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The 5 Great Plains Big 8 schools were always upset their little club near Kansas City went away. Their fans never realized as Colorado, the Oklahoma schools and the Texas schools did that college sports had changed and that those types of conferences didn't work anymore. The Big 8 had not yet declined as the SWC had, but it was masked by Nebraska's great teams of the 90s.
I’m not sure exactly what your point is, but to be honest besides the SEC, in all fairness the ACC, PAC and B1G are all declining if (Big if) your barometer is National titles. Clemson is a beast tOSU and USC has been solid. While the 90s NU teams were great, tbh as a 38 year old now I barely remember the dominance of the Huskers anymore. Great history, but not really a winning program lately.
The big 8 and the rest of the now big 12 schools with the exception of Texas showed solidarity. A&M, CU, Mizzou and Nebraska all left because of UT. UT wanted more money than anyone else and got their wish with their longhorn network. All of the other members of the big 12 were willing to split the pot evenly.
Again, with the exception of the SEC, the other P5 conferences all have a couple of big boys and then the rest. Michigan and tOSU. USC and Oregon. Clemson and FSU. You get the idea. If every conference eliminated their top 2 schools, the remaining schools are not that much different. By that I mean every P5 conference would be declining if they lost their flagship programs.
Having said all this, this is my first year in Georgia and SEC country. Looking forward to Saturdays!
I’m not sure exactly what your point is, but to be honest besides the SEC, in all fairness the ACC, PAC and B1G are all declining if (Big if) your barometer is National titles. Clemson is a beast tOSU and USC has been solid. While the 90s NU teams were great, tbh as a 38 year old now I barely remember the dominance of the Huskers anymore. Great history, but not really a winning program lately.
The big 8 and the rest of the now big 12 schools with the exception of Texas showed solidarity. A&M, CU, Mizzou and Nebraska all left because of UT. UT wanted more money than anyone else and got their wish with their longhorn network. All of the other members of the big 12 were willing to split the pot evenly.
Again, with the exception of the SEC, the other P5 conferences all have a couple of big boys and then the rest. Michigan and tOSU. USC and Oregon. Clemson and FSU. You get the idea. If every conference eliminated their top 2 schools, the remaining schools are not that much different. By that I mean every P5 conference would be declining if they lost their flagship programs.
Having said all this, this is my first year in Georgia and SEC country. Looking forward to Saturdays!
I just read my post and it sounds a little snarky. Sorry!
Not my intention. It’s true that I’m a little bitter and frustrated with UT. KU my Alma mater will still be a great basketball program, but I do have a soft spot for all former Big 8 and Big 12 members. Think about the big 12 with all the original big 12 schools together today. Would be a hell of a football conference.
Dallas-Forth Worth will already be home to an annual high profile SEC matchup with the Red River Rivalry (Texas vs Oklahoma). It's currently based at the Cotton Bowl until 2025. Very likely will be moved to AT&T Stadium in Arlington around that time which will be the inaugural SEC seasons for both teams.
The SEC schedulers probably plan to leave that rivalry intact and in DFW. It may affect the chances the area will be awarded an additional major SEC football event. Annually at least.
One thing walker1962 did get right is the location of the Red River Shootout (I still call it that, sorry). Both fanbases don't agree with each on much but they will agree to never move the game to home and home and/or to AT&T stadium. The tradition, atmosphere with the state fair surrounding it, open air, split down the middle roughly, etc at Fair Park is circled every year. Texas and OU fans would throw a fit if they even discuss moving this game.
I’m not sure exactly what your point is, but to be honest besides the SEC, in all fairness the ACC, PAC and B1G are all declining if (Big if) your barometer is National titles. Clemson is a beast tOSU and USC has been solid. While the 90s NU teams were great, tbh as a 38 year old now I barely remember the dominance of the Huskers anymore. Great history, but not really a winning program lately.
The big 8 and the rest of the now big 12 schools with the exception of Texas showed solidarity. A&M, CU, Mizzou and Nebraska all left because of UT. UT wanted more money than anyone else and got their wish with their longhorn network. All of the other members of the big 12 were willing to split the pot evenly.
Again, with the exception of the SEC, the other P5 conferences all have a couple of big boys and then the rest. Michigan and tOSU. USC and Oregon. Clemson and FSU. You get the idea. If every conference eliminated their top 2 schools, the remaining schools are not that much different. By that I mean every P5 conference would be declining if they lost their flagship programs.
Having said all this, this is my first year in Georgia and SEC country. Looking forward to Saturdays!
One thing walker1962 did get right is the location of the Red River Shootout (I still call it that, sorry). Both fanbases don't agree with each on much but they will agree to never move the game to home and home and/or to AT&T stadium. The tradition, atmosphere with the state fair surrounding it, open air, split down the middle roughly, etc at Fair Park is circled every year. Texas and OU fans would throw a fit if they even discuss moving this game.
Yeah, seems unlikely the game will ever be moved from the Cotton Bowl for the reasons you've outlined. I just tend to become jaded towards how wylie Jerry appears to be in regards to drawing big events to his stadium.
I’m out of town at the moment, so can’t provide links as I’m on my phone.. but it’s been well documented why NU left, and CU got picked off by the PAC as well as Mizzou and A&M leaving the big 12 for the SEC.
Teams in the big 12 did vote for unequal revenue sharing—which consisted primarily of tier 3 media rights. Most teams in the big 12 were willing to allow UT to have some form of flexibility for the Longhorn network. The LHN imho is the reason that eventually OU and UT are coming to the SEC. ESPN wants to get out from under the horrible deal they gave UT for LHN and ESPN would be able to essentially cancel the LHN if the big 12 dissolves. ESPN is paying UT a ridiculous $15MM/year for their tier 3 media rights! Tier 3 is the leftovers after Fox/ abc/ espn pick off big 12 games they want. For KU it meant exhibition basketball games and one football game against a school like East Carolina. (Btw, not hating on ECU or smaller schools because KU routinely gets smacked in football by teams like ecu).
Listen, the point is that UT has been a catalyst in creating division within the SWC, Big 12 and the big 12(with 10 schools). I can provide links if you’d like re: UT’s antics, but no one here cares because this is SEC country.
All I’m saying is that the SEC could have a sore loser on their hands in UT. They COULD (not saying they will) start demanding games at Jerry World. I can almost promise you this will happen. They will not sit around be content with the fact that “if” they win they have a road game for the SEC championship game in Georgia. Texas as a state is growing and is an important market for ESPN. If $$$ really drive tv contracts, it makes sense to have games at Jerry world near Dallas. It brings eyeballs from Austin/SA, Houston and of course Oklahoma and the entire state of Texas. OKC is basically a suburb of the metroplex at this point anyways.
UT is a financial juggernaut. If we take pre pandemic figures, UT was #1 in total sports revenue in the country at $223MM for all sports. More than UGA, BAMA, A&M, UF and LSU. Even last year during the pandemic their athletic department I think made Profit of over $20MM.
Just saying SEC fans, be careful with UT. If they win in football… they’ll be a problem. If they lose in football.. they’ll be a bigger problem due to their pride.
All I’m saying is that the SEC could have a sore loser on their hands in UT. They COULD (not saying they will) start demanding games at Jerry World. I can almost promise you this will happen. They will not sit around be content with the fact that “if” they win they have a road game for the SEC championship game in Georgia. Texas as a state is growing and is an important market for ESPN. If $$$ really drive tv contracts, it makes sense to have games at Jerry world near Dallas. It brings eyeballs from Austin/SA, Houston and of course Oklahoma and the entire state of Texas. OKC is basically a suburb of the metroplex at this point anyways.
I don't think it makes a difference from a $$$$ standpoint if the game is played in Atlanta versus Dallas most of the time. Yes the State of Texas is more populated than Georgia but Georgia also borders Florida, North Carolina, Tennessee, Alabama and South Carolina in an area about the size of the state of Texas, those areas combined have just as many if not more people than the state of Texas even if you exclude South Florida. I still don't think it matters from a revenue standpoint where the SEC championship game is actually played, Texas is not the center of the SEC and never will be heck the SEC headquarters is in Alabama and that's nowhere near the most populous state in the SEC footprint. I can see it rotating to Dallas every so often which is fine, but can't see it staying in Dallas as that will upset too many traditional SEC powers. Georgia, Florida and Alabama are no slouches and traditionally Tennessee is a big power within the SEC as well. I'd imagine most of them would prefer the game either be played in Atlanta or rotated among cities. Texas makes more money than all other schools but they're used to being in a conference where they had more say than anyone and was the only real juggernaut besides Oklahoma. The SEC schools may not make as much revenue as Texas but there are several that aren't behind and it's not just one, but multiple schools on that level. They will be shown the door if they cause too many issues, Texas needed the SEC far more than the SEC needed it.
I’m out of town at the moment, so can’t provide links as I’m on my phone.. but it’s been well documented why NU left, and CU got picked off by the PAC as well as Mizzou and A&M leaving the big 12 for the SEC.
Teams in the big 12 did vote for unequal revenue sharing—which consisted primarily of tier 3 media rights. Most teams in the big 12 were willing to allow UT to have some form of flexibility for the Longhorn network. The LHN imho is the reason that eventually OU and UT are coming to the SEC. ESPN wants to get out from under the horrible deal they gave UT for LHN and ESPN would be able to essentially cancel the LHN if the big 12 dissolves. ESPN is paying UT a ridiculous $15MM/year for their tier 3 media rights! Tier 3 is the leftovers after Fox/ abc/ espn pick off big 12 games they want. For KU it meant exhibition basketball games and one football game against a school like East Carolina. (Btw, not hating on ECU or smaller schools because KU routinely gets smacked in football by teams like ecu).
Listen, the point is that UT has been a catalyst in creating division within the SWC, Big 12 and the big 12(with 10 schools). I can provide links if you’d like re: UT’s antics, but no one here cares because this is SEC country.
All I’m saying is that the SEC could have a sore loser on their hands in UT. They COULD (not saying they will) start demanding games at Jerry World. I can almost promise you this will happen. They will not sit around be content with the fact that “if” they win they have a road game for the SEC championship game in Georgia. Texas as a state is growing and is an important market for ESPN. If $$$ really drive tv contracts, it makes sense to have games at Jerry world near Dallas. It brings eyeballs from Austin/SA, Houston and of course Oklahoma and the entire state of Texas. OKC is basically a suburb of the metroplex at this point anyways.
UT is a financial juggernaut. If we take pre pandemic figures, UT was #1 in total sports revenue in the country at $223MM for all sports. More than UGA, BAMA, A&M, UF and LSU. Even last year during the pandemic their athletic department I think made Profit of over $20MM.
Just saying SEC fans, be careful with UT. If they win in football… they’ll be a problem. If they lose in football.. they’ll be a bigger problem due to their pride.
I mean that's on ESPN. If ESPN gave KU or OU that contract, they would make more than Texas. In fact OU made just as much as Texas until Texas got the LHN. I would go as far to say if ESPN gave Nebraska that contract, they would have stayed in the Big 12. Colorado always wanted to go to the Pac 10 and they saw an out. I don't see why this is just Texas. The rest of the major money making big 12 teams are just as culpable. Also about the SWC, that was more about it being to centric to the state of Texas. No money was being made because no eyes were watching it besides one state. The game was changing even in the 80s financially. In reality, Texas, Texas A&M, and Arkansas saw the writing on the wall and wanted out. The SMU death penalty thing just expedited things. But that conference was a dead man walking as early as the early 90s.
Bottom line, if the Big 12 wanted equal revenue sharing, all they had to do is vote against the schools that wanted unequal revenue sharing. Each school only got one vote.
I mean that's on ESPN. If ESPN gave KU or OU that contract, they would make more than Texas. In fact OU made just as much as Texas until Texas got the LHN. I would go as far to say if ESPN gave Nebraska that contract, they would have stayed in the Big 12. Colorado always wanted to go to the Pac 10 and they saw an out. I don't see why this is just Texas. The rest of the major money making big 12 teams are just as culpable. Also about the SWC, that was more about it being to centric to the state of Texas. No money was being made because no eyes were watching it besides one state. The game was changing even in the 80s financially. In reality, Texas, Texas A&M, and Arkansas saw the writing on the wall and wanted out. The SMU death penalty thing just expedited things. But that conference was a dead man walking as early as the early 90s.
Bottom line, if the Big 12 wanted equal revenue sharing, all they had to do is vote against the schools that wanted unequal revenue sharing. Each school only got one vote.
conference realignment does not happen unless the $$ is there. ESPN, ABC, FOX CBS (before they lost the SEC) don’t just give out contracts before teams are added or subtracted. If you were a P5 commissioner, you wouldn’t be doing your job unless you check with the networks first.
UT ran the big 12. It was not a democracy. The schools that had the clout moved on. (CU, Mizzou, A&M, NU). The “contract” is on ESPN. I agree. The issue is that ESPN does not want to continue to pay $15MM for a failing longhorn network. ESPN did not offer a huge tier 3 media rights deal to anyone else. There’s a reason for that. As successful as OU is, they still didn’t get as money as Texas. KU was #3 in the big 12 in tier 3 revenue, but that’s only because every KU fan and Kansas City watches every single KU basketball game.
The state of Texas has the eyeballs. Oklahoma and Kansas do not.
Please remember. ESPN did not give out contracts to other schools because they didn’t drive viewership.
Equal revenue sharing was never an option. UT controlled Dan Beene and Bob Bowlsby. They were just a mouthpiece. If you need any confirmation on that, UT and OU didn’t even tell Bob about their plans to leave the big 12 until they applied for membership to the SEC. Do you think that would’ve happened to Sankey?
Even TCU and WVU added to the big 12-2 was all Texas. UT blocked SMU/Houston/Louisville and BYU to the big 12. Everyone had to accept it.
I don't think it makes a difference from a $$$$ standpoint if the game is played in Atlanta versus Dallas most of the time. Yes the State of Texas is more populated than Georgia but Georgia also borders Florida, North Carolina, Tennessee, Alabama and South Carolina in an area about the size of the state of Texas, those areas combined have just as many if not more people than the state of Texas even if you exclude South Florida. I still don't think it matters from a revenue standpoint where the SEC championship game is actually played, Texas is not the center of the SEC and never will be heck the SEC headquarters is in Alabama and that's nowhere near the most populous state in the SEC footprint. I can see it rotating to Dallas every so often which is fine, but can't see it staying in Dallas as that will upset too many traditional SEC powers. Georgia, Florida and Alabama are no slouches and traditionally Tennessee is a big power within the SEC as well. I'd imagine most of them would prefer the game either be played in Atlanta or rotated among cities. Texas makes more money than all other schools but they're used to being in a conference where they had more say than anyone and was the only real juggernaut besides Oklahoma. The SEC schools may not make as much revenue as Texas but there are several that aren't behind and it's not just one, but multiple schools on that level. They will be shown the door if they cause too many issues, Texas needed the SEC far more than the SEC needed it.
You're going to combine neighboring states of Georgia to make your point but don't combine neighboring states of Texas - Oklahoma, Arkansas, Louisiana? NC doesn't border Georgia but if you want to include them then Kansas and Missouri can drive to Dallas too. BTW, Texas has the second largest endowment in the country behind only Harvard and I can with confidence more wealthy alumni than any school in the sunbelt for a variety of reasons. I think they and ND are the two schools that will have no problem joining any conference in the country.
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