Has the Atlanta Area Peaked? (Kennesaw, Snellville: living in, professionals, airport)

[mike7586]

Originally Posted by arjay57

I've never understood this argument that higher gas prices will drive people out of the suburbs and back to the city. If the bulk of the jobs were in the city, that might make sense.

However, in the Atlanta region that's not the case and it hasn't been in a very long time. The vast majority of people (including those who live in the city) work in the suburbs. So if anything you'd think higher gas prices would have the opposite effect.

The Perimeter area has a lot of jobs, and if you compare it to each individual area of the city it has more jobs, but if you combine Downtown, Midtown, Buckhead, the Airport, Fulton Industrial area, and all the retail/restaurant/hotels in city limits, etc. the city of Atlanta still has a large portion of metro area jobs.

[Broadrippleguy]

Originally Posted by testa50

While I don't agree that gas prices will make the suburbs into ghost towns, I definitely think it's true that the city has the highest proportion of jobs to residents, which is what you think would matter. My guess is that the average driving commute distance for someone who lives in the city of Atlanta is probably a lot shorter than people who live in a place like Canton. Especially since a chunk of people in the city don't have to drive to work at all.

But I just don't think gas prices are make up enough of a chunk of a family's budget to matter that much. If you use 500 gallons a year, the price going up $1 will cost you $500. Not all that significant in the grand scheme of things (property tax differentials alone are way higher).

well thats the thing is in the future if Atlanta contiunes to grow and just relies on the roads traffic will get worse and people move farther out.
We have a parallel Issue here in Indianapolis our transit is buses and thats it.
Now we may only have 1.8M people in our metro atm but were the fastest growing region in the midwest so that leaves us with a few choices for the future.
1 is we could just expand Bus Service which i support this idea until we grow enough to build a rail
2nd we could just widen the roads but already I-465 has some parts with more lanes than many of Atlantas Roads. 10 lanes total etc.
3rd is to start construction on the commuter rail from Greenwood to Fishers through downtown Indy in the next 10 years.

But Regardless alot of major cities in America need to realize in the future the freeway system won't be the best way for a majority of a population to commute Mass Transit is the future with maglev trains etc.
I think alot of America's cities need to sit down and debate what Atlanta/Indy are doing and see about expanding mass transit to accomidate growth.

[anothertntony]

Originally Posted by mike7586

It's not that hard to find...

Transportation referendum coverage *| ajc.com (http://www.ajc.com/news/transportation-referendum-coverage-919825.html - broken link)

(PDF project list is at the top)

Atlanta Regional Roundtable - Penny sales tax referendum to fund transportation projects

Thanks - that PDF is very helpful.

So, let me see if I can get this timeline straight:

- 2010ish: Transportation Investment Act passes, opens door for 1% transit sales tax
- Oct 15, 2011: Investment list due. There was no ballot for the actual list contents, but it was selected by 21 elected officials from the region. For Cobb, the list includes a $695 million "enhanced" bus line to the MARTA Arts Center Station in lieu of rail.
- Nov. 8, 2011: Vote for beer on Sundays. Nothing about transportation.
- Summer 2012: Vote on whether or not bus service to the MARTA Arts Center Station is worth ~$700 million.

Is that right?

[MathmanMathman]

Originally Posted by Broadrippleguy

But Regardless alot of major cities in America need to realize in the future the freeway system won't be the best way for a majority of a population to commute Mass Transit is the future with maglev trains etc.
I think alot of America's cities need to sit down and debate what Atlanta/Indy are doing and see about expanding mass transit to accomidate growth.

I doubt that a majority of the population will be commuting by mass transit. That's only the case with New York and there it's close to 50-50. We might see more fringe cities in the future. NCR put its headquarters in Duluth and a lot of companies are locating to North Fulton. More telecommuting might also be part of the answer.

[mike7586]

Originally Posted by anothertntony

Thanks - that PDF is very helpful.

So, let me see if I can get this timeline straight:

- 2010ish: Transportation Investment Act passes, opens door for 1% transit sales tax
- Oct 15, 2011: Investment list due. There was no ballot for the actual list contents, but it was selected by 21 elected officials from the region. For Cobb, the list includes a $695 million "enhanced" bus line to the MARTA Arts Center Station in lieu of rail.
- Nov. 8, 2011: Vote for beer on Sundays. Nothing about transportation.
- Summer 2012: Vote on whether or not bus service to the MARTA Arts Center Station is worth ~$700 million.

Is that right?

Not really. What might hold this area back more than anything is resistance by so many people - not just to transit, but building new highways and toll roads, etc.

On the list are several major road projects, such as rebuilding the 400/285 interchange as well as collector-distributor lanes on 400 leading up to the new interchange (these do work) and fixing the northbound ramps from 285 to 85N at Spaghetti Junction (which is one of the worst backups in the area). It will widen and improve pedestrian access on Piedmont Rd/Roswell Rd from Lindbergh in Atlanta through Buckhead to Sandy Springs city limits and build bus rapid transit - this bus route has some of the highest ridership and greatest potential, so BRT makes sense and this road is a complete nightmare most of the time at rush hour. Another nightmare road is North Druid Hills near I-85... which will be widened along with other improvements. It will turn Tara Blvd in Clayton County into a super-highway (no lights), extend Sugarload Parkway in Gwinnett to Buford Highway as a limited access highway (no lights) as well as upgrade 316 in Gwinnett County into a limited access highway (build interchanges where intersections are now), and a new interchange in North Gwinnett at I-85 and Gravel Springs Rd will be built to take the burden off of Buford Highway. Multiple state routes that are currently one lane country roads will be widened in North Fulton, Cherokee and Henry Counties. A interchange will be built at Cobb Parkway and Windy Hill Road eliminating the need to wait for the light at this major intersection, several intersections on Cobb Parkway will also get turn lane/intersection improvements to help with capacity, and Windy Hill Road and I-75 interchange will be rebuilt. There's also lots of traffic synchronization improvements which are badly needed.

That's just what I can think of off the top of my head.

[anothertntony]

Originally Posted by mike7586

Not really. What might hold this area back more than anything is resistance by so many people - not just to transit, but building new highways and toll roads, etc.

On the list are several major road projects, ...

That's just what I can think of off the top of my head.

Good info, thanks.

[po-boy]

Every city faces tons of challenges which are often potential opportunities. I think Atlanta's future is very much up in the air and the choices that its residents and leaders make will have a huge effect on what happens to the city in the medium-term.

Atlanta has lots of positives: it has a nice four-season climate, it is in a good location to serve as a hub, it has decent infrastructure, and it is viewed as the defacto cultural capital of the southeast.

To me, the biggest issues that Atlanta (the city and the region) faces are transportation and lack of cooperation across the region. Those two issues are obviously interrelated. The lack of cooperation among the various governmental entities is very disturbing and is exacerbated by the small county size in Georgia. IMO it really handicaps the region b/c it is difficult to make sensible medium and long-term plans b/c there are so many different factions that need to get something out of each plan. The "us" and "them" thinking is really detrimental to almost everyone in the long term.

That problem has partly led to the transportation issues. Atlanta is arguably ahead or even with most other sunbelt cities, but obviously behind most large cities in the NE, midwest and west coast. I am generally a proponent of lower taxes, but I think the people of the region really need to pass next year's transportation tax, b/c if they don't I think the issue will continue to be an anchor that pulls down the region's economy.

Aside from those issues, there are the normal big city issues of education and crime. While those are interesting topics also, I feel that the same solutions that work in other places could be used in Atlanta, whereas the first two issues are a bit more unusual and Atlanta-specific (although of course other cities have issues with those as well).

[imaterry78259]

Atlanta is nice but it is no Dallas or Houston

[johnatl]

Originally Posted by imaterry78259

Atlanta is nice but it is no Dallas or Houston

Dallas and Houston are nice but they are no Atlanta.

[tonygeorgia]

Originally Posted by imaterry78259

Atlanta is nice but it is no Dallas or Houston

You serious? Our topography is better, our airport has more direct flights,our nightlife is better, our last call is later, we are closer to real beaches, we have trees and a real park downtown, we are near the mountains, we have more entertainment, our rail system is better, we have more foot traffic downtown, our skyline is better, more things to do for professionals,etc