WHY is the Westside getting so much development or will get so much? (Atlanta: sales, 2013)

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by CCATL

I've always thought the Westside is similar in appearance to Castleberry Hill - lots of empty warehouses, lofts, etc. Except, I think Castleberry Hill has the infrastructure - street grid, transportation access, and pedestrian friendliness - that should have made THAT neighborhood the hip/trendy place that the westside has become. Unfortunately, Castleberry Hill is located downtown, which is seen as less desirable. I'm not saying that I don't like what the Westside is becoming, it's obviously great for that area, but I think infrastructure is going to end up holding it back, which wouldn't have happened if all this development was in Castleberry Hill.

Extending the downtown streetcar up Marietta Street/Howell Mill to 17th Street, then Arts center would be the prefect scenario.
A crosstown connector via North Ave.

[testa50]

I feel like buses could serve the neighborhood just fine. I would propose three routes: Midtown via 10th St, Arts Center via 17th St, and Five Points via Marietta. Run 2 dedicated buses on each one of these routes, which will probably lead to ~15 minute headways. Run them clockwise around the loop created by Brady and Howell Mill Road.

This would be pretty inexpensive and, imo, pretty much solve the transit problem. You'd have a bus coming that could take you to one of three MARTA stations roughly every five minutes, and direct, frequent access to lots of walkable parts of the city. You could dovetail the 17th Street route with the Atlantic Station shuttle.

[fzx]

Originally Posted by ATLJR

I think you have to look at each area distinctively. The Westside has / had larger, underused lots ready for development with little in the way of obstacles and despite its ramshackle appearance in certain areas, tends to be a bit more well off and separated from "rough" neighborhoods. They've had proven success with retail, restaurants, and other recent residential developments so its inherently less risk. When you look at the Edgewood corridor however, you have a few obstacles currently in your way. One, there's not a lot of huge lots ready for large scale multi-family development. There are a few, just not a lot, and some redevelopments have been hampered by historical preservationist. There's also an element still found around Edgewood that makes developers a little cautious and how the Auburn Glenn Apartments have turned out probably doesn't provide a lot of confidence to would-be developers.

It will definitely come though, because as you mentioned there's too many positives for the neighborhood.

Well said. Large developers need huge lots to support their revenues/sales growth targets. That is why we have one-after-another subdivisions pops up across the country. Inner cities have their appeals, but the places are more for small develpoers with cooperations needed or high-rises.

In this case, massive lands are available and cheap in the westside while absolute distance to midtown or major highways are not that far. In addition, an existing stronghold for restaurants and some retailers draw first-time home buyers who want some vibes of the city and new houses without considering too much about schools yet.

Of course, the downside is the massive cheap land. When selling a house, the owner will always compete with new builts. And we are not sure about if these first home owners will stick around....

[kferq]

Originally Posted by Ant131531

It's just strange to me that this area is still getting a lot of development like Elan Westside, but the Edgewood Ave. corridor right outside of downtown hasn't really gotten any. That area is not only in a cohesive urban environment and connected directly to the core, but it has MARTA and a streetcar coming to the neighborhood, but we have yet to hear of ANY new big developments in that area. Hell, if they were to fix that neighborhood up, I might want to live there in 5-10 years.

I think the comparison of the Westside is not to the Edgewood Ave corridor, but to the booming parts of the Old Fourth Ward. There are many areas circling downtown that have the type of buildings and rents that drive artistic businesses (Edgewood and Castleberry Hill for example), but the difference in Westside and Old Fourth Ward is the proximity to income wealthy residential areas. Both are communities near wealthy residential areas (Buckhead, Virginia-Highland/Morningside, Ansley Park) and the destination restaurants, galleries, and shops pull residents from those wealthy areas. Many people have commented how many Buckhead people they see in White Provision and Westside restaurants. I see my neighbors from Morningside and Ansley Park in restaurants and shops in the Old Fourth Ward. In addition, the tourists and convention goers add to the the income of these businesses, but are not the primary target they way they are for many downtown and Castleberry Hill restaurants, galleries and shops. The reliability of the local residents spending patterns gives stability to the businesses. Once these attractive areas are established as destinations, the residential infill comes naturally, because the areas are also close to good jobs in midtown/downtown/Ga Tech/Atlantic Station. The apartment dwellers do not have as much disposable income as the wealthy homeowners, but they spend it in their new neighborhoods.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by testa50

I feel like buses could serve the neighborhood just fine. I would propose three routes: Midtown via 10th St, Arts Center via 17th St, and Five Points via Marietta. Run 2 dedicated buses on each one of these routes, which will probably lead to ~15 minute headways. Run them clockwise around the loop created by Brady and Howell Mill Road.

This would be pretty inexpensive and, imo, pretty much solve the transit problem. You'd have a bus coming that could take you to one of three MARTA stations roughly every five minutes, and direct, frequent access to lots of walkable parts of the city. You could dovetail the 17th Street route with the Atlantic Station shuttle.

Absolutely! An efficient, low fare bus network with frequent routes is hard to beat.

Rail can be a useful adjunct to transportation but it's hardly the sine qua non for urban development. Many of our most popular neighborhoods have zero or very limited rail access. Likewise, plenty of areas that have great rail access have languished for decades.

[waronxmas]

Originally Posted by testa50

I feel like buses could serve the neighborhood just fine. I would propose three routes: Midtown via 10th St, Arts Center via 17th St, and Five Points via Marietta. Run 2 dedicated buses on each one of these routes, which will probably lead to ~15 minute headways. Run them clockwise around the loop created by Brady and Howell Mill Road.

This would be pretty inexpensive and, imo, pretty much solve the transit problem. You'd have a bus coming that could take you to one of three MARTA stations roughly every five minutes, and direct, frequent access to lots of walkable parts of the city. You could dovetail the 17th Street route with the Atlantic Station shuttle.

I would agree. While the Westside is booming, there isn't a huge need for rapid transit line in that area. More frequent bus service or Streetcar service should be sufficient since at either end of the district there is access to MARTA rail.

[cqholt]

Have a rapid bus route(<10 minute headways during peak hours)running between Arts Center and Five Points.
Maybe brand the bus route, to attract more riders. I could see Tech students using it as well.

[AnsleyPark]

Originally Posted by cqholt

Have a rapid bus route(<10 minute headways during peak hours)running between Arts Center and Five Points.
Maybe brand the bus route, to attract more riders. I could see Tech students using it as well.

Didn't The Peach sorta do this?

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by AnsleyPark

Didn't The Peach sorta do this?

And its very busy. Same thing with the Memorial Drive semi-BRT. Its branded and runs very frequently. I could see the same thing to route 39 on Buford Hwy.

[MDAllstar]

Originally Posted by Ant131531

I keep hearing from people that the Westside is 'set to explode' over the next few years, but why?? I don't get the appeal to developers to develop a corridor that lacks any sort of transit, but buses. I've already been hearing that this area is becoming traffic ridden... It's a decent neighborhood, but without transit, it seems counter intuitive...you drive there and then walk around...basically, it's a neighborhood trying to be walkable, but still auto-oriented lol.

Anyways, yeah...thought maybe we could get a discussion on this area.

Are all the parking lots etc. spoken for in Midtown and Downtown ATL? It seems odd to me that all this development is happening outside the core while all those parking lots cover Midtown and the southern part of Downtown ATL. Are those parking lots etc. just in a holding pattern waiting for proposals to break ground? There is so much potential in Atlanta to have a legit urban node especially in Midtown, but it seems like development is spread around instead of concentrated.