MARTA eyeing major expansion up Georgia 400 corridor (Atlanta, Dallas: live, transport)

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by netdragon

It'll be the same old arguments they use in Cobb: They'll say it is a waste of their tax dollars, especially when the Fulton rate was just raised, then they'll talk about it increasing development which will cause more congestion and destroy the small-town feel, and then they'll start talking about it bringing crime and "undesirables". But it'll probably be mostly about tax and development. Furthermore, there's already a MARTA bus that runs up the shoulder (pretty quickly) and they'll argue that is good enough.

Runs along the shoulder along with general traffic during peak hours, so there is no advantage to running the bus in the shoulder.

[MattCW]

Originally Posted by netdragon

It'll be the same old arguments they use in Cobb: They'll say it is a waste of their tax dollars, especially when the Fulton rate was just raised, then they'll talk about it increasing development which will cause more congestion and destroy the small-town feel, and then they'll start talking about it bringing crime and "undesirables". But it'll probably be mostly about tax and development. Furthermore, there's already a MARTA bus that runs up the shoulder (pretty quickly) and they'll argue that is good enough.

You are assuming, and your assumptions are dead wrong. You've obviously never been to the public meetings, nor really looked through the comments that people in the area have said. Tax rates aren't an issue since no taxes would be raised, there is no small-town feel along GA-400, and they already have buses to "bring undesirables." This isn't Cobb County, and these people have been watching their taxes go to rail elsewhere for years so they're pretty much ready for it. Sure, you'll have a few loudmouths that can't help but whine, but fortunately, they are in the minority here.

[alco89]

Originally Posted by netdragon

It'll be the same old arguments they use in Cobb: They'll say it is a waste of their tax dollars, especially when the Fulton rate was just raised, then they'll talk about it increasing development which will cause more congestion and destroy the small-town feel, and then they'll start talking about it bringing crime and "undesirables". But it'll probably be mostly about tax and development. Furthermore, there's already a MARTA bus that runs up the shoulder (pretty quickly) and they'll argue that is good enough.

Nah, North Fulton is already paying for MARTA, so most of them are really saying "It's about time."

[Ray Ciss]

The dirty little secret regarding the whole Cobb /Braves development is that while its all about the benjamins for the Braves- naming rights that they would never gotten at The Ted- , our dear friends in the Cumberland SR 41/ Galleria area are just trying to compete with Perimeter Center. A little history : back in the day the Galleria Northwest Park area was known colloquially as "The Platinum Triangle" due to the real estate development interest in the area. The building of the Galleria was seen at the time as the crowning of the district as the king of the hill; what Buckhead considers itself today.

Well a funny thing happened on the way to the forum-MARTA- and the former Spruill Farm become Perimeter Center, the largest concentration of commercial office space in the Southeast, with a Class A mall adjacent thereto. So what to do?

Well now fast forward 20 years and here comes a chance for the Galleria/ Cumberland folks to dance their way out of their constrictions. Or so they thought. The suddenly cash rich Braves ( whose current management produced such hit projects as Dan Struggla and Derrick very Lowe) sold the Cobb County folks some magic beans: if you give us $400 million, we will lift your economic development to almost Perimeter Center levels. and without MARTA.
Anywho, so the story is still unfolding but don't get it twisted: the Cumberland / Galleria folks just want to be in the big leagues like Perimeter Center; they just chose the wrong team.

[magnetar]

Originally Posted by netdragon

It'll be the same old arguments they use in Cobb: They'll say it is a waste of their tax dollars, especially when the Fulton rate was just raised, then they'll talk about it increasing development which will cause more congestion and destroy the small-town feel, and then they'll start talking about it bringing crime and "undesirables". But it'll probably be mostly about tax and development. Furthermore, there's already a MARTA bus that runs up the shoulder (pretty quickly) and they'll argue that is good enough.

The Fulton property tax rate has literally nothing to do with MARTA; and the difference between communities who have already been paying the MARTA sales tax for going on four decades with limited services and communities who have never been willing to pay for MARTA couldn't be more vast. Every report I've seen of north Fulton public opinion is that it's late but welcome nonetheless.

[skbl17]

I still think it would make sense for the Cumberland CID itself to join MARTA, even if the rest of Cobb opts not to. Or does the state constitution ban CIDs from doing something like that (I'm no expert on state law, nor do I claim to be)?

- skbl17

[bu2]

Originally Posted by skbl17

I still think it would make sense for the Cumberland CID itself to join MARTA, even if the rest of Cobb opts not to. Or does the state constitution ban CIDs from doing something like that (I'm no expert on state law, nor do I claim to be)?

- skbl17

There's nothing in the state constitution, but the state would have to pass a bill to allow them to do that. And that wouldn't happen unless the Cobb representatives agreed to let it happen.

However it makes a lot of sense. Those people want it and the rest of Cobb doesn't, so they could join and the rest stay out.

[MattCW]

Originally Posted by bu2

There's nothing in the state constitution, but the state would have to pass a bill to allow them to do that. And that wouldn't happen unless the Cobb representatives agreed to let it happen.

However it makes a lot of sense. Those people want it and the rest of Cobb doesn't, so they could join and the rest stay out.

The problem I see however is backlash from the existing MARTA counties. Basically, you'd be saying that any little community that wants to finance the system can do so, so long as they completely finance the capital and O&M costs for the expansion. You would have the un-served areas, or severly under-served areas of Dekalb and Fulton screaming bloody murder that they should no longer have to contribute, and frankly, they would have a point. If this were an isolated area, then I could see that, like the airport station. Yes, it's in Clayton, but really, Clayton doesn't benefit from that station, but the airport does. More generally, let's say a sports stadium located just over a border, but in an otherwise remote area. The primary purpose of the line would be to bring people to the sports stadium and there wouldn't be a lot of people using that station to go elsewhere. So the people that benefit would pay. But in this case, a station in Cumberland would become a major transfer point for people in Cobb going to Atlanta, so maybe the benefit would be split about even. It was reported that of MARTA's sales tax earnings, about 40% comes from out-of-area people, in other words people spending money in Fulton and Dekalb. Adding a stop in Cumberland wouldn't significantly improve on either that percentage, or the raw rate, it would merely add a lot of people to the system, and would likely benefit Cobb far more than Fulton or Dekalb, while not adding revenue to the system as a whole.

So if Cumberland did this, it is possible the rest of the Fulton and Dekalb MARTA representatives would then turn on the GA-400 project (and I-20 East) and insist that the capital and O&M funds be generated locally such as from Roswell, Alpharetta, and North Point (CID?), something not desirable for this project.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by MattCW

The problem I see however is backlash from the existing MARTA counties. Basically, you'd be saying that any little community that wants to finance the system can do so, so long as they completely finance the capital and O&M costs for the expansion. You would have the un-served areas, or severly under-served areas of Dekalb and Fulton screaming bloody murder that they should no longer have to contribute, and frankly, they would have a point. If this were an isolated area, then I could see that, like the airport station. Yes, it's in Clayton, but really, Clayton doesn't benefit from that station, but the airport does. More generally, let's say a sports stadium located just over a border, but in an otherwise remote area. The primary purpose of the line would be to bring people to the sports stadium and there wouldn't be a lot of people using that station to go elsewhere. So the people that benefit would pay. But in this case, a station in Cumberland would become a major transfer point for people in Cobb going to Atlanta, so maybe the benefit would be split about even. It was reported that of MARTA's sales tax earnings, about 40% comes from out-of-area people, in other words people spending money in Fulton and Dekalb. Adding a stop in Cumberland wouldn't significantly improve on either that percentage, or the raw rate, it would merely add a lot of people to the system, and would likely benefit Cobb far more than Fulton or Dekalb, while not adding revenue to the system as a whole.

So if Cumberland did this, it is possible the rest of the Fulton and Dekalb MARTA representatives would then turn on the GA-400 project (and I-20 East) and insist that the capital and O&M funds be generated locally such as from Roswell, Alpharetta, and North Point (CID?), something not desirable for this project.

There's a lot of that childishness among area political leaders so you might be right.

But there is no reason MARTA has to admit whole counties. That's simply the way it has been done here. Its not done the same way everywhere. Both Dallas and Houston had individual cities and sections of unincorporated areas vote. There's no reason individual political units such as cities (or CIDS) couldn't join (although the odd way Georgia does its sales tax allocations complicates things).

Adding Cumberland would benefit current MARTA residents as there are a lot of jobs there that would be more accessible. And to the extent it could help on I-75 traffic, that would benefit MARTA residents. Cumberland generates a much higher % of Cobb's sales tax than it has of the population. That's why I don't think Cobb politicians would let it happen.

[flyonpa]

Originally Posted by MattCW

So if Cumberland did this, it is possible the rest of the Fulton and Dekalb MARTA representatives would then turn on the GA-400 project (and I-20 East) and insist that the capital and O&M funds be generated locally such as from Roswell, Alpharetta, and North Point (CID?), something not desirable for this project.

But the People of the GA-400 Projected Area have been paying the MARTA tax for 40+ years. Why would need to pay for capital and O&M when they been doing it for decades



Maybe they should ask for a refund of all the Capital money contributed but not spent to server North Fulton..