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Suburbs aren't that bad. Most of the discount stores are in the suburbs. Grocery stores tend to be cheaper there as well. You can save a lot of money in the suburbs if you know how to play your cards right.
My biggest complaint about suburbia is that they don't have rail, of any kind. Like in Atlanta you'll have rail through the closest suburbs and then it just comes to a halt. And there are these huge park and rides, with like an 8 level parking garage. And it is not like the bus service in those areas that aren't connected by rail is that great.
Walkability is only an issue if you actually need to leave the area for anything. I'm not sure why anyone would move to a suburban area that does not have everything. Especially with all of these lifestyle centers that are being built in suburban areas all across this country. They create semi/quasi urban cores within suburbia. Wealthier suburban areas in, or nearby cities have these "Town Center" lifestyle projects that have high rises, retail, residential, hotels, theaters, restaurants, even performing arts centers that have everything you need. Only reason to leave the area would be for hospitals, schools and churches. Prices to live in these areas are high but it is all new construction, so what else would one expect.
I don't know, there are just too many alternatives to the old suburban model for one to get trapped into sixties style strip malls and cul-de-sacs. It is simply a matter of making the decision which suburban area they want to live in, and what are the trade offs to living in the city.
Some of his criticisms are very Atlanta-centric. Atlanta takes cul-de-sacism to an extreme. And it takes avoiding building arterial roads to an extreme. That is what leads to the funneling. It also makes the limited number of residential streets that do go through have much more traffic than a different type of system.
By "Atlanta," do you mean suburban Atlanta? I live in town and there aren't many cul-de-sacs at all.
By "Atlanta," do you mean suburban Atlanta? I live in town and there aren't many cul-de-sacs at all.
Pretty much all but the core. DeKalb County is filled with them. Even Virginia Highlands has a bunch of unconnected roads (not technically cul-de-sacs, but the same effect). Buckhead is the same.
How I learned to stop hating suburbia [kinda long]
We're on our 5th page, and the discussion is still remarkably civil! Nobody likes to be told why the setting they live in is so awful, or soul-sucking, or poorly designed, or noisy and congested at all hours of the night, or whatever else they are saying from the other side of the urban/suburban divide [there's some road or something locally that defines this separation, isn't there?].
I used to be one of those that saw suburbia as this amorphous Borg-like monolith of manufactured conformity that people moved to to get away from urban encroachment, but who then demand the amenities that eventually create urban encroachment where they just moved to.
Is that actually the case? Not really. Its nothing new, anyways.
I grew up in suburban southern Connecticut, near Bridgeport. Most of the housing stock in the area was built in the early 70s. If it wasn't a raised ranch [and 2/3 of them were], it was a Cape Cod. And, oh, those appliance colors! But, I digress. Some houses were better maintained than others. Everyone up and down the street were on generally friendly terms [especially if you have a pool in the backyard]. The nearest grocery store? Well, that was a few miles away, past nothing but more raised ranch homes of all kinds of color and condition. At the time, I saw all that was unique about it because that was the world I spent most of my time in.
Enter young adulthood, with its higher education, desire for employment, even stronger desire for nightlife and entertainment, and eventually relocation to Georgia. Suddenly, suburbia seemed like the most boring place ever. On top of that, residential neighborhoods no longer seemed to go endlessly from street to street. Now, there's only one way in and out, and they've all got this self-important-looking facade of an entrance in addition to the street sign on the corner. And RULES! Rules mandating that homes must look pretty much the same.
Well, as I've gotten older, and made friends with people that turned out to live in some of those atrocious subdivisions, I've kind of mellowed. I look back on that neighborhood I grew up in and now recognize that its pretty much the same suburbia I live around now, just the previous generation of it.
Plus, with a job in south Forsyth County that I've had for 14 years, I've kinda HAD to embrace suburban living. I still go in to Atlanta for nightclubs, or an occasional concert. But eating out in town is kind of expensive. It turns out that there's a TON of restaurants in the suburbs beyond just the usual casual dining chains. And you know what? Whether inside or outside of 285, the best ones are ALL packed and noisy on a warm Friday night, as I recently found out.
We're on our 5th page, and the discussion is still remarkably civil! Nobody likes to be told why the setting they live in is so awful, or soul-sucking, or poorly designed, or noisy and congested at all hours of the night, or whatever else they are saying from the other side of the urban/suburban divide [there's some road or something locally that defines this separation, isn't there?].
I used to be one of those that saw suburbia as this amorphous Borg-like monolith of manufactured conformity that people moved to to get away from urban encroachment, but who then demand the amenities that eventually create urban encroachment where they just moved to.
Is that actually the case? Not really. Its nothing new, anyways.
I grew up in suburban southern Connecticut, near Bridgeport. Most of the housing stock in the area was built in the early 70s. If it wasn't a raised ranch [and 2/3 of them were], it was a Cape Cod. And, oh, those appliance colors! But, I digress. Some houses were better maintained than others. Everyone up and down the street were on generally friendly terms [especially if you have a pool in the backyard]. The nearest grocery store? Well, that was a few miles away, past nothing but more raised ranch homes of all kinds of color and condition. At the time, I saw all that was unique about it because that was the world I spent most of my time in.
Enter young adulthood, with its higher education, desire for employment, even stronger desire for nightlife and entertainment, and eventually relocation to Georgia. Suddenly, suburbia seemed like the most boring place ever. On top of that, residential neighborhoods no longer seemed to go endlessly from street to street. Now, there's only one way in and out, and they've all got this self-important-looking facade of an entrance in addition to the street sign on the corner. And RULES! Rules mandating that homes must look pretty much the same.
Well, as I've gotten older, and made friends with people that turned out to live in some of those atrocious subdivisions, I've kind of mellowed. I look back on that neighborhood I grew up in and now recognize that its pretty much the same suburbia I live around now, just the previous generation of it.
Plus, with a job in south Forsyth County that I've had for 14 years, I've kinda HAD to embrace suburban living. I still go in to Atlanta for nightclubs, or an occasional concert. But eating out in town is kind of expensive. It turns out that there's a TON of restaurants in the suburbs beyond just the usual casual dining chains. And you know what? Whether inside or outside of 285, the best ones are ALL packed and noisy on a warm Friday night, as I recently found out.
Sounds like two different types of suburbia you're referring to. Where you grew up sounds a lot like suburban Cleveland. No cul-de-sacs or anything, but endless suburbs back to back that are connected by arterial roads, and they still have a grid pattern and they're still walkable. You can get on one of those arterial roads and go into Cleveland, go the other way and go into Akron. Either way you're going through different suburbs and exurbs until you get to your destination.
From what I've taken by what some of the posters are referring to with respect to Atlanta's suburbs, it wouldn't be quite so bad if things were that way? Or they already are in some parts of the metro but not in other parts? I'm curious to find out.
Fortunately, people are not monolithic. It may hard or difficult to believe, but perhaps your preferences are not universal. Perhaps your priorities are not mine (or his or hers). Just maybe we like different things, value other experiences and favor other outlets.
It seems increasingly obvious that the city dwellers do not venture to "the suburbs." The insularity of the group think is just like someone speaking about (insert racial or ethnic minority) from a point of expertise or experience when/if they have never met or truly known many/any (insert racial or ethnic minority) people.
The suburbs are full of people from ALL over the world, yes, even some who hail from the first-class international cities so lauded and admired on this board. Just as they come from all over the U.S. and across the planet, they also hold various views, perspectives and points of view. They like different types of music, food, entertainment, diversions. Would you believe some of them are even non-white and speak other languages?
I can drive into "the city" within 20 minutes outside of rush hour. I can experience all types of cuisine and socialize with all kinds of interesting people virtually right in my own backyard. I can enjoy nature, restaurants, parks and more without leaving my county. Fortunately, I am broad-minded enough not to isolate my waking hours to one type of habitat.
Until I moved here, I didn't realize some people consider a 15-25 mile drive the equivalent of a cross-country trip.
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,334 posts, read 26,074,740 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabasse
Atlanta suburbs are the worst kind of suburbs. There's no connectivity, no sidewalks, you HAVE to drive. At least in semi-dense suburban areas you have sidewalks and can walk to the nearest shopping center. It's a terrible experience for teenagers who can't or don't drive.
That completely depends on the area. Smyrna is laid out in a gridlike manner (roughly) with sidewalks and is very walkable. Many newer developments like One Ivy Walk and West Village in southern Smyrna are combination retail/housing areas.
Otherwise, the suburbs here are very similar to the suburbs I grew up with in the Twin Cities. You have large areas of housing and concentrated areas of retails here and there. So what? We had bikes as kids.
That completely depends on the area. Smyrna is laid out in a gridlike manner (roughly) with sidewalks and is very walkable. Many newer developments like One Ivy Walk and West Village in southern Smyrna are combination retail/housing areas.
Otherwise, the suburbs here are very similar to the suburbs I grew up with in the Twin Cities. You have large areas of housing and concentrated areas of retails here and there. So what? We had bikes as kids.
Wrong, Smyrna is not 'very walkabkle' It is car-oriented development with some drive-to urbanism in there. It is still dominated by strip malls that force peds to cross parking lots, as well as high speed roads that make it uncomfortable for peds to walk next to.
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,334 posts, read 26,074,740 times
Reputation: 3995
Quote:
Originally Posted by cqholt
Wrong, Smyrna is not 'very walkabkle' It is car-oriented development with some drive-to urbanism in there. It is still dominated by strip malls that force peds to cross parking lots, as well as high speed roads that make it uncomfortable for peds to walk next to.
I know several people who live in Smyrna proper and walk all over, so I beg to differ. Note that I'm talking about the area along Spring Road west of Atlanta Road. Other areas of Smyrna are MUCH more spread out. That area is almost like a town. Central Mableton is also pretty walkable in spots.
Last edited by rcsteiner; 05-10-2016 at 12:58 PM..
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How I learned to stop hating suburbia [kinda long]
subdivisions, I've kind of mellowed. I look back on that neighborhood I grew up in and now recognize that its pretty much the same suburbia I live around now, just the previous generation of it.
