I'm all for gentrification. (Atlanta, Decatur: purchasing, live in, safe)

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by Forhall

Yes, and if you have noticed thanks to gentrifiers paying higher taxes in areas like Virginia Highland and Buckhead, Atlanta has money to build parks and green space on the west side or even start trying to clean up the bluffs area.

We can never win. If we leave an area as is then we are ignoring the poor areas. If we clean it up and invest, and people start moving in because it becomes desirable, then we are "gentrifying" it and "pricing out the long time residents"

So what do you want? I don't get it. It sounds like you want neighborhoods to have all the benefits of a wealthy neighborhood, great schools, etc but don't want to have to pay for it. It just doesn't work that way.

I outlined a bunch of stuff earlier in the thread, if you haven't read that, then I suggest you do.

What I want, ultimately, is to LIFT the poor out of poverty, not REPLACE them with the wealthy and simply sweep the poor to other places. That means investing in the city services there, as well as social services. That means giving the existing neighborhoods a voice and platform as much as it means supplying the basic city services.

You're right, the city HAS been making strides to do this, and I appreciate its efforts. I look forward to seeing if they are actually helping retain existing citizens / increase affordable housing availability, or if they are ineffective at maintaining the socioeconomic diversity.

I fully intend to pay my portion of the taxes for supporting such programs once/if I can find work back in the city. I have no idea where you got the notion that I don't want to pay for it, since that is not true in the slightest.

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by TheTravelinMan

You don't need a lawn service company to pick up litter and wack some weeds.

You need the time, and you need the equipment. You also need the disposal services. If you are working 3 jobs, can't afford a weed-wacker / can't borrow one, and don't have trash or yard waste services, then I hardly see how it's odd that things don't look sparkling.

[TheTravelinMan]

Originally Posted by Mutiny77

I don't think you read my statement in its entirety. Let me repeat: "What I find galling is that in these neighborhoods, you have law-abiding, taxpaying homeowners who have lived there for years who have been begging for the basics--parks, sidewalks, trash pickup, etc.--and they get ignored until the gentrifiers show up. Happens all the time."



Cqholt gave a very good answer. Also, while many people's yards in these neighborhoods won't be gracing the cover of any home and garden magazines anytime soon, they aren't "urban jungles." And that has nothing to do with non-responsive local governments that won't even fix roads and sidewalks in these communities. But then again, even Midtown has patchy, busted sidewalks in places so there's that.

No he didn't. I'm not talking about people being able to have some kind of Buckhead style lush lawn. I'm talking about places where it looks like people just dont care.

[TheTravelinMan]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

You need the time, and you need the equipment. You also need the disposal services. If you are working 3 jobs, can't afford a weed-wacker / can't borrow one, and don't have trash or yard waste services, then I hardly see how it's odd that things don't look sparkling.

Weed wackers are NOT that expensive. But even so there is also something called a machete that works nicely as well.

I do volunteer work on the west side, when I go into some of those apt. complexes I see a whole lot of people sitting around doing a whole lot of nothing (and litter everywhere).

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by TheTravelinMan

Weed wackers are NOT that expensive. But even so there is also something called a machete that works nicely as well.

I do volunteer work on the west side, when I go into some of those apt. complexes I see a whole lot of people sitting around doing a whole lot of nothing (and litter everywhere).

Expensive enough if you can barely afford to keep the utilities on and food on the table.

And have you ever bothered to ASK them about stuff?

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by TheTravelinMan

You don't need a lawn service company to pick up litter and wack some weeds.

Yes, but some elderly and disabled residents who live on a fixed income and therefore cannot perform the tasks themselves or hire someone to do it.

[TheTravelinMan]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

Expensive enough if you can barely afford to keep the utilities on and food on the table.

And have you ever bothered to ASK them about stuff?

I bet I know the families on the west side better than you do. Care to come with me to the apartment complexes off Bankhead sometime?

[Mutiny77]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

I outlined a bunch of stuff earlier in the thread, if you haven't read that, then I suggest you do.

What I want, ultimately, is to LIFT the poor out of poverty, not REPLACE them with the wealthy and simply sweep the poor to other places. That means investing in the city services there, as well as social services. That means giving the existing neighborhoods a voice and platform as much as it means supplying the basic city services.

You're right, the city HAS been making strides to do this, and I appreciate its efforts. I look forward to seeing if they are actually helping retain existing citizens / increase affordable housing availability, or if they are ineffective at maintaining the socioeconomic diversity.

I fully intend to pay my portion of the taxes for supporting such programs once/if I can find work back in the city. I have no idea where you got the notion that I don't want to pay for it, since that is not true in the slightest.

Agreed but it doesn't help that Atlanta has just about the lowest upward mobility for all residents among major metro areas. That has to change.

Originally Posted by TheTravelinMan

No he didn't. I'm not talking about people being able to have some kind of Buckhead style lush lawn. I'm talking about places where it looks like people just dont care.

Yes, he did. And I'm not talking extremes here; those are outliers. Yards with some overgrown grass and a few weeds isn't anything close to being an "urban jungle" and that comes MUCH closer to the norm in many of these neighborhoods.

[Forhall]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

I outlined a bunch of stuff earlier in the thread, if you haven't read that, then I suggest you do.

What I want, ultimately, is to LIFT the poor out of poverty, not REPLACE them with the wealthy and simply sweep the poor to other places. That means investing in the city services there, as well as social services. That means giving the existing neighborhoods a voice and platform as much as it means supplying the basic city services.

You're right, the city HAS been making strides to do this, and I appreciate its efforts. I look forward to seeing if they are actually helping retain existing citizens / increase affordable housing availability, or if they are ineffective at maintaining the socioeconomic diversity.

I fully intend to pay my portion of the taxes for supporting such programs once/if I can find work back in the city. I have no idea where you got the notion that I don't want to pay for it, since that is not true in the slightest.

We all would love to lift everyone out of poverty and have no more crime or urban blight. But, we can't. There aren't enough resources, and some people just don't want to be productive. We all imagine the single mother who wants to work but can't find a job or affordable child care, but for everyone of her there are 3 or 4 thugs who CHOSE to join a gang rather than finish high school. They CHOOSE to spend their time robbing from hardworking people than working for their own income. They would rather kill and take than sit down and work on a resume and get a job. And unfortunately no amount of resources poured into bad neighborhoods is going to reach those kind of people. Some people have grown up watching the thug life be glorified by their friends, and in rap songs, and they just want to be part of it regardless of what assistance the government is willing to give them.

[TheTravelinMan]

Originally Posted by Forhall

We all would love to lift everyone out of poverty and have no more crime or urban blight. But, we can't. There aren't enough resources, and some people just don't want to be productive. We all imagine the single mother who wants to work but can't find a job or affordable child care, but for everyone of her there are 3 or 4 thugs who CHOSE to join a gang rather than finish high school. They CHOOSE to spend their time robbing from hardworking people than working for their own income. They would rather kill and take than sit down and work on a resume and get a job. And unfortunately no amount of resources poured into bad neighborhoods is going to reach those kind of people. Some people have grown up watching the thug life be glorified by their friends, and in rap songs, and they just want to be part of it regardless of what assistance the government is willing to give them.

Yes that about sums it up and is pretty accurate based on my experience volunteering in these neighborhoods.