Is Austin really "liberal" or is it Libertarian?

[Austin97]

Originally Posted by pentalarc

In my opinion, the biggest violation of libertarian ideas in Austin was the passing of an anti-smoking ordinance that severely restricted smoking in bars. That's a violation of individual rights, but since it didn't involve guns or taxes, the "libertarians" were silent.

It's actually a violation of property rights. Specifically the right to make the rules in your property (business). However many times multiple people's rights conflict. The smoking ban puts peoples right to a safe work environment above others pleasure in smoking.

If you have the right to free medical health care, do you also have the right to abuse your body?

[TheHarvester]

Originally Posted by Austin97

...many times multiple people's rights conflict. The smoking ban puts peoples right to a safe work environment above others pleasure in smoking.

Right on. Extreme Libertarianism contains its own demise via internal contradictions like the one you just pointed out.

My best friend's father, a wise old psychiatrist (now long gone), once said to me "As long as there is at least one other person in the world, you can't do what you want."

[SonySegaTendo617]

Originally Posted by Austin97

It's actually a violation of property rights. Specifically the right to make the rules in your property (business). However many times multiple people's rights conflict. The smoking ban puts peoples right to a safe work environment above others pleasure in smoking.

I know what you're saying about the rights of people conflicting, but I don't think a total ban was the right way to balance the rights of people, when it comes to this issue. That said, I think Austin would've been much better if they had ONLY banned smoking in truly public places(such as government buildings, public transit, school/college buildings, etc.), and continued to allow private business owners the right to decide their smoking policies, IF exterior signage was posting stating their smoking policy. And as a matter of fact, there are certain communities that did choose to only require exterior signage if a private business chooses to allow smoking, over outright bans, such as New Haven, Indiana, or Lake St. Louis, Missouri(former is a suburb of Fort Wayne, and the latter is a St. Louis suburb). This way, non-smokers who outright want to avoid smoking-allowed establishments continue to have that right to do so, and smokers who want to find a smoker-friendly business can continue to find such establishments.

Maybe it's just as well that the enforcement part of Austin's ban was struck down in a federal court ruling earlier this year. Not to mention at the same time as when Austin voted for a total ban, Amarillo had the sense to very narrowly vote down a similar proposal. Just one non-Austinian's take on the ban is, which for all I know, may be either vastly different, or perhaps similar, to an average Austin resident's view of the ban.

[love roses]

Good Points. I agree. The above quote, as true and witty as it is, can also be meant for the people who want to ban everything.

[mikejj2004]

As a libertarian who is living in Austin, I feel I am qualified to weigh in on this subject. I live here because of my parents, who yes are liberal and my overall opinion is that Austin is overwhelmingly liberal as opposed to other parts of Texas. Austin has ~ 740,000 people and a $2.5 billion budget = $3378 per capita of spending. Dallas is ~ 1,240,000 people and and a $2.7 billion budget = $2177. I live in a part of south Austin that stadles urban with suburban. I notice if I go a little toward downtown you can just feel how liberal it is while in the suburbs you do see alot of Ron Paul type signs, but overall its more liberal if you ask me.

[carolinajack]

where is Circle C? Is it conservative area of Austin?