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What exactly does that say to you? They've long ago correlated income w/ testing performance. If your family has money, there are several factors at play. You can afford to move to the best school system, your family may have more inherent cognitive ability, and your parents may have more resources to make sure you do well in school (tutors, hiring other kids to take your SAT). I'm not saying schools don't perform differently for a given economic category but all you've said is poorer schools do worse as if it's some badge of honor that you went to a money school w/ rich kids duking it out to get half the class to UGA. The kid from a disadvantaged school very likely could be a far harder worker than the kid w/ 2k cash to buy a higher SAT score or a lifetime supply of Adderall. Personally, I'd look for the kids w/ the biggest delta from the school's performance. If everyone in the class has a 1500+ SAT (I refuse to count the writing section), any of them will do fine in school but the kid w/ the 1300+ in a school that avg's under 900 probably faced a lot more challenges than not getting voted president of science club.
Excellent stuff, Mishap (unfortunately I wasn't allowed to rep you).
On another fairly recent thread, poster equinox63 mentioned having spoken to MLK seniors (class of 2012) who have acceptances at Princeton, Yale and other prestigious colleges. My daughter is a senior at one of the top 10 schools on mrpanda's list, and I suspect her class has fewer Ivy acceptances than MLK's class does. My kid is also, as it happens, a top student who's applying to some Ivies. It's clear that those highly selective colleges are looking for diversity of all kinds as they make up their freshman class. Do I resent this or feel that if any kid with lower grades gets in and my kid doesn't, "her" place was "taken?" No, I do not. If course I hope for my daughter to get into a great college, but I don't feel that society owes her a spot, or that it's unfair for colleges to select on whatever criteria they see fit.
Excellent stuff, Mishap (unfortunately I wasn't allowed to rep you).
On another fairly recent thread, poster equinox63 mentioned having spoken to MLK seniors (class of 2012) who have acceptances at Princeton, Yale and other prestigious colleges. My daughter is a senior at one of the top 10 schools on mrpanda's list, and I suspect her class has fewer Ivy acceptances than MLK's class does. My kid is also, as it happens, a top student who's applying to some Ivies. It's clear that those highly selective colleges are looking for diversity of all kinds as they make up their freshman class. Do I resent this or feel that if any kid with lower grades gets in and my kid doesn't, "her" place was "taken?" No, I do not. If course I hope for my daughter to get into a great college, but I don't feel that society owes her a spot, or that it's unfair for colleges to select on whatever criteria they see fit.
On July 18, 2009, Lambert officially opened it's doors to over 1400 students in grades 9-11. A senior class was added the following year. The first graduating class was in June 2011. Not sure where the original data was from in the magazine but assume Lambert did not make it solely because there was no data. 2011 avg SAT was 1618.
Forsyth County is not a member of the ARC, but should be. This also explains the absence of some of the Coweta County and Paulding County high schools from the list.
If you look in the Atlanta Magazine spread about the 50 Best Public High Schools, this is explained in the "Key to Rankings/Indicators" Box (black).
I hope this brings clarity--and I hope that Forsyth, Coweta, Paulding, Newton, Walton, Barrow, Hall, Bartow, Spalding, and Carroll eventually join the ARC!
Last edited by aries4118; 01-08-2012 at 01:02 PM..
I grew up in fashionable East Cobb...Walton and Lassiter are old guard in my book.
I had a feeling that would be coming. Guess we'll call Walton "Middle-Age" guard.
I think Wheeler opened in 1966 and less than 10 years later they had to build Walton. Originally, Walton had a strong Vo-Tech program with electronics, care repair shop etc. I'm guessing with its present stature it's mostly college preparatory now.
And I suppose Wheeler was a spawn of Marietta and Sprayberry?
Quote:
East Cobb
Walton--Spawn of Wheeler+Sprayberry
Lassiter--Spawn of Walton+Sprayberry
Pope--Spawn of Lassiter+Walton
Kell--Spawn of Lassiter+North Cobb+Sprayberry
"Old Guard": Wheeler and Sprayberry
West Cobb
Harrison--Spawn of North Cobb+McEachern
Kennesaw Mountain--Spawn of Harrison+North Cobb
Hillgrove--Spawn of McEachern+Kennesaw Mountain+Harrison
Allatoona--Spawn of Kennesaw Mountain+Harrison+North Cobb
"Old Guard": McEachern and North Cobb
So South Cobb, Pebblebrook, and Campbell are in no growth areas? McEachern is unusual in that it has an endowment, but that doesn't seem to help their ranking.
Last edited by MathmanMathman; 01-08-2012 at 02:48 PM..
I had a feeling that would be coming. Guess we'll call Walton "Middle-Age" guard.
I think Wheeler opened in 1966 and less than 10 years later they had to build Walton. Originally, Walton had a strong Vo-Tech program with electronics, care repair shop etc. I'm guessing with its present stature it's mostly college preparatory now.
And I suppose Wheeler was a spawn of Marietta and Sprayberry?
So South Cobb, Pebblebrook, and Campbell are in no growth areas? McEachern is unusual in that it has an endowment, but that doesn't seem to help their ranking.
Yes, Walton opened in 1975. Lassiter 1981, Pope 1987. I think Kell is 2003.
Walton and Sprayberry had vo-tech programs through the mid/late 1990's. Students from Lassiter and Pope could actually take a bus to go take a class in the programs (a 2-hour block). I am not sure if the programs are still in existence.
Well, South Cobb was the first part of Cobb County to develop "suburbanally." It was spawned from the white flight from West and Southwest Atlanta in the 1950's and 1960's. So the growth in this area happened back then. There was actually a student population decline--in the early 1990's, Wills High was closed and merged with Campbell.
There is defintely growth in South Cobb now though.
What has hurt McEachern the most was the redistricting controversy when they built Hillgrove. Hillgrove siphoned off all of the upper-middle/upper class areas just north of McEachern. The county actually wanted to draw a balance between the school districts, but bad people in Psycho Mill, I mean Echo Mill, (and other neighborhoods) used state rep Earl Ehrhart to get the districts drawn to their liking--even though Echo Mill is closer to McEachern and the whole area in question is equal distance from Hillgrove and McEachern.
I don't know what spawned Wheeler...and I don't know how they differentiated back then (when districting) between the city schools (Marietta) and county schools (Sprayberry). I do believe it was more fluid.
I've been looking into the new zoning for Peachtree Ridge and Duluth High School over the weekend. I read that the U.S. Department of Education of Civil Rights was investigating if there was any deliberate racial discrimation against Hispanic and Black students in the redistricting. Do you have any finals conclusions were made in this investigation?
Another questions i wanted to ask if there are any higher end home subdivisions (built in 2004 and newer) near Chattahoochee elementary school?
Atltjl, typing from my iPhone. I now know why you concerned about the future of Gwinnett place mall as this entire area is zoned for Duluth high school. It is really sad. Even when I visited Atlanta in 2006 the Gwinnett place mall area wasn't that bad, but in the last 5 years the area just seemed to go down hill. I am hoping this not happen. If you start seeing Korean night clubs, more sketchy massage / karaoke come into gwinnett place area I would get concerned as crime and gang activity would rise and even consider moving up more north. One of my indian neighbors who just moved to may street moved from the Duluth high cluster. He was telling me he felt that Duluth high is just
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL
There was a recent redistricting and Peachtree Ridge pretty much got a huge victory. People in the Duluth cluster are upset because they got more free lunch kids from local apartments and Peachtree Ridge got to keep some better neighborhoods. That was fairly recent, though, and may not have come into play for this ranking.
I'm worried about Duluth high school. It seems like it's still pretty good, but Gwinnett county constantly craps on it. It's almost like they WANT it to decline, or they are just sacrificing it to keep nearby schools high quality. The good news is the people of Duluth are not a quiet bunch and will not go silently into the night, so the fight for Duluth high school may help raise the ranking in future years. This is the same community that kept out a Super Wal-mart!!! (which ironically enough, probably would have been districted for Peachtree Ridge, but I don't know the exact borders). Who else can say they did that?
Anyway, going to a good high school makes a huge difference. Kids who succeed at lousy high schools may not lose out on college admissions, but there are many more hurdles to succeeding at such schools. Success at them also isn't as good a predictor of success in college. Kids who go to high quality schools and take a lot of AP classes are much more likely not to freak out when they get to college and screw up because they are already used to rigorous coursework.
As anybody who has read Outliers knows, success is often a result of luck and the opportunities that are available due to being in the right place at the right time. Kids at highly ranked schools have better access to knowledgable teachers, better equipment, better classes, and are in an environment where academic success is rewarded instead of considered uncool. It's not impossible for a kid to get a great education at a poorly performing school, but it's much easier at a high performing one. You are setting your child up for more success by picking a good school for him or her.
Also, let's not forget about networking! We all know in the real world who you know is as important as what you know....so kids that go to good schools have stronger networks of successful professionals to tap into later in life. They also have better bands, drinks, and appetizers at their high school reunions.
I'm a fan of good schools. They may not be the end all, be all for predicting success, but I think they play very influential roles. They also keep housing values up and build a sense of community. A community that makes investment in education and the future for its children understands how to build a good community and shows a sense of having the correct priorities.
Things being relatively equal (score range {not exact score}, course load, extracurriculars, etc.)...a student from a more socioeconomically diverse/mixed school would have the edge over a student from East Cobb, North Fulton, Parkview-Brookwood, etc...
I don't doubt what you say is correct, but I am curious why that would be the case? I grew up in NYC and went to public school with people of various races, religions, and economic status. How does just being in a building with people who are different doesn't make you better able to handle an academic course load or be a better student body citizen? I guess I just reject this notion that coming from a more "diverse" school in and of itself is somehow better. Now, if the student did something that was in some way related to the demographics of the school, and that demonstrated leadership or another trait that was pertinent, then great.
Just the mere fact that one student comes from a school that has more black and poor people and one student comes from a more affluent and less minorities should make absolutely no difference to college admissions. The fact that it does is a shame.
I do think that universities and colleges aiming to have a "diversified" entering freshman class are trying to preempt any accusations of bias against any particular groups and probably are suffering from guilt. I mean are there any demonstrated advantages to having a diversified class as opposed to basing it on merit alone? These institutions are in fact engaging in discrimination based on race, gender, creed, national-origin, and socio-economic standing based on past injustices and present disadvantages. Seems hypocritical for these institutions to pontificate against and yet practice discrimination.
I do think that universities and colleges aiming to have a "diversified" entering freshman class are trying to preempt any accusations of bias against any particular groups and probably are suffering from guilt. I mean are there any demonstrated advantages to having a diversified class as opposed to basing it on merit alone? These institutions are in fact engaging in discrimination based on race, gender, creed, national-origin, and socio-economic standing based on past injustices and present disadvantages. Seems hypocritical for these institutions to pontificate against and yet practice discrimination.
But what is merit, Mathman? Is it exclusively SAT scores and GPA, in your opinion? College admissions also take into account extracurricular participation, and teacher recommendations. Is it discrimination to count an Eagle Scout or Honor Society President or hard-working service project worker more deserving than a student with slightly better grades who didn't do any of those things? What about the athletes and artists?
I suspect you think it's fine for Harvard et al. to favor excellent athletes, Eagle Scouts, etc. If they also favor "under-represented minorities" what's the difference, really?
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Excellent stuff, Mishap (unfortunately I wasn't allowed to rep you).
