New Braves Stadium - affect on home prices - have you seen any? (Atlanta: homes, to buy)

[samiwas1]

Originally Posted by glovenyc

Thank you DawgPark, I live in that vicinity and the home sales prices in my subdivision have risen about $50K since the announcement. Will the failure of this project, and the downfall of the Cumberland area really enrich the lives of the miserable naysayers out there? I was always taught, be careful what you ask for.

Originally Posted by stillinthesouth

Same experience in my subdivision, located 1.5 miles from the site. Home values are on the rise.

I know!!!! I live 7 miles away from the stadium and my neighborhood's prices have also risen some $50,000, or over 30% in the last two years since the announcement, and some $30,000 in just the past year!!!!

Wait...I'm too far away to matter? Oh well, I guess maybe it's not the stadium, but just the market.

[brownhornet]

Everything in the area is rising, rent included.

[JoeP]

Whether or not more people go to games is irrelevant to the point of them going to the Gap.

If one wanted to go shopping at a store in that location, they would likely go when there isn't a game.

[Mishap]

Originally Posted by JoeP

Whether or not more people go to games is irrelevant to the point of them going to the Gap.

If one wanted to go shopping at a store in that location, they would likely go when there isn't a game.

And there's the rub. Stores survive on easy accessibility. Ever stop going to a store b/c traffic in the lot wasn't fun? Now from April to October, you have a ~40% chance of running into a game if you head there after work or on a weekend. I don't think most store web pages warn you of a game day.

If I don't like going to Trader Joe's b/c I have to circle the lot thrice to find a spot, how many times will people abandon when they hit a wall of cars on Cobb Parkway? Offseason they'll be fine and there will be parking a plenty but unless stores are opening only half the year, they can't exactly make a strong business case to pay normal rent compared to your average mall. Rent and payroll would bankrupt most business models unless the stadium is giving the space away compared to Cumberland. Gap closed and didn't return to Cumberland despite all the growth in the area...not exactly a strong case to open in an area that's more difficult to reach.

[evannole]

Originally Posted by Mishap

And there's the rub. Stores survive on easy accessibility. Ever stop going to a store b/c traffic in the lot wasn't fun? Now from April to October, you have a ~40% chance of running into a game if you head there after work or on a weekend. I don't think most store web pages warn you of a game day.

If I don't like going to Trader Joe's b/c I have to circle the lot thrice to find a spot, how many times will people abandon when they hit a wall of cars on Cobb Parkway? Offseason they'll be fine and there will be parking a plenty but unless stores are opening only half the year, they can't exactly make a strong business case to pay normal rent compared to your average mall. Rent and payroll would bankrupt most business models unless the stadium is giving the space away compared to Cumberland. Gap closed and didn't return to Cumberland despite all the growth in the area...not exactly a strong case to open in an area that's more difficult to reach.

Admittedly, there are some holes in the Braves' plan that need to be addressed, but while your arguments above sound good on the surface, they have some pretty big holes in them as well.

We keep hearing that traffic is going to be a nightmare with this stadium. There will undoubtedly be some issues, particularly on the 50-some-odd weeknight games that will take place every season. On the other hand, though, how many people do you know that do their retail, clothing-type shopping on weeknights after 7 or 7:30 PM? Many stores of that genre aren't even open on weeknights. In other words, the spilled retail traffic isn't likely to be all that high because there's not all that much demand for retail in the evenings during the week in the first place. The restaurants may see some spill, but they'll also see some stimulation of business from those attending games.

The negative impact on retail will be heaviest on weekend days with day games. There were 10 such games this past season, all on Sundays. Yes, ten. I hardly think that's going to be enough to make this project fail. Moreover, the traffic and parking situations around Lenox are absolutely dreadful, and, lo and behold, that mall is doing great, with the vast bulk of its customers coming by car, despite MARTA access, which, while helpful, is still not a game-changer.

I am getting really tired of hearing people assert that sports stadiums that have nothing else going on around them destroy communities and neighborhoods because of the lack of activity on game days, and then hearing the same people grouse about (and actively root for the failure of) a stadium project that addresses precisely that issue. I agree that it would be ideal if better transit were included, and that in the longer time that really must be addressed, but the truth of the matter is: this is the right way to build a stadium project.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by evannole

The negative impact on retail will be heaviest on weekend days with day games. There were 10 such games this past season, all on Sundays. Yes, ten. I hardly think that's going to be enough to make this project fail. Moreover, the traffic and parking situations around Lenox are absolutely dreadful, and, lo and behold, that mall is doing great, with the vast bulk of its customers coming by car, despite MARTA access, which, while helpful, is still not a game-changer.

I have often wondered why more people coming to Lenox and Phipps don't take MARTA. They've got two train stations, plenty of bus lines and a shuttle.

[Mishap]

Originally Posted by evannole

Admittedly, there are some holes in the Braves' plan that need to be addressed, but while your arguments above sound good on the surface, they have some pretty big holes in them as well.

We keep hearing that traffic is going to be a nightmare with this stadium. There will undoubtedly be some issues, particularly on the 50-some-odd weeknight games that will take place every season. On the other hand, though, how many people do you know that do their retail, clothing-type shopping on weeknights after 7 or 7:30 PM? Many stores of that genre aren't even open on weeknights. In other words, the spilled retail traffic isn't likely to be all that high because there's not all that much demand for retail in the evenings during the week in the first place. The restaurants may see some spill, but they'll also see some stimulation of business from those attending games.

The negative impact on retail will be heaviest on weekend days with day games. There were 10 such games this past season, all on Sundays. Yes, ten. I hardly think that's going to be enough to make this project fail. Moreover, the traffic and parking situations around Lenox are absolutely dreadful, and, lo and behold, that mall is doing great, with the vast bulk of its customers coming by car, despite MARTA access, which, while helpful, is still not a game-changer.

I am getting really tired of hearing people assert that sports stadiums that have nothing else going on around them destroy communities and neighborhoods because of the lack of activity on game days, and then hearing the same people grouse about (and actively root for the failure of) a stadium project that addresses precisely that issue. I agree that it would be ideal if better transit were included, and that in the longer time that really must be addressed, but the truth of the matter is: this is the right way to build a stadium project.

I actually do most of my clothes shopping on weekdays since it is the best opportunity to pop in and out of a store w/o big weekend traffic...after work and before dinner. Non-high end boutiques close generally at 9PM weeknights and there's usually quite a few people there ~6-8PM (overlaps w/ most people trying to get to a game). It's not peak shopping but unless these stores plan on cutting back staffing severely during the season, I don't see how they can maintain enough traffic to fit their usual business model. What I'm saying is, what makes it more attractive than locating at Cumberland itself? Gap/Express/Abercrombie/et al wants to be near anchor stores and other retailers...not drunk baseball fans that have to haul their purchases a mile back to their car. Sports bars and large scale/overpriced restaurants could see a lot of overlap of people sticking around after a game but unless the Braves plan on giving away the space for nearly nothing, there's nothing to differentiate it for retailers from the nearby mall which should have fewer traffic issues and people looking to actively shop.

As for Lenox Mall, I usually do take Marta there if I find myself shopping during there during the holidays. It works pretty well and there are quite a few people taking the same walk through the JW Marriott route each time.

[Mishap]

Originally Posted by arjay57

I have often wondered why more people coming to Lenox and Phipps don't take MARTA. They've got two train stations, plenty of bus lines and a shuttle.

There are quite a few. If I find myself having to visit the mall during the holidays on the weekend, I always take Marta and there's always quite a few people hopping off that stop and trekking through the JW entrance.

[glovenyc]

Originally Posted by lorilove

Unfortunately what is keeping Marta out of the area are the many Cobb Residents in other parts of Cobb County that are not affected. Most business leaders and many residents in the Southern part of the county are not the ones that are anti Marta.

Yes you are absolutely right. I live in Cumberland and I want Marta.

[tikigod311]

As dead as the Braves are to me and as scummy as this deal was, I want Cumberland and Cobb to succeed. I doubt this makes the Cumberland area any nicer than it was going to be. I think the appeal of being near a stadium is pretty narrow, the negative is substantial. If there were another option to get out of the area, I think that would add tremendous value to the area. Throw a few transit stops and you can have an option to avoid the inevitable congestion.

It will be interesting to see how far out, geographically, this thing has an effect.