atlanta city limits versus jacksonville city limits (Dunwoody, Kennesaw: real estate, condo)

[Saintmarks]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

however, as downtown atlanta became more populated by african americans as whites moved to the suburbs, the issue of race was the reason, i think the primary reason that atlanta stopped annexing new areas— the white population wouldn't allow it. after that came mismanagement and more mismanagement and now atlanta is starting to get a foothold again.

I think the inverse argument can be made just as easily. As Atlanta became majority-minority in the 60s and 70s, black officials were concerned with losing their newfound power base by annexing white suburban areas and decided to stand pat.

The reason Sandy Springs has fought so long to incorporate was a fear of being annexed by Atlanta, but I believe there was a lack of desire by the city to annex Sandy Springs because the black vote would have been diluted.

Not race baiting here, just my recollection of what happened. Newsboy made the same type of observation on a similar thread recently.

[Saintmarks]

Originally Posted by WanderingImport

Unfortunately true. Too bad Georgia doesn't run like Texas. It's like those people that moved out of the "corrupt" city of Atlanta and the corruption followed them to the suburbs. Perhaps to a somewhat lesser extent, but give it time.

I don't think there is anything less corrupt or more corrupt here in Texas, just that counties don't provide municipal services. Thus the city limits for the core cities as well as the suburbs are much, much larger here than in Atlanta which is a similar sized metro area.

White flight has happened here in DFW just like it happened in Atlanta. Folks just moved into incorporated suburban cities instead of unincorporated areas.

[WanderingImport]

Originally Posted by Saintmarks

I don't think there is anything less corrupt or more corrupt here in Texas, just that counties don't provide municipal services. Thus the city limits for the core cities as well as the suburbs are much, much larger here than in Atlanta which is a similar sized metro area.

White flight has happened here in DFW just like it happened in Atlanta. Folks just moved into incorporated suburban cities instead of unincorporated areas.

Wasn't trying to say Texas had less corruption than Georgia. I suppose I mixed those in together unintentionally.

I meant to say that Texas' way of city development & annexing seemed to work better than Georgia's county system providing resources.
As far as the corruption is concerned, Atlanta has the bad perception of being a corrupted incorporated mess and people have been trying to get out for decades into the suburbs. Unfortunately, along with the flight into the suburbs, it is just bringing all the problems with them and not really giving much, if any, solution to the real underlying problem.

[Saintmarks]

Originally Posted by WanderingImport

Wasn't trying to say Texas had less corruption than Georgia. I suppose I mixed those in together unintentionally.

I meant to say that Texas' way of city development & annexing seemed to work better than Georgia's county system providing resources.
As far as the corruption is concerned, Atlanta has the bad perception of being a corrupted incorporated mess and people have been trying to get out for decades into the suburbs. Unfortunately, along with the flight into the suburbs, it is just bringing all the problems with them and not really giving much, if any, solution to the real underlying problem.

The City of Dallas is very, very similar to Atlanta. The northern half of both has the old weatlh. The southern half is minority. The schools are by and large avoided by whites (with a couple of trendy intown locations excepted... the Woodrow Wilson cluster in Lakewood is similar to the Grady cluster in Midtown/Morningside). Most whites as well as most minorities that do not fall into the extremely poor or the uber wealthy head to the suburbs in both.

The only difference I see between the two is on a map. If one looked at a map of metro Atlanta and saw the scattered suburbs in the big sea of unincorporated DeKalb, Cobb, Gwinett, Clayton, Henry, Cherokee, etc, etc, one would think that Atlanta was not very built out. Hardly the truth in reality.

A map of Metro Dallas Fort Worth would look like a multi colored quilt in comparison, no unincorporated areas in an area about 60 mile wide by 40 miles top to bottom.

Again, just no municipal services provided by the county in Texas. In Georgia, the counties got into the municipal service business for some reason or the other in the post war suburban boom. Thus, when you look at a map of metro Atlanta, where you see the areas between Atlanta and Marietta and Lawrenceville and Jonesboro that are not colored in by a suburbs city limits, it really should show those areas shaded in and the remainder of each county should really read City of DeKalb, City of Cobb, City of Gwinnett. That is what in essence they are.

[cqholt]

I think the City of Atlanta needs to start annexing again and grab up most of the unincorporated lands ITP, if an area does not want to be annexed then it must create a city of be annexed into an existing city. This will cut down on the county governments inefficiency. I live in the City of Atlanta and am quiet happy with the current management of the city. I think mayor Reed has done a wonderful job and just hope he doesn't jump ship for Washington.

[JoeP]

I don't think that's possible since the city is landlocked. It's incredibly unlikely that the city will expand its footprint anytime soon. At least it got Buckhead. The city has what 132 square miles, which is still a lot more land than Boston, Pittsburgh, and SF have. In fact you can add up all 3 of those cities, and almost fit them in Atlanta's city limits.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by Saintmarks

I think the inverse argument can be made just as easily. As Atlanta became majority-minority in the 60s and 70s, black officials were concerned with losing their newfound power base by annexing white suburban areas and decided to stand pat.

The reason Sandy Springs has fought so long to incorporate was a fear of being annexed by Atlanta, but I believe there was a lack of desire by the city to annex Sandy Springs because the black vote would have been diluted.

Not race baiting here, just my recollection of what happened. Newsboy made the same type of observation on a similar thread recently.

Good points, Saintmarks.

It's also worth remembering that the 1952 annexation was about a lot more than just Buckhead. Buckhead was only about 25% of it -- much larger areas on the south, west and northwest were also brought into the city limits at that time.

There were additional large annexations on the west side throughout the 50s, 60s and 70s. A couple of good sized areas off Cascade were annexed just a few years ago. So it's not as if the city has been sitting on its hands in terms of annexation for the last 60 years.

Likewise, there has been an effort to create new cities in unincorporated South Fulton as well as in North Fulton. See my post below regarding State Sen. Horacena Tate (who represents Buckhead, West Midtown Buckhead and most of west and SW Atlanta) urging the formation of a new city of South Fulton.

//www.city-data.com/forum/atlan...l#post18665063

[cqholt]

Why does the City of Atlanta not annex Fulton Industrial Blvd south of I-20 and get tax revenue from the industrial along the river?

[Saintmarks]

Originally Posted by cqholt

Why does the City of Atlanta not annex Fulton Industrial Blvd south of I-20 and get tax revenue from the industrial along the river?

This does make sense. Atlanta and the south Fulton cities should divvie up (is that a real word or something we grew up saying in my family?) the rest of unincorporated Fulton and let the Fulton County government shrink in its scope as all land would be in one city or another. Same for DeKalb. Let Brookhaven incorporate along with Tucker and then let the rest of the cities divide what is left, let each city provide the local services and let DeKalb County get out of the municipal services business. If Gwinnett and Cobb get as unwieldy and inefficient in their county governments, let them follow suit as well.

[cqholt]

City of Atlanta annexation map 1847-2007:GIS Image/ Map Catalog
Use the Annexation group.