Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Georgia > Atlanta
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 12-27-2012, 11:52 AM
 
2,530 posts, read 4,752,134 times
Reputation: 2053

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by aries4118 View Post
Moreover...

Why do so many have to think "either or..."...???
I think some posters forget that this is a metro area of 5.5 million residents:

#1 There is no room for EVERYONE to move out of the suburbs and intown. Even if they tried, the intown neighborhoods would be so transformed they would lose many of the features that make them desirable. We would become one huge downtown area

#2 It is silly to think that all 5.5 million residents are a homogeneous population that likes the exact same style of living, neighborhood ect. If only it were that way, we would easily all agree on how to fix the transportation and development issues in the area.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-27-2012, 12:06 PM
 
16,643 posts, read 29,340,573 times
Reputation: 7567
Quote:
Originally Posted by lorilove View Post
I think some posters forget that this is a metro area of 5.5 million residents:

#1 There is no room for EVERYONE to move out of the suburbs and intown. Even if they tried, the intown neighborhoods would be so transformed they would lose many of the features that make them desirable. We would become one huge downtown area

#2 It is silly to think that all 5.5 million residents are a homogeneous population that likes the exact same style of living, neighborhood ect. If only it were that way, we would easily all agree on how to fix the transportation and development issues in the area.

Yep. So true.

And I think all communities (urban, inner suburb, mid-suburb, outer suburb, exurb, semi-rural/rural) can/should all strive for the common themes of sustainability, walkability {as appropriate}, public transportation {as appropriate}, parks/conservation, strong schools, safety, arts/recreation, health, and good public services.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-28-2012, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
166 posts, read 324,744 times
Reputation: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by aries4118 View Post
And I think all communities (urban, inner suburb, mid-suburb, outer suburb, exurb, semi-rural/rural) can/should all strive for the common themes of sustainability, walkability {as appropriate}, public transportation {as appropriate}, parks/conservation, strong schools, safety, arts/recreation, health, and good public services.
Well put, though personally I can't imagine walkability being inappropriate for any neighborhood other than one in an agriculture-heavy area (I'm biased, though).

The whole urban/suburban divide becomes less relevant every year as places like Roswell and many others in the 'suburbs' move toward building walkable town centers.

Newton County is a good example of what can happen in the suburbs with addressing the worst offenses of sprawl -- it's adopted a comprehensive economic development and growth plan that aims to protect disappearing countryside and address traffic.

Suburbs haven't cornered the market on car-dependency and traffic, and urban cores (Atlanta is, unfortunately, a good example) aren't entirely walkable. Good and bad development can happen anywhere. And yes, I do define neighborhoods that rely solely on cars for mobility as 'bad development' -- that's just my own uber-urbanist bias.

I grew up in East Cobb and my parents still live there. There definitely are pockets where neighborhoods are largely made up of people aging in place (like my parents) and those might be problem spots in the future when it comes to real estate value and the general strength of communities. But the area is really varied and there are younger people living there now who don't necessarily embrace the same kind of built environment that dominated growth in East Cobb during my childhood in the 1970s-80s.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-28-2012, 10:27 AM
 
Location: East Snobb
229 posts, read 472,375 times
Reputation: 212
Keep in mind that most people who live in the 'burbs want to be there. I love the city...I like VISITING the city. I like that there are lots of things to do, but there is no way in bloody hell I'd live downtown. No way, no how. I work on the west side of Cobb and live in east Cobb and my commute is a taxing 20-25 minutes...so I don't have any complaints on the traffic. If I want to go to the city, I can hop on 75 and be there in about 30 minutes or if I need to go to the airport, it's about 45 minutes by car or an hour of I take Marta. But...I rarely have to leave the county. Most things I need are there and best of all, my lot is almost 3/4 of an acre so people aren't living on top of one another. I live about a mile deep in the neighborhood, so it's as close as to "living in the country" that I would like to live. Plus, schools are great, but that's been mentioned.

Don't assume everyone wants to live downtown. Plus, with the new "appropriate" development going on in east Cobb, I hardly think it's going to be doomed.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-28-2012, 10:45 AM
 
31,995 posts, read 36,569,764 times
Reputation: 13254
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyEng View Post
Keep in mind that most people who live in the 'burbs want to be there. I love the city...I like VISITING the city. I like that there are lots of things to do, but there is no way in bloody hell I'd live downtown. No way, no how.
I can't think of any city, anywhere, at any time, where everybody wanted to live downtown.

However, your comments raise an important point. While the vast majority of people prefer to live and work in the suburbs and are perfectly happy to spend most of their time there, many also like having the amenities that a big city offers. They may only come into the city proper a few times a year, but they like having it there.

For example, if you look at the tags on cars at most intown festivals, or at major city parks, concerts, shopping centers, restaurants, museums, sporting events, etc., a large percentage will be from counties other than Fulton.

I fully appreciate that most people prefer the suburban lifestyle, but I wish there were a better way of sharing resources so that residents of the city proper aren't left to tote the load by themselves.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-28-2012, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,334 posts, read 25,996,941 times
Reputation: 3990
Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
I fully appreciate that most people prefer the suburban lifestyle, but I wish there were a better way of sharing resources so that residents of the city proper aren't left to tote the load by themselves.
Not a criticism, just curious: What "load" do city residents have to lift that you think the suburbs should help with?

Since the city gains sizable tax benefits of having businesses and recreational facilities in the city, and since city residents gain the benefit of convenient transportation from systems like MARTA, I would think there is plenty of compensation for those types of expenditures already.

Don't forget that the suburbs provide resources that city residents take advantage of as well. It isn't a one-way street by any stretch.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-28-2012, 12:38 PM
 
31,995 posts, read 36,569,764 times
Reputation: 13254
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcsteiner View Post
Not a criticism, just curious: What "load" do city residents have to lift that you think the suburbs should help with?
Well, how about these, rc?

-- Wear and tear and maintenance of city parks
-- Use of city water and sewer
-- Additional traffic on city streets and consequent need for additional maintenance
-- Additional traffic and parking burdens on intown neighborhoods
-- Additional police services
-- Additional clean up and solid waste disposal
-- Air pollution


Now, I agree that major city parks like Piedmont and Chastain are privately funded. Likewise with facilities like the Arts Center, the Aquarium, Fernbank and the High and other museums, the Opera, the Ballet, Zoo Atlanta, Lakewood, and so forth. But the vast majority of those funds come from city residents.

Some non-city visitors may spend money at intown merchants and restaurants, but it's hardly as if that money flows directly into city coffers.

I'm sure there are some resources in the suburban areas that are used by city residents but it seems clear to me that the burden falls heavily on the city proper.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-28-2012, 12:48 PM
 
2,530 posts, read 4,752,134 times
Reputation: 2053
Most of the city events that I go to are revenue generating in one way or another and a good portion of that revenue pays for the additional city and police services.

For instance, the Peachtree Road Race. There is a race registration fee where much of that money pays for these services. Even if an event is so called free - like an arts festival, the vendors with booths are paying a registration fee which again pays for these additional services.

Yes there is a burden on local neighborhoods as far as traffic and parking on their local streets but most people I know that live near Piedmont Park pay a premium for the location because they LOVE being near the activities. I assure you the activities would cease to exist if they were not able to draw the crowds from all over Atlanta, the local residents themselves could not sustain them otherwise.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-28-2012, 12:54 PM
 
16,643 posts, read 29,340,573 times
Reputation: 7567
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATL Urbanist View Post
Well put, though personally I can't imagine walkability being inappropriate for any neighborhood other than one in an agriculture-heavy area (I'm biased, though).

...

This is what I believe as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ATL Urbanist View Post
...The whole urban/suburban divide becomes less relevant every year as places like Roswell and many others in the 'suburbs' move toward building walkable town centers.

...
Yes.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ATL Urbanist View Post
...Suburbs haven't cornered the market on car-dependency and traffic, and urban cores (Atlanta is, unfortunately, a good example) aren't entirely walkable. Good and bad development can happen anywhere. And yes, I do define neighborhoods that rely solely on cars for mobility as 'bad development' -- that's just my own uber-urbanist bias.

...
True.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ATL Urbanist View Post
...

I grew up in East Cobb and my parents still live there. There definitely are pockets where neighborhoods are largely made up of people aging in place (like my parents) and those might be problem spots in the future when it comes to real estate value and the general strength of communities. But the area is really varied and there are younger people living there now who don't necessarily embrace the same kind of built environment that dominated growth in East Cobb during my childhood in the 1970s-80s.
I grew in East Cobb too.

I think East Cobb is ripe for implementing walkability. Just adding sidewalks makes a huge difference. When I was visting there once, I was able to walk to places that I never would have dreamed of as a kid. Growing up, we would have to map out circuitious bike-routes that kept us on neighborhood streets.

East Cobb is very stable and very sought-after...I would love to see more "village nodes" and walkability implemented in such a fashionable place.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-28-2012, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
166 posts, read 324,744 times
Reputation: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by aries4118 View Post
Growing up, we would have to map out circuitious bike-routes that kept us on neighborhood streets.
Ha -- I had the same experience. In fact, the two main drivers of my urbanist beliefs and downtown Atlanta residency are 1.) the trouble I had as a teen getting around East Cobb on a bike safely (and I don't think Trickum Road is any safer to bike these days, sadly); 2.) watching all the beautiful farmland and forests that still existed in the 70s & 80s get developed as subdivisions and strip malls.

I think you're right that there's a lot of pedestrian improvement in Cobb and the impetus to do more.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Georgia > Atlanta

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top