Sandy Springs proposes Monorail Plan (Atlanta, Roswell: bus, rail, budget)

[cwkimbro]

Originally Posted by primaltech

Actually I've always thought a rail based people mover makes the most sense to me, for Sandy Springs, Dunwoody, and the Perimeter area. Maybe even for connecting downtown Sandy Springs with its MARTA station, but that could arguably be bus.

Something sort of like the Skytrain people mover at the airport. An aerial loop system with a handful of key stops on it. Namely, of course the MARTA stations, plus stations at the Ravinia towers, Concourse towers, all the various Cox towers, IBM and all the offices on Barfield, and finally Glenlake with the UPS HQ, Newell Rubbermaid HQ, and soon to be Mercedes HQ there as well. Then it could nicely loop back over to the North Springs station which is right there just across the highway.

For linking the under construction Sandy Springs city center area with the Sandy Springs MARTA station, I would recommend widening Mt Vernon by one lane each side, and making that a bus only lane, which does a constant, free shuttle loop service, like Atlantic Station.

It reminds me a good deal of the metromover in Miami. I'm surprised no one mentioned it yet...than again this thread has a good bit of the typical noise.

It is a bit ugly to be honest, but it serves a purpose.

One advantage a small closed monorail system could have is it can function like an APM, but the aerial track could be built to be smaller and take up less visual space.

I actually think shuttle buses with some dedicated lanes over key stretches might be more efficient. There are some large office campuses (and new development sites) that are harder to connect and some of these businesses. What they really need is versatility to use existing roads, but a path around a few key trouble spots to get them around the key traffic flows to the freeway.... some of which they can already avoid, because their destination is different.

[jero23]

Originally Posted by ATLTJL

He can be as butthurt as he wants, as can anybody else, and it really doesn't matter because:

Residents of towns like Sandy Springs and Johns Creek will always win in the end. Because they have the money, education, and power to make sure they get what they want.

So while they are out there doing that, the losers are on internet forums complaining about it. Which affects them absolutely zero.

Real World 101.

I guess, but if you consider being stuck in track winning then LA and SoCal must be the true winners in the US.

Originally Posted by David1502

According to your logic, then 94% of Sandy Springs (who voted for incorporation) are racists who don't like black people. This is in a city which is 65% white, 20% black and 14% Hispanic according to the 2010 census.


Again, the belief that every political action in metro Atlanta is motivated by race continues, regardless of the numerical evidence. In the case of Sandy Springs, the residents had no control over zoning since the Fulton County Commission decided every zoning issue. This was the main focus of the campaign to incorporate since the citizens of the area felt like Fulton County would approve any development -whether it was a strip club or apartments regardless of what they wanted. Developers had control over zoning decisions in unincorporated Fulton County.


Why should MARTA be opposed to the plan, because it won't have to finance it and it would provide additional riders to connect with MARTA at the MARTA stations?


The Cumberland Community Improvement District also has plans for a monorail to cover the Cumberland Galleria area. Also, the City of Detroit has monorail service covering its downtown area.

If you cannot follow logic and read then you wouldn't be making so many assumptions especially the hilarious line embolden above.

Also where did I say "MARTA would be opposed to this"? I didn't so I'm over discussing this with you because you assume too much and cannot comprehend anything on the actual topic. So have fun with your incoherent monologue because this pointless...

Oh yeah, the FTA (Federal Transit Administration) would be the ones that could and likely would oppose this because there is already a regional rail entity, MARTA. Anyways, I'm bored of talking to somebody that spends more time assuming than discerning what has been said...

[arjay57]

If this was being built in the city of Atlanta people would be doing backflips.

[magnetar]

Originally Posted by arjay57

If this was being built in the city of Atlanta people would be doing backflips.

...because it would be connecting us to things in the city we want to access by transit. But it's not, so we're not. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[MattCW]

This is a great idea. The biggest problems with buses isn't even anything Perimeter Center can control. You could have a dozen bus routes all crisscrossing Perimeter Center and there would still be lots of vehicle traffic getting to, from and around the area. The reason is simple, until there is high-capacity transit down both I-85 and I-75 into Atlanta AND it links across the top-end perimeter into PC, the vast majority of people will still have to drive. The only solution is to get under or above the traffic. Tunneling is massively expensive, and quite limiting.

As far as technology, PC is a bit interesting. To adequately cover the area, you need something fast enough to actually be faster than driving, but small enough to make stops every few "blocks." Really what we need is a step above the Miami/Detroit/Jacksonville peoplemovers (which except for JAX aren't monorails, they are mostly rubber-tired vehicles like the two systems at Hartsfield) but a step below the Vancouver Skytrain which is basically just a smaller HRT system (classed as "light metro"). The reason a slow speed peoplemover won't work is the long stretch between PC and central Sandy Springs along Hammond and/or Mount Vernon calls for a higher-speed system, at least 50mph. To appease the NIMBY's as much as possible, monorail should definitely be the overall technology. The beams are smaller and more unobstructive than any more conventional mode.

As far as route, I basically see two bidirectional loops that overlap. The big loop would go Sandy Springs MARTA, down Mount Vernon, Roswell Rd to Hammond, Dunwoody MARTA, Ashford Dunwoody to Meadow Lane then back to SS MARTA. The second loop is smaller and operates down Peachtree Dunwoody. This route could also be extended as a spur (like two of Miami Metromover's routes) down to the hospitals. Yes this somewhat duplicates MARTA service, but who is really riding Medical Center to Sandy Springs on 10-12 minute headways? Alternately, this could instead be part of a third route. Have the two loops as just loops, and run a linear route North Springs to the hospitals.

Here's a link to illustrate these ideas: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?m...ak&usp=sharing

Looking at the longer range, there's also the potential for a line up Mount Vernon to Dunwoody Village and a line punching through the Ravinia area, or along I-285 to reach the Chamblee Dunwoody area.

Originally Posted by cqholt

Streetcars are cheaper because there is no need to aerial structures, which in that corridor the residents would never allow.

Wrong way around, a monorail is cheaper because it is only aerial structures, no relocating of utilities except the few above-ground wires that remain (any in PC?) and it's easier to duck and dodge around obstacles.

[tikigod311]

There are a lot of disconnected, heavily trafficked destinations in the area. This actually makes a lot of sense.

[skbl17]

Honestly, I like this idea. The layout of the Perimeter Center area lends itself well to some kind of APM circulator, maybe like the LRT in Singapore.

If PCID is willing to fund it themselves, I say go ahead and build it now!

- skbl17

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by MattCW

As far as route, I basically see two bidirectional loops that overlap. The big loop would go Sandy Springs MARTA, down Mount Vernon, Roswell Rd to Hammond, Dunwoody MARTA, Ashford Dunwoody to Meadow Lane then back to SS MARTA. The second loop is smaller and operates down Peachtree Dunwoody. This route could also be extended as a spur (like two of Miami Metromover's routes) down to the hospitals. Yes this somewhat duplicates MARTA service, but who is really riding Medical Center to Sandy Springs on 10-12 minute headways? Alternately, this could instead be part of a third route. Have the two loops as just loops, and run a linear route North Springs to the hospitals.

Great post, Matt.

How many cars per train should there be?

[GeorgiaLakeSearch]

This is a great idea for up there.

[dblackga]

Originally Posted by jero23

Another unrealistic (and impractical) idea by another neophytic municipality (that should have never been formed) that has zero chance of being implemented. There is zero support for this even if their officials talked to Atlanta Regional Commission (ARC) and GDOT. They can only hope, and I mean hope, for a private entity whom would want to fund this. There's nothing to see here...

"That should never have been formed"? Really? Still bitter after a decade? Oh, please. The overwhelming majority of Sandy Springs residents are VERY happy with their new city, thank you very much. We may disagree about this and that, but what municipality doesn't? And at least we are all on the same page when it comes to creating the optimum living environment for all residents, and aren't subject to the whims of Fulton County's so-called planning and zoning -- Fulton County didn't give a rat's butt about the quality of life in Sandy Springs, and only saw us as a cash cow. And apparently we aren't the only ones who felt that way -- as witnessed by the numerous towns and cities that have been incorporated since then. We wanted control over our own destiny, and the freedom to forge that path without interference.

The monorail may be impractical -- but most visionary ideas are poo-poo'd as "impractical" at first. At least they are thinking outside the box. It opens a discussion, and I don't think anyone will argue with the need for more/better forms of public transportation. Personally, I think a monorail is a really interesting idea, and would certainly improve alternate access to the city center.

One day three or four years ago, my son's car was in the shop, and he needed to get over to Roswell Road/Hammond Drive area from the North Springs MARTA station area. He decided to try the bus. 90 MINUTES for a trip that was, at most, 2.5 miles. That's NUTS, and THAT'S why people don't take the bus -- they aren't at all convenient. He could have walked it faster -- and that's exactly what he did for the next few days while his car was being fixed. (I think he'd probably just Uber it, these days.)