MARTA looking at light rail, bus line options to expand the Clifton corridor (Atlanta: home, buses)

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by JulianMabowski

After they pulled that switcharoo with Clayton county and told them they were going to do buses instead of rail I was done with MARTA. Worst transit agency in America. Atlanta is a great city that deserves better.

Worse than that, was the way they designed said "BRT". Meandering and loopy like, with seemingly zero desire for a straight or efficient route, or any chance at attracting any choice riders.

They know with Clayton they don't need to worry about choice riders, so they can take advantage of that. Whole thing is lame and sad. Clayton deserved so much better after finally joining MARTA after all those years.

[MattCW]

Originally Posted by SEAandATL

Yes it does. It deserves privatized transit and not something that sucks up and wastes tax payer money. *SNIP*

And I'd like Warren Buffett to drop by my house and give me a spare $Billion he isn't using, but that isn't going to happen either. Even in Japan, just today, the supposed gold standard for "private transit," I read that they were adding a transit tax. We just need to get rid of MARTA's leadership and that includes rooting out the middle managers. The board and CEOs may have changed, but the middle management, I guarantee you, is sticking around from regime to regime. Now getting rid of them might include a private component. Contract out MARTA to an operator like Keolis or Herzog or Bombardier.

[primaltech]

Yeah, since it's all in theory under the Atlanta-region Transit Link Authority (the ATL) now, maybe they could do something like that. Semi-privatize MARTA, while keeping all the existing contracts and taxes and legal obligations and assets in place. Just having a totally fresh group come in and run it.

I think they could increase the fare a little bit, like maybe to $3.00 or $3.50. That $2.50 fare hasn't changed in a long time, to keep up with any inflation.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by primaltech

I don't know how they plan to design it, but here's one way they could design a Clifton BRT that wouldn't terribly suck. If they do it as like an elevated busway, or 'skyway'.

Picks up passengers at Lindbergh station and loops around via the existing Garson Dr and Lindbergh Ln:

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.8220...7i16384!8i8192

Bus goes down Garson Dr, which they might have to widen so that they could have bus-only lanes (I'm not sure if that road gets much traffic or not):

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.8199...7i16384!8i8192

Somewhere right around here, after the Passion City Church, the bus turns onto a new elevated roadway (with 1 lane in each direction), that's very strictly for buses only, with cameras and heavy fines and such:

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.8179...7i16384!8i8192

Then you're running on a narrow elevated busway (just 1 lane each direction is all that would be needed), supported by T supports along the CSX railroad corridor. No traffic delays at all. It would fly right over Piedmont, I-85, and the Buford-Spring, then fly over Cheshire Bridge, with a station on the east side of Cheshire Bridge, maybe about 200 ft east:

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.8092.../data=!3m1!1e3

Since it's a strictly BRT-vehicle only special roadway, you wouldn't need special turn outs for the stations or anything. Just the same lane.

Then same idea, keep it elevated all the way, to minimize the width of the footprint in the rail corridor, and have the next station west of Briarcliff, then the CDC and Emory stations as it continues along, elevated above the freight rail.

Then the elevated busway portion of it would end and connect into N Decatur Rd above the rail tracks probably:

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.7907...7i16384!8i8192

Then it's just a matter of a bus-only lane (center-aligned would be ideal), along N Decatur/Clairmont/Commerce Dr, right into the bus loop area of the Decatur MARTA station.

These are good ideas, but they are going to require years of study, and a LOT of consultants.

[primaltech]

I think they already have studied it, or are almost done.

https://www.itsmarta.com/marta-advan...ideration.aspx

"An extensive series of public engagement meetings - both virtual and in-person - will be held in June and July to present possible alignments and receive feedback."

Which I'm sure will include long and detailed explanatory YouTube videos like they did recently for Campbellton BRT.

Anyway, BRT can be an awesome, quality transit solution (and also affordable), if it's designed right, for the highest quality and speed. Like, I think the Clayton BRT is absolutely horrible, but not because it's BRT. Because it's a crap design.

If you do BRT right, it should like this, or better:





If you run something to that standard (with no shortcuts), on all the arterials and freeways in Metro Atlanta, then people will ride. But if you cut corners in the design to try to save money, it backfires, and people will just see it as another bus.

[JulianMabowski]

Meanwhile Seattle is constructing a new $54 billion dollar railway system that will put it on par with Chicago and DC. The city, county, state, and top companies headquarted in the city are all on board and helped pitch money for the project. And the city is competitive and dense enough to get federal rail dollars. Pretty much the polar opposite is happening here smh.


Just look at Atlantic Station bus lane to see a preview of how this future BRT will look. Useless, just like the downtown streetcar

[primaltech]

Something like this for Clifton BRT would be awesome:



I can also see that type of elevated design on I-75 out to Cumberland, and other corridors like that. Maybe Peachtree Rd.

If you design it like an elevated skyway, then the only ground impact is the supports, and you get a nice view when riding the bus. Feels kind of luxurious.

Originally Posted by JulianMabowski

Just look at Atlantic Station bus lane to see a preview of how this future BRT will look. Useless, just like the downtown streetcar

That's fixable at least, if they'd re-align the bus lane to the center median. Having the "bus lane" be a shared right hand turn lane is terrible design on all fronts.

It all stems down to whether they want to make transit continue to be an afterthought in that region, or if they want serious transit.

Once upon a time (the 1980's), Atlanta and MARTA was building serious mass rapid transit. It can be done.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by primaltech

Something like this for Clifton BRT would be awesome:



I can also see that type of elevated design on I-75 out to Cumberland, and other corridors like that. Maybe Peachtree Rd.

If you design it like an elevated skyway, then the only ground impact is the supports, and you get a nice view when riding the bus. Feels kind of luxurious.



That's fixable at least, if they'd re-align the bus lane to the center median. Having the "bus lane" be a shared right hand turn lane is terrible design on all fronts.

It all stems down to whether they want to make transit continue to be an afterthought in that region, or if they want serious transit.

Once upon a time (the 1980's), Atlanta and MARTA was building serious mass rapid transit. It can be done.

There is zero chance of the community allowing an elevated BRT.

With the RR ROW, they should have a good, almost entirely grade separated path from Lindberg to Clairmont by the VA Hospital. That was always the most logical path, but for whatever reason they could never work that out. But at Clairmont is where it gets trickier.

[bu2]

They've morphed this project from HRT to LRT now to BRT over the last dozen years. The whole BRT probably could have been built with what they've spent on consultants and public hearings.

[SEAandATL]

This is why Atlanta will never be the Tokyo of America.