(s)
Not what the believe, what they postulate.
Your book says you are not of this world. Best pack away that PC, and go live in a cave. I am sure you will have a fulfilling life there.
Its interesting you mention the word "religious". Religion is not God. Thats man made stuff. Jesus Christ detested the religious Pharisees.
God is truth and love. Jesus his son died for our sins, and was witnessed by hundreds of people.
You wont find God in Religion. Being a Christian is not about being religious. Its about seeking truth and God's love and wisdom and passing his wonderful message on to others. Not hating or judging people for their lack of faith or belief.
That is why I pose this question. I am just curious how you can be a free thinker if you close the door on God?
The Bible says we are not of this world- but we do LIVE IN this world. It simply means don't live the lies and hate of the fallen world and harden your heart.
God is LOVE. He LOVES YOU. He never forces his love on people, though. If you choose not to be with God, then that is your own free will.
If they have made up their minds that God doesnt exist, then how can they be open to His love?
For the same reason I've made up my mind that the Easter Bunny doesn't exist and I'm not open to expecting candy and colored eggs to appear in a basket with fake green grass when I wake up on Easter morn.
This is where your mind is closed. You need to open your mind up just enough to accept the fact that there are people amongst you who don't want the love of your godhead figure. Just accept that and be content with your relationship with him/her/it.
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Originally Posted by Richmonder27
So if they see a person who has spiritual convictions of any kind- how does that make them necessarily closed minded?
It doesn't. You don't cross the closed mind line until you try to force your religiosity into my world. Just go to your church and respect the fact that I don't want to hear or otherwise experience your proselytizing, and we'll get along fine. Some of my closest and dearest friends are devout, church going Christians. They don't have closed minds because they accept me for who I am, as I accept them for who they are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richmonder27
The problem is, a lot of what Atheists believe is not any different than what most other Atheists believe. So in a sense, they really aren't free thinkers, they think just like everyone else that thinks as they do.
Oh well. You're entitled to your opinion. Just don't come to my door with it.
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Originally Posted by Richmonder27
If you have found what you believe to be true in your heart, why does that mean you cant be open to hear other points of view?
Because I've heard it six ways to Sunday. Mind you, I was raised going to church. It didn't take. Hearing the same tired crapola over and over isn't going to induce a religious (read: Christian) epiphany in my life. Ever have a 3 year old ask "why" to everything you say? Same thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richmonder27
But I just don't see how Atheists can be free thinkers if they shut the door on our Lord.
I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I'm just curious . If they have made up their minds that God doesnt exist, then how can they be open to His love?
The problem is, a lot of what Atheists believe is not any different than what most other Atheists believe. So in a sense, they really aren't free thinkers, they think just like everyone else that thinks as they do.
So if they see a person who has spiritual convictions of any kind- how does that make them necessarily closed minded? If you have found what you believe to be true in your heart, why does that mean you cant be open to hear other points of view?
What I feel in my heart, is not limited to my mind. But I just don't see how Atheists can be free thinkers if they shut the door on our Lord. They just follow the ways and thinking patterns of our worldly Godless society.
This all sounds rather disingenuous.
Why must one be "open" to the "love" of an invisible, supernatural entity in order to be a "free thinker"?
I'm not entirely sure what you even mean by the term, but really, do you also think people need to believe in ghosts, space aliens, astrology, Loch Ness monsters, telekinesis, the healing power of crystals, and every other bit of superstitious whimsy that floats down the pike, in order to be intellectually "free"?
That is why I pose this question. I am just curious how you can be a free thinker if you close the door on God?
30+ years in delusion was enough for me and many others (varying times of course)
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God is LOVE. He LOVES YOU. He never forces his love on people, though. If you choose not to be with God, then that is your own free will.
God is a construct of human emotions nothing more.
Last edited by justme58; 05-24-2009 at 12:54 AM..
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