Malls Washed Up? Not Quite Yet: Ideas for Metro Atlanta (Lenox: homes, purchases)

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by Clayton white guy

I was at Northlake Easter shopping last April. The mall was not VACANT! (For a peek on what a VACANT mall looks like, go a few miles farther up 285, turn onto 85, north, go several miles, get off at the Pleasant Hill Road exit, turn left and make a right. Go into any mall entrance at Gwinnett Place, look around, THAT is a vacant mall. ANY other mall in Metro Atlanta positively teems with commerce by comparison: North Dekalb, Northlake, South Dekalb, Greenbriar, Mall West End, even the mush derided Southlake near me in Morrow) Now, perhaps the poster meant that Northlake, North Dekalb, or another mall from the above list is lacking the stores that he or she prefers, that is an entirely different argument than stating a shopping center that is over 90% leased is empty. The Davison's/ Macy's/Rich's/Rich's-Macy's/ back to Macy's at Northlake is not/ has not ever been the premier store in any chain occupying that building despite the overall affluence of the surrounding community for what ever reason. Myself and many other family and friends in the area find The North Dekalb Macy's (Rich's) to be a treasure trove of retail virtue compared to Northlake Macy's (Davison's) not compared to larger stores at Lenox Square (Rich's old flagship store) or Perimeter (always Rich's "second" store in the Atlanta area). Perhaps proximity to Perimeter and Lenox/ Phipps has been the "problem" with Northlake marketing for decades. Now whether newer Stonecrest having the same anchors as Northlake Mall may be their problem for drawing from further east and south (South Gwinnett, Southeast Dekalb, Rockdale, and Newton Counties) may be a point; I do feel that having Perimeter as a cut off a couple exits up 285 negatively impacts their trade area to the north and west. I also must point out that some one said that "Lenox Square/ Phipps Plaza/ Perimeter Mall/ North Point Mall all coexist happily in the Ga 400 corridor. This is untrue. The three malls battle it out for dominance and North Point usually comes out on the bottom. North Point IS a nice mall, but it is also the most middle class of the three. Lenox Square/ Phipps Plaza has obviously won because they have several upscale stores that the other two do not, especially in anchors (Sak's, Neiman Marcus, Bloomingdale's, and even a much derided but still successful Belk flagship store for all of us peasants LOL) Perimeter comes in second because they have a Nordstrom like Phipps and a Van Maur (a nice store that reminds me of a midwestern Parisian) like North Point. Perhaps Northlake should take a page out of the North Point playbook and be the VERY best middle class mall in the northeastern suburbs. The Penny's, Sear's, and Khoel's are a good first step (although they could be remodeled and upgraded to represent the very best those mid range chains have to offer) and the Macy's need to be raised at least to the same level of North Dekalb, Southlake, North Point, or Mall of Georgia (I have never been to Stonecrest Macy's, so I am uncertain of their merchandise mix) Then, Northlake can make it by being DIFFERENT! Maybe even put a Costco in the parking lot. My point is Northlake is nice enough, but it could be so much more. Families do like a mid range merchandising mix; luxury is over represented in the near northeast side!

This.

[JoeTarheel]

Originally Posted by Craziaskowboi

Didn't Atlanta have the most overbuilt commercial real estate market in the United States when the economy collapsed in 2008? That would explain all the half-empty new retail buildings I saw for years. I remember a new strip mall being built right off GA 316 near Winder back in 2007, and the place was half-empty until a year or two ago. I think there might still be a storefront or two that have never been used there.

As for the malls, the reason why Atlanta has a lot of dying malls these days is because of leapfrog development, which directly contributed to the overbuilt commercial real estate market. I remember going Christmas shopping at Gwinnett Place Mall back in 1996, and the place was hopping. The Mall of Georgia is nice, but it was the beginning of the end of Gwinnett Place Mall. Then there's Sugarloaf Mills (née Discover mills), which always seemed kind of pointless to me. There was never a need for three malls along 10 miles of I-85, especially since the I-85 corridor isn't filthy rich like the GA 400 corridor. That's the only reason why Lenox Square, Perimeter Mall and Northpoint Mall are all doing well despite their proximity, because the aggregate income is so high in those areas that it'd take a lot more to saturate the market.

The dying malls should either be razed or adapted into "ethnic" malls. I think Gwinnett Place Mall could make a good Asian mall, given the large Asian population in Gwinnett County. Otherwise, tear them down or downscale them to "power centers" until there's some equilibrium in the market. And stop with the leapfrog development. There has to be a limit to how far out the urbanized area of Atlanta spreads anyway.

I don't believe that the concept of the shopping mall is dying, though. First of all, people gotta meet somewhere, especially in the suburbs. Second of all, online shopping can only complement mall shopping, not replace it. Sometimes you need to try clothes on before you buy them, or get advice from a human being about which product to buy. Online shopping is far too impersonal. Third of all, if malls were going out of style, then all malls would have declining profits, even the upscale ones. There's no evidence of that.

Atlanta has a lot of dying malls? I know of a couple, but not a lot of them. Gwinnett Place is probably the most prominent, and a couple have already been laid to rest (Shannon, Avondale, Cobb Center) but the rest seem to be okay as far as I know. Even North DeKalb seems to be in the process of coming back to life from what I've read.

[0nyxStation]

Originally Posted by aries4118

Malls Washed Up? Not Quite Yet: Ideas for Metro Atlanta...

Malls Washed Up? Not Quite Yet | Newgeography.com



Enjoy!

Suburban Malls need to die off. Lenox Mall will stand the test of time, mainly due to Marta and rail access.

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by BlackPeach2

Suburban Malls need to die off. Lenox Mall will stand the test of time, mainly due to Marta and rail access.

If you look at the malls doing well, Lenox/Phipps and Perimeter are in the top. Both are located in major employment centers and have direct MARTA access.

[JPD]

It's worth noting that Lenox and Phipps get A LOT of business from people who don't live in Atlanta or Georgia. People come to Atlanta just to shop at these malls, and they tend to drop massive amounts of money when they do. That certainly is not the case for other malls in Metro Atlanta.

[cwkimbro]

Originally Posted by JPD

It's worth noting that Lenox and Phipps get A LOT of business from people who don't live in Atlanta or Georgia. People come to Atlanta just to shop at these malls, and they tend to drop massive amounts of money when they do. That certainly is not the case for other malls in Metro Atlanta.

I disagree actually.

The malls at the periphery of the area actually attract many people from rural Georgia, parts of South Carolina, Alabama, etc... that come in a few times a year to access stores that are not near them. It is actually a fairly common thing.

This is definitely true for Mall of Georgia and was true for Gwinnett Place several decades ago.

[cwkimbro]

Originally Posted by BlackPeach2

Suburban Malls need to die off. Lenox Mall will stand the test of time, mainly due to Marta and rail access.

Why does this have to turn into a MARTA things with you guys!?

We are talking about Malls here and there are plenty of malls around town doing great without rail access.

[coolieandre]

Malls closing are not just solely Atlanta. It's a national epidemic. The way people shop has changed...

[JPD]

Originally Posted by cwkimbro

I disagree actually.

The malls at the periphery of the area actually attract many people from rural Georgia, parts of South Carolina, Alabama, etc... that come in a few times a year to access stores that are not near them. It is actually a fairly common thing.

This is definitely true for Mall of Georgia and was true for Gwinnett Place several decades ago.

We're both right.

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by cwkimbro

Why does this have to turn into a MARTA things with you guys!?

We are talking about Malls here and there are plenty of malls around town doing great without rail access.

2 of the strongest malls have direct MARTA access. It should be brought up, could have a positive effect on their sales.