APD to reopen and retest evidence in Atlanta child murders case (Jackson: crime, how much)

[ronricks]

Originally Posted by ATLHRLGUY

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on the relevance of the HBO Doc. I'm familiar with most of the other links you've provided. I'm just not one to summarily dismiss HBO's attempt without seeing its conclusion especially since they said they would be introducing new evidence. I initially put new in quotations when referring to the evidence because there have been so many others that have tried to get to the bottom of those murders. So while you dismiss it after two episodes I hope that after episode 5 it can add, at the very least, to the mosaic of the entire case, and in doing so, give those families even just a few more answers, which is the only thing we seem to agree upon.

Again, there isn’t any new evidence. They are trying to link the killings to the KKK and the Sanders family via the #8100 GBI/FBI file in order to exonerate Wayne Williams. It’s not new info or evidence. It’s actually old debunked info and evidence. To suggest that Wayne Williams was framed by the KKK or FBI/GBI is laughable.

[ATLHRLGUY]

Originally Posted by ronricks

Again, there isn’t any new evidence. They are trying to link the killings to the KKK and the Sanders family via the #8100 GBI/FBI file in order to exonerate Wayne Williams. It’s not new info or evidence. It’s actually old debunked info and evidence. To suggest that Wayne Williams was framed by the KKK or FBI/GBI is laughable.

*Sigh*

[Newsboy]

Originally Posted by atler8

The above is probably the best post I've ever seen from you. I appreciate your insight on this issue very much.

Personally, I am always very cautious of any national examination of almost any type of story that had it's origin in Atlanta. More specifically, my reticence applies most strongly to the portrayal of Atlanta and it's criminal cases or events.

Probably due to the horrible bias found in Abby Mann's 1985 CBS TV mini-series production titled "The Atlanta Child Murders", my reticence at seeing such events play out on the silver screen or via television is prompted by the seeming inability of media companies to produce an accurate portrayal of a criminal event in Atlanta. My viewpoint was recently reinforced by the startlingly inaccurate Clint Eastwood movie titled "Richard Jewell".
Although of exactly the same title as the "The Atlanta Child Murders" series linked above by ronricks, the link below is to the 1985 production I have referenced.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088750/?ref_=fn_al_tt_2

RE: Richard Jewell, as someone who worked in the AJC newsroom during that time I'm in agreement 100%. The "liberties" Eastwood took with the story, especially with the "character" of Kathy Scruggs, were disgusting.

Also, what's your opinion of the national examination of the Leo Frank saga, via various novels, films, documentaries, mini-series and Broadway musical? Seems like that one, for the most part, has been on the right side of history.

[PKCorey]

I was shocked to learn in ep. 2 that so many of the boys were involved in child prostitution at such young ages.

Also, I dont think the 62 year old guy was arrested for basically admitting that he slept with underage boys.

Crazy times.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by ronricks

They try and blame it on KKK/Charles Sanders and his brothers. All the evidence points to Wayne Williams killing a majority of the children and adults who were strangled or asphyxiated.



Other likely killers or suspects of the remaining murdered children were:
Lee Gooch
Jamie Brooks
Tom Terrell
Larry Marshall/Larry Hill
Homer Williams (one eye witness account and witness sketch along with the vehicle match Homer Williams and his station wagon)
Fred Wyatt
Family Members of the children. On episode 2 FBI agent Mike McComas said that Anthony Carter's mother confessed to killing him. Why nothing was done about this who knows? Same thing happened when Tom Terrell admitted to having homosexual sex with 13 year old Timothy Hill the day or two before he disappeared. On what planet is that not a crime? Many other victims were also seen at Tom Terrell's home.


Charles Sanders (he was under total FBI surveillance for 8 weeks and his phone line tapped for months and in that period 4 more kids went missing and were found murdered)



I don't think anyone believes that Wayne Williams killed everyone on the list. There were likely 4 or 5 killers mostly people who lived in the neighborhoods. Same as what happens today. To suggest that Wayne Williams was framed or didn't kill anyone is asinine. People involved with the Wayne Williams innocence project are involved with this HBO documentary. The evidence has been tested with modern DNA techniques and the human hair samples, automobile carpet samples (Williams drove many different cars) home carpet samples, and dog hair samples all point to and could not exclude Wayne Williams as one of the killers.



Had the FBI not gotten involved who knows how long the killings would have lasted as the APD and GBI were just in over their heads with this. Wayne Williams isn't an idiot he was very intelligent, sharp, and cunning and likely was smarter than many of the APD officers and detectives that were on the case in the beginning. He has a high intellect he wasn't your run of the mill dumb criminal APD was used to dealing with.

I'd be very surprised if Williams was exonerated but shouldn't some of these other suspects be investigated as well?

[Newsboy]

Originally Posted by arjay57

I'd be very surprised if Williams was exonerated but shouldn't some of these other suspects be investigated as well?

They've been investigated, and after 40 years I suspect most of them are dead.

[atler8]

Originally Posted by Newsboy

RE: Richard Jewell, as someone who worked in the AJC newsroom during that time I'm in agreement 100%. The "liberties" Eastwood took with the story, especially with the "character" of Kathy Scruggs, were disgusting.

Also, what's your opinion of the national examination of the Leo Frank saga, via various novels, films, documentaries, mini-series and Broadway musical? Seems like that one, for the most part, has been on the right side of history.

Hi there Newsboy
It's nice to see your viewpoint expressed here and to receive feedback from you!

As for the Leo Frank case, I became aware of it early on in my life in Atlanta, probably at around 1982 or thereabouts and that awareness on my part came via news stories from your former employer, i.e. the Atlanta Journal/Constitution.
From there, it seems that the case picked up a life of it's own and spread to where it was gradually better known outside of Atlanta & Georgia but also somewhat on a national basis... and deservedly so!
It's interesting to note that in various circles, particularly the Jewish community locally and even further afield, the Leo Frank case never really was ever lost from consciousness.
Via the series of "Stump Franklin Garrett events, longtime Atlanta historian of note, Franklin Garrett, surely could have been a great source for an in person retelling of what happened at the time Mr. Frank was accused and then lynched. I regret that I never made it to any of his locally famous public speaking events where I would have asked him about the case.

But I digress from the thread topic here so in returning to Atlanta and how it has played out via the various examinations of the Missing and Murdered Children case, I am as I said last time "wary". The problem seems to always be that there is an agenda at work rather than a real effort at truth telling. And as you & I agree Newsboy, there was an agenda vividly on display in the movie Richard Jewell; something which eventually gave a serious blowback to Eastwood and led to great criticism of his movie and a huge drop off in it's box office take..

[slickone4life]

Originally Posted by ronricks

Have been watching but it honestly isn't as thorough as other docs that have already been made. There seems to be the motive/agenda by the producers to have the killer(s) be a 'white' person which is pretty laughable and irresponsible as the children being murdered by a white person rather than a black person doesn't make it any more impactful. The lives of the children killed by a black perpetrator are worth just as much as the ones killed by a white one. A murder is a murder and young children still lost their lives futures were destroyed and families lost loved ones. The best thing to come of all of this would be for Wayne Williams to admit and confess to the murders he actually committed so the rest can be properly investigated and some semblance of closure can come to the victims families. But that would never happen because Wayne is a sociopath and a narcissist and you can see he gets enjoyment in interviews discussing the murders and often answers a question with a question instead of being truthful its all a sick and twisted game to him no different from a Ted Bundy or other serial killers. It is impossible Wayne Williams killed none of the children and it is also impossible he killed all of them. Some other previous documentaries that have good info about the case:







https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sy65YJl_-8Y




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9OM4IMN27s



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=my0lZe_knZA&t=441s

What's really laughable is how I'm reading through all these posts and see a blatant narrative of the kkk having nothing to do with any of this. Talk about motives lol. This is America. A country that still has not labeled the kkk a terrorist organization. There is documented history of what the kkk has done to people of color especially in the south. Oh and don't think that police officers and judges can't be members as well. To write it off as if it's not a solid theory is irresponsible and down right naive if you ask me. I'm not saying he's innocent or guilty but ALL theories should be taken into consideration and investigated thoroughly even if you don't like it.

[ronricks]

Originally Posted by slickone4life

What's really laughable is how I'm reading through all these posts and see a blatant narrative of the kkk having nothing to do with any of this. Talk about motives lol. This is America. A country that still has not labeled the kkk a terrorist organization. There is documented history of what the kkk has done to people of color especially in the south. Oh and don't think that police officers and judges can't be members as well. To write it off as if it's not a solid theory is irresponsible and down right naive if you ask me. I'm not saying he's innocent or guilty but ALL theories should be taken into consideration and investigated thoroughly even if you don't like it.

It was investigated. What the KKK did in 1920 has nothing to do with this case in the late 70's and early 80's. Are you saying that judge Clarence Cooper was a KKK member? Lee Brown? John Glover? Maynard Jackson? You sound as ridiculous as Wayne Williams.

[Thulsa]

The KKK isn't designated by the government as a terrorist group because it is a domestic organization. There is presently no way for the government to legally designate any domestic group as a terroristic organization.