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Many city leaders said their own project lists show a majority of the funds going toward transportation, talking about proposals that include sidewalks and multi-use paths that belong in the category alongside roads and bridges. They did point out that the county's list will not include transit -- a segment of the Atlanta plan that was unpopular in the suburbs.
Over the 28 years Gwinnett has participated in SPLOST programs, more than $2.5 billion has been collected, including more than $1.2 billion for transportation projects.
Thoughts? Will it pass?
Is this the Plan B for TSPLOST? Let each county (or small group of counties if the state gets the legislation updates) pass their own plan?
Is this the Plan B for TSPLOST? Let each county (or small group of counties if the state gets the legislation updates) pass their own plan?
Of course Gwinnett would fund the one thing that will actually solve congestion; transit. Why don't they just fund the CID's plan of building a LRT line from Doraville to Gwinnett Arena, via Satellite Blvd?
Of course Gwinnett would fund the one thing that will actually solve congestion; transit. Why don't they just fund the CID's plan of building a LRT line from Doraville to Gwinnett Arena, via Satellite Blvd?
...Because of the very-strong contingent of hardcore anti-transit Tea Partiers in the county that is centered on Dacula (I know many of them).
With voter participation rates as low as 6% in some local elections in Gwinnett, those hardcore anti-transit Tea Partiers and ultraconservatives may often be the ONLY participants in the GOP Primaries that decide the outcome of most elections in the thoroughly Republican-dominated county.
Also, because any county government plan to fund something that expensive would likely not necessarily get all that great of a response at this point in Gwinnett County's history after a series of episodes of corruption and ethics scandals by county government.
can't wait till gwinnett turns blue. it won't be long. then you won't have all these psycho anti-tax people. look, i understand taxes need to be reasonable. but if these tea partiers were around when things like public sewers, public libraries and road paving were introduced, we'd still be living in squalour.
Maybe there are tea partiers in places like Dacula, but those aren't exactly the population centers of the county.
Remember, Gwinnett is now majority minority. It's the only county in the metro that can say that. My guess is since much of the minority population is made up of non-citizens, the voting patterns don't necessarily accurately reflect the views of the county's citizens.....yet.
I wouldn't call Gwinnett anti-tax, either. That article indicates that there have been SPLOST programs for 28 years. Those are taxes voted on by residents, if they were so anti-tax, why would they voluntarily and consistently vote to tax themselves? The answer is local control. You can't drive by a park or school in Gwinnett county without seeing a sign that says your SPLOST pennies hard at work. Nationally renowned parks aren't just born out of thin air. They are the result of residents who believe these things are important to good life.
I bet the next SPLOST gets voted in even thought most of it is going to transportation because it's going to fund local projects. Multi-use trails, roads, intersections, and sidewalks. Those are important things. It'd be nice if that rail line from Gwinnett Center to Doraville would get built, but I'm beginning to think it won't happen in my lifetime.
The reason T-SPLOST failed in areas like Gwinnett is because people like to see tax dollars at work. When I go to a park or library near my house and see it was funded with SPLOST funds, that's cool. I don't think most people see the value in voluntarily taxing themselves and seeing most of the money go to a rail line so doctors and scientists can ride MARTA to Emory or so a Beltline can be expanded through west Atlanta 30 miles away. Myopic? You could argue that, but it's the way it is, and that's probably not going to change when the county goes from red to blue.
...At this point in Gwinnett's existence, with a fast-growing population of over 842,000 people and a demographic makeup that is over 57% minority, it is overwhelmingly more than likely that there are more moderates and non-conservatives then there are hard-line conservatives living in Gwinnett County at present.
But with Gwinnett traditionally being a Republican-dominated county over the last 3 decades, and with all county-wide offices and all seats on the Gwinnett Board of Commissioners and an overwhelming majority of the seats of Gwinnett's state and federal legislative delegations being occupied by Republicans, and with more Republican voters participating in statewide elections in Gwinnett than in any other county in the state of Georgia, though not as thoroughly dominated by ultraconservatives as Northwest Metro Cobb County has been traditionally, Gwinnett County is indeed a hotbed of political conservatism and Republican activity in the state of Georgia and in the Southeastern U.S.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL
Maybe there are tea partiers in places like Dacula, but those aren't exactly the population centers of the county.
...That's an excellent point that the hotbed of Tea Party and ultraconservative political activity that is Dacula is not necessarily a population center of Gwinnett.
But with the non-conservative majority of Gwinnett's population participating in the electoral process at an infinitely much lower rate than than conservatives, the Tea Partiers, hard-line conservatives and ultraconservatives still have a much-larger and outsized say in Gwinnett County's political scene than do non-conservatives.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL
Remember, Gwinnett is now majority minority. It's the only county in the metro that can say that.
...That is true, Gwinnett County is now majority-minority.
But Gwinnett County is not necessarily the only county nor is it the only suburban county in Metro Atlanta that can make the claim of being majority-minority.
That's because in addition to Gwinnett County and its 57% minority population (a figure that is up from 4% in 1980), other Metro Atlanta counties with majority-minority populations include:
Clayton County, where minorities make up 85% of the county's population, a figure that is up from 9% in 1980.
DeKalb County, where minorities make up 70% of the county's population, a figure that is up from 30% in 1980.
Fulton County, where minorities make up 59% of the county's population, a figure that is up from 51% in 1980.
Rockdale County, where minorities make up 59% of the county's population, a figure that is up from 10% in 1980.
Douglas County, where minorities make up 51% of the county's population, a figure that is up from 6% in 1980.
Other Metro Atlanta counties like Newton County (48% minority population, up from 24% in 1990), Henry County (48% minority population, up from 12% in 1990), and traditional Republican super-stronghold Cobb County (44% minority population, up from 6% in 1980) stand on the verge of becoming majority-minority counties likely within the next decade or so.
Overall, minorities makeup 50% of the population of the 28-county Greater Atlanta metro region, a figure that is up from 29% in 1990 and 26% in 1980.
Minorities also makeup a fast-growing 45% of the population of the state of Georgia, and comprise nearly 57% of Georgia population of public schoolchildren.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL
My guess is since much of the minority population (of Gwinnett County) is made up of non-citizens, the voting patterns don't necessarily accurately reflect the views of the county's citizens.....yet.
...That's a really excellent point.
Though, it is not just that much of the minority population is made up of non-citizens, but also because most of Gwinnett's population is made up of transients who were born and raised elsewhere who have moved to the county from other parts of the country and the world, that plays in a key role in why voting patterns don't necessarily accurately reflect the views of the county's citizens.
Another reason why Gwinnett's voting patterns are not necessarily reflective of its large and diverse population is because of the extremely dismal and almost non-existent state of Georgia's Democratic Party, which despite the fast-growing and increasingly-diverse population of Gwinnett, has virtually no organizational presence inside of the county (or much anywhere in the state right now).
That's as opposed to Gwinnett's Republican Party which is one of the most-dominant and most-active and has one of the largest, if not the largest membership of any county chapter of the Republican Party in the state of Georgia.
The Gwinnett chapter of the Republican Party is also one of the most-active county Republican Party chapters in the entire U.S.
So despite the rapidly-changing and increasingly ultra-diverse demographics of Gwinnett County seemingly going their way, Democrats have a heckuva lot of work to do before they can make any meaningful inroads into what is currently one of the toughest Republican strongholds in the country.
A geographical stronghold that Republicans are not going to give up without one heck of a political fight, despite what the numbers say.
That's because Gwinnett is currently the base of political power in the entire state for Georgia Republicans, a base of political power in Gwinnett that holds the key to total domination of the state's political scene.
Georgia Republicans view Gwinnett as being the canary in the coal mine that is Georgia politics.
That's because Georgia Republicans know that when Gwinnett goes, so goes the Georgia Republican Party, because without Gwinnett there is no Republican supermajority in both houses of the State Legislature and there is no total domination all of statewide offices.
Last edited by Born 2 Roll; 06-12-2013 at 03:38 AM..
I wouldn't call Gwinnett anti-tax, either. That article indicates that there have been SPLOST programs for 28 years. Those are taxes voted on by residents, if they were so anti-tax, why would they voluntarily and consistently vote to tax themselves? The answer is local control. You can't drive by a park or school in Gwinnett county without seeing a sign that says your SPLOST pennies hard at work. Nationally renowned parks aren't just born out of thin air. They are the result of residents who believe these things are important to good life.
I bet the next SPLOST gets voted in even thought most of it is going to transportation because it's going to fund local projects. Multi-use trails, roads, intersections, and sidewalks. Those are important things. It'd be nice if that rail line from Gwinnett Center to Doraville would get built, but I'm beginning to think it won't happen in my lifetime.
The reason T-SPLOST failed in areas like Gwinnett is because people like to see tax dollars at work. When I go to a park or library near my house and see it was funded with SPLOST funds, that's cool. I don't think most people see the value in voluntarily taxing themselves and seeing most of the money go to a rail line so doctors and scientists can ride MARTA to Emory or so a Beltline can be expanded through west Atlanta 30 miles away. Myopic? You could argue that, but it's the way it is, and that's probably not going to change when the county goes from red to blue.
...Those are also all excellent points.
Though, I'm not necessarily sure that the proposed alignment between the Doraville MARTA Station and Gwinnett Center is the right alignment for a high-capacity rail transit line because of the sprawling low density of development and population along that proposed alignment.
The existing Norfolk Southern/Amtrak rail right-of-way between Doraville and Buford looks to be a better fit for a high-capacity rail transit line because of the much-higher density of population and development along the NS/Amtrak right-of-way.
The existing Norfolk Southern/Amtrak rail right-of-way between Doraville and Buford also looks to be a better fit for future high-capacity rail transit service because that would tie with the proposals by the state and the Feds to operate regional commuter rail service and interstate high-speed rail service along the NS/Amtrak right-of-way northeast of Atlanta.
The best way to serve Gwinnett Center with rail transit service might just be by way of high-frequency bus shuttle service between Gwinnett Center and a future rail transit station on a future rail transit line that runs within the existing NS/Amtrak right-of-way.
The existing NS/Amtrak rail right-of-way also seems to be the absolute best fit for a future high-capacity rail transit line because of how the cities of Norcross, Duluth, Suwanee and Buford (and Oakwood in Hall County) are all continuing to redevelop their historic downtowns around the sites of future rail transit stops.
Also, at this point, it is likely much better both politically and financially if future rail transit lines are developed, constructed and operated with private investment than with public tax funds.
Though, I'm not necessarily sure that the proposed alignment between the Doraville MARTA Station and Gwinnett Center is the right alignment for a high-capacity rail transit line because of the sprawling low density of development and population along that proposed alignment.
It may not be the best in our eyes, but its what Gwinnett residents and business owners in the CIDs approved. TRANSPORTATION | Gwinnett Village. Its their money and their county, so they have the right to run LRT anywhere they want. I just want to see them invest in some form of rail-based transit and have it integrate with MARTA.
I think the NS line is better for commuter rail to serve the downtowns along it, like in the past.
I don't think tiny, separate, localized "TSPLOSTs" are the answer to what is a regional issue. I'm not applying we need a 16-county coordination effort, but Fulton, Cobb, Dekalb, and Gwinnett at the very least should realize they're intertwine and regional issues like transportation need to be tackled together. These insular efforts will do nothing but waste funds that could be spent linking regional centers.
I don't think tiny, separate, localized "TSPLOSTs" are the answer to what is a regional issue. I'm not applying we need a 16-county coordination effort, but Fulton, Cobb, Dekalb, and Gwinnett at the very least should realize they're intertwine and regional issues like transportation need to be tackled together. These insular efforts will do nothing but waste funds that could be spent linking regional centers.
I could see Fulton, DeKalb, Clayton, and maybe Gwinnett. But not Cobb. They are too independent to play nice with the other counties.
If each county would stop with the county-only SPLOST, then maybe a true regional TSPLOST could work without residents feeling too taxed.
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