The ATL: new regional transit system (Atlanta, Buckhead: new construction, to live in, restaurant)

[primaltech]

As for Peachtree Rd thru Buckhead, put me down as all for a good quality light rail line in its own travel ROW, or at least a BRT. That corridor has so much stuff and so many high rises, that you would actually gain capacity by reducing car traffic down to 2 lanes either direction, with really good transit in place. Because so many people would ride. I'm in favor of that.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

'At the breaking point' is exactly the time to upgrade lanes into a higher-capacity mode. Light Rail in dedicated lanes in the corridor could carry up to 5 times as many people as the same space reserved for cars. A dedicated transit way could carry up to 16 times as many people in the same space.

If there is so much demand for travel in the corridor, then let's better use the space for higher-capacity systems. Wider sidewalks, bike lanes, and transit lanes should all be in the mix as best as possible.



1) We're talking from Arts Center to Buckhead / Lenox along Peachtree.

2) Midtown and Downtown are the areas that can best take advantage of additional transit, even in duplicated portions.



There would still be car lanes. There would be more alternatives, even if a couple of lanes are converted to transit lanes.

You are assuming people use them. In the Atlanta area about 7% of people telecommute and only 4% use mass transit. Many of those 4% use buses which require streets. So you've got close to 90% who drive alone or car/van pool and need those lanes. You can't design for less than 4% and ignore 89+%. There is no doubt that if Atlanta grows, the number of drivers will grow. You will not get ALL new residents to use transit.

Reducing road capacity simply means people and jobs will go elsewhere. Atlanta already loses on relocation because of its traffic. Making traffic worse does not improve the situation.

You need alternatives without harming the vast majority of residents.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by primaltech

This is what I really want to see. A 'Purple Line' LRT from Cumberland to Avondale, via the Armour HRT infill, and lots of key, useful stops, like Moores Mill, Howell Mill, Peachtree Rd, Cheshire Bridge, Briarcliff, Emory.

Armour would be a new main/north hub of the MARTA regional transit system, with transfers to Red/Gold heavy rail, Purple light rail in both directions, Eastside Beltline light rail to Piedmont Park and PCM and etc, commuter rail potentially to Gwinnett, and the Beltline trail for bikes and pedestrians. And maybe even regional passenger rail to Athens.

One possibility is that Purple line (Clifton corridor), could function as commuter rail to Marietta and beyond.



I for one think that would be so stupid. And I basically live in Cumberland and I work at Perimeter Center.

First priority for any Cobb rail needs to be into the city. BRT on the top-end is fine, at least until after then.

I do think Armour/Lindberg should be a hub much as 5 points is now.

[brown_dog_us]

Originally Posted by bu2

You are assuming people use them. In the Atlanta area about 7% of people telecommute and only 4% use mass transit. Many of those 4% use buses which require streets. So you've got close to 90% who drive alone or car/van pool and need those lanes. You can't design for less than 4% and ignore 89+%. There is no doubt that if Atlanta grows, the number of drivers will grow. You will not get ALL new residents to use transit.
.

Removing car lanes that are at capacity for a bus or streetcar that moves less people is the quickest way for a City employee or council member to find themselves out of a job.

[autolycus25]

Originally Posted by brown_dog_us

Removing car lanes that are at capacity for a bus or streetcar that moves less people is the quickest way for a City employee or council member to find themselves out of a job.

A streetcar in dedicated right of way would be capable of moving far more people than a lane of cars. Give it signal priority so it really only stops at the stations, and a good number of people would ride it through Buckhead. A loop from Lindbergh or Armour along the North Beltline trail to Piedmont Hospital and then north on Peachtree, finishing with a loop around Lenox Rd. to Piedmont and back to Peachtree or around Wieuca/Roxboro to the Lenox Gold Line station would be a popular route with tons of density within a few blocks of it.

[architect77]

We have already given up one northbound lane which ruined my ability to drive from downtown to LA Fitness beside Disco Kroger in 20 minutes at 5:30 pm.

All of the claim about moving more people on light rail than cars in the space of an existing lane.

Light Rail is slow as all get out, and the only way to it could move more people than one lane for cars is if the the light rail was a continuous string of cars.

Yes, that route is a great candidate for rapid transit, but beside the existing road, not taking over an existing lane.

We need to start thinking outside of the box. With all of the plastic that the packing industry isn't interested in recycling & keeps making more and more despite the garbage patches in several oceans..

Why couldn't light rail or subway cars or a gondola cars be completely made of plastic?

Just put some AC in them and they'd be lightweight and inexpensive to manufacture/replace.

OR HOW ABOUT A MOVING SIDEWALK UP PEACHTREE using the same techanology as Cable Cars in SF?

A cable underground could constantly be moving and whatever could grab hold of it and travel up to Buckhead.

[samiwas1]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

'At the breaking point' is exactly the time to upgrade lanes into a higher-capacity mode. Light Rail in dedicated lanes in the corridor could carry up to 5 times as many people as the same space reserved for cars.

But the problem is that the light rail would need to cover the geographical origins and destinations of all those people in a reasonable time. Simply removing a lane and throwing a rail on it is not fixing any problems unless it actually serves the mobility needs of potential users. The streetcar and bike lanes prove this. It's a great option, but they are sparsely used as opposed to the lanes they replaced. (and yes, I'm aware that the streetcar didn't replace lanes).

Until you have a vast network of rail serving many areas of the city, simply replacing a single corridor will not solve any issues, and will likely create more.

[brown_dog_us]

Originally Posted by autolycus25

A streetcar in dedicated right of way would be capable of moving far more people than a lane of cars. Give it signal priority so it really only stops at the stations, and a good number of people would ride it through Buckhead. A loop from Lindbergh or Armour along the North Beltline trail to Piedmont Hospital and then north on Peachtree, finishing with a loop around Lenox Rd. to Piedmont and back to Peachtree or around Wieuca/Roxboro to the Lenox Gold Line station would be a popular route with tons of density within a few blocks of it.

Totally agree. I was talking about if it's not moving more people than the car lane it replaced. The risk of job loss causes the city to be scared of big moves that might not work out. Atlanta should take the route you described and convert a lane to bus only for a trial period. If it moves more people then keep it. If not remove the plastic bollards and return it to a congested car lane.

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by architect77

Light Rail is slow as all get out, and the only way to it could move more people than one lane for cars is if the the light rail was a continuous string of cars.

That's patently false. In terms of capacity, one full train of people is worth at least 100 or 200 cars, and only takes up the physical space of maybe 10 cars. If the light rail was a continuous string of cars, that would be the equivalent of adding 10 new car-filled lanes to Peachtree.

If the light rail was simply frequent, like headway of 10 minutes or better, then that would add to total capacity.

[primaltech]

The Peachtree corridor between Brookhaven and Arts Center, is not served well by cars and a regular bus. It needs to be 2 lanes either direction for cars, and a light rail system with key stops. Or at least a BRT/trolley type system in its own lanes.

All those condo high rises and office high rises, and all the restaurants and destinations on that line, and that would be one heck of a high ridership LRT.

Better user experience than sitting in gridlock.