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Old 08-18-2015, 01:47 PM
 
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DC-Baltimore was 4th and then it dropped once they redefined MSAs.
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Old 08-18-2015, 02:15 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red John View Post
If Atlanta gets to a minimum of 90,000 people per year in growth (MSA wise) starting from the 2015 census estimates then it will take the 8th spot from Philadelphia by the 2020 census. If it does not get to 90,000 minimum it may take a year or two extra.

In 2006 the Philadelphia MSA was 4th in the United States; behind only New York, Los Angeles, and Chicago, respectively in the same order. In 2007 it was noted that the Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex had surpassed it, then in 2011 it was noted that Houston surpassed it, by now in 2015 Washington D.C. has already surpassed it (we'll officially get word in March next year; Washington D.C. was only behind by 17,000 people and in raw numbers is growing nearly 4.5 times more than Philadelphia annually), in 2017 Miami MSA will overtake it, and then finally three years later in 2020 Atlanta MSA will complete a 14 year process for Philadelphia MSA of going from 4th to 9th.

A place went from 4th to 9th in 14 years, literally well within my lifetime (I am 25) one of the country's top 5 premier cities fell out of favor in population ranks rapidly. In 2006 Philadelphia MSA also had the 4th largest GDP/economy in the United States too but it was surpassed by Houston, Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex, Washington D.C., and even by the much smaller San Francisco-Oakland in the years following 2006. Now the significantly smaller Boston MSA is also en-route to surpass the Philadelphia MSA GDP too.

Anyhow, this post isn't about Philadelphia, it is about Atlanta. Atlanta is moving up a spot, to 8th largest MSA and now the pressure is also on Atlanta to get to at least 8th largest MSA GDP and carry its weight too OR to surpass in GDP places it surpasses in population (Philadelphia MSA). That's how you move up the "importance" hierarchy and not just the population hierarchy.
Thanks for all your efforts Red John.

It is pretty incredible how fast it falls in the rankings. Much of it is from how many cities are close to being the same size currently, so Philadelphia still remains as strong as it is now.... just not growing as much.

If it was Pre-recession we would definitely would have made it for the 2020 census, but I find it doubtful now. It will take us a few years to recoup that sort of annual growth and we need to play catch up for the years we were under 90k. In the grand scheme of things it doesn't make much difference for any city what the ranking is by 2020.
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Old 08-18-2015, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Historic West End
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Since Phila is part of a Megapolis region I don't think they really care about MSA. None of those other cities regions are heavily populated like northeast

The Northeast is a powerhouse of density and economic output, producing 20% of the nation's GDP with 17% of the population on 2% of the nation's land area. Over the next generation, the Northeast will add 17 million new residents. This population growth will demand infrastructure investments and economic growth to accommodate these new residents while preserving quality of life.

Principal Cities: Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington D.C.
Population 2010: 52,332,123
Percent of U.S. Population: 17%
Population 2025: 58.4 million
Population 2050: 70.8 million
Projected Growth (2010 - 2050): 35.2% (18.4 million)
Gross Domestic Product (2010): $2.92 trillion
Percent of U.S. GDP (2010): 20%

Last edited by Atlwarrior; 08-18-2015 at 09:47 PM..
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Old 08-19-2015, 12:04 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlwarrior View Post
Since Phila is part of a Megapolis region I don't think they really care about MSA. None of those other cities regions are heavily populated like northeast
I'm not sure I agree. In many past discussions people from these cities seem to be more concerned with their city and city's region (msa), like we are are with ours.

I'll admit there are always complications in defining borders when reality is often a more blurred border, but Philly is still Philly. NYC is NYC. DC is DC. They care about their MSAs and people in DC aren't exactly commuting to NYC in a meaningful way. They are far enough detached from each other and they carry a great deal of local pride too.
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Old 08-19-2015, 07:49 AM
 
Location: Historic West End
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwkimbro View Post
I'm not sure I agree. In many past discussions people from these cities seem to be more concerned with their city and city's region (msa), like we are are with ours.

I'll admit there are always complications in defining borders when reality is often a more blurred border, but Philly is still Philly. NYC is NYC. DC is DC. They care about their MSAs and people in DC aren't exactly commuting to NYC in a meaningful way. They are far enough detached from each other and they carry a great deal of local pride too.
I know they definitely are separate when it comes to sports lol.
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Old 08-19-2015, 09:52 AM
 
34,581 posts, read 31,901,794 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwkimbro View Post
I'm not sure I agree. In many past discussions people from these cities seem to be more concerned with their city and city's region (msa), like we are are with ours.

I'll admit there are always complications in defining borders when reality is often a more blurred border, but Philly is still Philly. NYC is NYC. DC is DC. They care about their MSAs and people in DC aren't exactly commuting to NYC in a meaningful way. They are far enough detached from each other and they carry a great deal of local pride too.
That seems to be more of a concern, especially when you have a good number of shared outer suburbs between Philly and NYC and many are lumped in with NYC on a technicality, such as Trenton, NJ.
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Old 08-19-2015, 01:41 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
That seems to be more of a concern, especially when you have a good number of shared outer suburbs between Philly and NYC and many are lumped in with NYC on a technicality, such as Trenton, NJ.
no doubt. I have always wondered how many actual families there are where someone is long-commuting to NYC and someone else in the family is long-commuting into Philly.
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Old 08-20-2015, 12:15 AM
 
4,489 posts, read 4,818,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlwarrior View Post
Since Phila is part of a Megapolis region I don't think they really care about MSA. None of those other cities regions are heavily populated like northeast

The Northeast is a powerhouse of density and economic output, producing 20% of the nation's GDP with 17% of the population on 2% of the nation's land area. Over the next generation, the Northeast will add 17 million new residents. This population growth will demand infrastructure investments and economic growth to accommodate these new residents while preserving quality of life.

Principal Cities: Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington D.C.
Population 2010: 52,332,123
Percent of U.S. Population: 17%
Population 2025: 58.4 million
Population 2050: 70.8 million
Projected Growth (2010 - 2050): 35.2% (18.4 million)
Gross Domestic Product (2010): $2.92 trillion
Percent of U.S. GDP (2010): 20%
That's completely irrelevant, Philly is not, NY, Boston, Baltimore or DC. It has it own distinct identity as a place and metro.

Think of Metros as solar systems, The Star the city, the Planets as suburbs... and Megapolis as Galaxies, Being in a bigger Galaxy doesn't make a particular Solar Systems bigger.
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Old 08-20-2015, 07:58 AM
 
34,581 posts, read 31,901,794 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiatldal View Post
That's completely irrelevant, Philly is not, NY, Boston, Baltimore or DC. It has it own distinct identity as a place and metro.

Think of Metros as solar systems, The Star the city, the Planets as suburbs... and Megapolis as Galaxies, Being in a bigger Galaxy doesn't make a particular Solar Systems bigger.
But the dynamics are pretty different in the NE megalopolis than in any other region in the country because it's so interconnected. As was mentioned before, the metro boundaries can get pretty blurry, particularly between the outer 'burbs of Philly and NYC which are closer to each other than any of the other major cities of the corridor. Being in a megalopolis isn't everything, but it's not completely irrelevant either.
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Old 08-25-2015, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Tokyo, Japan
6,811 posts, read 9,225,447 times
Reputation: 8174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlwarrior View Post
Since Phila is part of a Megapolis region I don't think they really care about MSA. None of those other cities regions are heavily populated like northeast

The Northeast is a powerhouse of density and economic output, producing 20% of the nation's GDP with 17% of the population on 2% of the nation's land area. Over the next generation, the Northeast will add 17 million new residents. This population growth will demand infrastructure investments and economic growth to accommodate these new residents while preserving quality of life.

Principal Cities: Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington D.C.
Population 2010: 52,332,123
Percent of U.S. Population: 17%
Population 2025: 58.4 million
Population 2050: 70.8 million
Projected Growth (2010 - 2050): 35.2% (18.4 million)
Gross Domestic Product (2010): $2.92 trillion
Percent of U.S. GDP (2010): 20%
Incorrect.

Being in the Northeast Corridor has done nothing for Philadelphia. When analysts, scholars, researchers and other like minds get together and rate cities in multiple qualities, including importance, they only look at the metropolitan area and/or CSA area (sometimes).

How else would you explain why in key rankings that Philadelphia is left off entirely or placed extremely low? Several places have surpassed Philadelphia, on the global level, and population along with GDP growth play a huge part in it.

A.T. Kearney:
https://www.atkearney.com/documents/...5-2a3f14f0da3a

More current one:
https://www.atkearney.com/news-media...ies-2015/10192

Jones Lang LaSalle:
http://www.jll.com/Research/jll-city...ember-2013.pdf

World Economic Forum:
http://www3.weforum.org/docs/WEF_Glo...rt_2014-15.pdf

CityLab:
The World

The Economist:
Hot Spots - The Global City Competitiveness Index - URENIO Watch

Z/Yen:
Global Financial Centres Index

Global Analysis of World Cities Network (GaWC):
GaWC Research Bulletin 381

Reputation Institute:
Cities With Best Reputations: Vancouver, Montreal In Top 10 As Toronto Drops Out

Foreign Investment:
http://www.afire.org/Files/2015%20Su...S%20Cities.pdf

City Brand Index - Simon Anholt (the world's authority on city branding for 16 years now):
Simon Anholt - Research - City Brands Index

Newgeography:
http://www.newgeography.com/content/...uential-cities

If I had more time, I literally could go on and list at least 15-20 more articles by different think-tanks, researchers, analysts, corporations, or scholars such as these, literally.

So, tell me something, when you see the other Northeast Corridor cities like Boston, New York, and Washington DC routinely rank in every measurement for importance and influence in the world, where is the "Northeast Corridor" to help Philadelphia get its name on these rankings and/or lists?

I'm not saying Philadelphia is an irrelevant city, because it is not, but it used to be one of the top 5 population centers in America - today it is not. It used to be one of the top 5, undeniable, most important cities in America and used to routinely rank high among analysts and researchers about 15 years. Today it does not and honestly there's a reason for why that is.

So where's the Northeast Corridor to help it? The reality is that several places have surpassed it in population, GDP, and importance. That is the reality, honestly. That is what happens when you stay at status quo for a long time while places under you boom away, they eventually pass you and many have.
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