Take the job in Austin, or stay put in Madison? [Repost] (San Antonio: apartment, movers)

[Testudines]

[Reposted from City vs. City--not many takers there]

As April ran into May, and Winter still refused to break in Madison, my wife's seasonal affective disorder continued apace. Or maybe it was the pregnancy. Either way, we got to thinking that it might be nice to move someplace warm and sunny.

Austin appealed to us because of the well-known similarities between the two cities, along with it's larger size and a promising job opportunity.

I went down for a quick round of interviews and did my best to explore. On the night of my arrival, I took the bus to Old West Austin, walked up W. Lynn St., and had dinner at Zocalo. The next night, I took the bus down into Bouldin and walked through Zilker and Barton Hills (and then got on the wrong bus trying to head home and ended up in Rollingwood--could have been worse, I guess).

I really liked the architectural mix--Victorians, craftsman bungalows, ultra-modern, and, my favorite, Texas limestone with terra cotta roofs. I also really like the palms and succulents.

One thing that grabbed me, though, was the paucity of sidewalks, both in the quiet residential areas and, shockingly, even in some of the downtown areas. I also had a little trouble transitioning from one neighborhood to another. Seems that there was often a curvy, sidewalk-free connector leading to a busy arterial along which I had to walk a block or so to get to a controlled intersection. My wife and I had similar impressions during visit#2, a week-long trip during which we made a great effort to explore as many of the closer-in neighborhoods as we could.

Exhausted, we returned home to our comfortable, highly walkable, Willy St. neighborhood (and picture-perfect weather to boot, although we promised ourselves that we wouldn't let the 3 months of sublime weather here make us forget how brutal it can be). We're really torn. We need help! Here's a list of our considerations--we'd much appreciate input from the community:

Family: If we move to Austin, my in-laws would at least visit more often and may even move there. That would be a huge help for my wife, who's home with two little ones. Austin.

Climate: A big reason we're looking to move. At first blush, clearly favors Austin. I did hear something ominous on NPR the other day, though (no! NPR? ominous?): "If it continues long enough, it's not really a drought; it's desertification."

Geography: The hill country is pretty, and Barton Spring pool is like a crown jewel. On the other hand, Madison has its beautiful lakes (and we're fortunate to live a half block from Monona and a nice little lakefront park). Plus, it's a short drive to Milwaukee/lake Michigan and a longer drive to Door County, the north woods, etc. I favor Madison here, but that may just reflect my lack of familiarity with the rest of Texas. Would be interested to hear additional opinions.

People: We met really nice people down in Austin, and have a rich network here in Madison that we'd be sad to leave behind. Austin struck me a just a little more frenzied, but still, I had no doubt that we'd find our people down there. Push.

Flora: As above, I really like the southwestern flora; it reminds me that I'm someplace exotic. Purely subjective, but I favor Austin here. My wife disagrees--although I argue that you can't judge from a mid-August visit, she was turned off by the crispiness. How lush does it get down there in the cooler months?

Architecture: Austin, hands down.

Transportation: The lack of sidewalks was a real disappointment. I really enjoy walking just a few easy blocks to many of the businesses we patronize regularly. Madison has great commuter bike trails and lanes--I bike along the lake to get to work. The bus systems seemed comparable. Auto traffic is probably worse in Austin, being larger, but was nothing like I saw in southern CA. I think Madison wins this one, but would love to hear from people who have found a niche that combines some measure of peacefulness with easy access to services. Barton Hills? (My job would be on the northeast corner of the university, and sometimes I need to get there in a hurry, so we can't live too far out).

Job: Oh yeah, that. It's definitely a growth opportunity, with its attendant risks and rewards. My current job is very good, stable, comfortable. I wouldn't be looking to leave it but for the weather/family issues above. Push.

Thanks for reading my long (and very first) posting!

[centralaustinite]

Two things strike me:

One: does your wife really have seasonal affective disorder? If so, Austin will be a huge plus. Probably 300 days of sunny or mostly sunny weather. It can transform a person with SAD.

Two: do you really have a job offer here? And it gives you room to grow? plus, plus.

Yes, it is hot here, yes the sidewalks are poor. But you can definitely craft a wonderful life in the close-in neighborhoods you mentioned but do you have the ability to afford those neighborhoods? That is probably the crucial question.

I managed to survive four Iowa winters and one Chicago winter. I could never handle one winter in Madison. Makes a recent-setting hot summer seem like nothing, but that's just me.

good luck!

[Trainwreck20]

I can tell you that my sister in law that moved down from MN due to SAD is very happy in New Braunfels.

As for your other points, you seem to sum most of them up well from your own point of view, which no one on here can do for you; that said, a few comments:

All my in-laws have moved down here recently (sister, mother, father) and my family all lives withing an hour or so (Boerne, Austin, Fredricksburg). We have two small children (<5 y/o) and it is truly wonderful to have the extended family of grandparents, cousins, and aunts/uncles so close. In hindsight, I would have made this a goal earlier, but it kind of happened anyway.

As for the current drought, it is unlikely that any real climate change will occur in an individual's lifetime. This area may become more arid over the years, but we had record rainfall four years ago, now record heat/lack of rain.

In many regards, Madison is probably geographically more interesting to many people; however, if you range of travel is big enough, the coast and hill country can be nice, as can the piney woods to the East. You will have to adapt to 'short' (i.e. Oak) trees if you do come down here.

[cjawalt]

If you and your family are comfortable in Madison with a good stable job, it sounds to me that it all depends on how much the job is worth. Obviously worth going to Austin to evaluate the job and relocation. I would not relocate just to relocate without a solid reason that would be worth the expense and inconvenience of moving my family. And these days, job income and stability are typically top priorities. As my dad use to say, go to where the job is cuz you gotta put food on the table and keep the family happy.

The location, culture, schools, landscape, etc. are secondary perks, at least in my opinion. Don't fall for the grass is greener perspective, life could turn out more difficult if you move. Consider yourself fortunate for what you have, but likewise do not pass up an opportunity to improve the quality of you and your family's life if the invesment is worth the risk. And only you and your wife can decide that.

For example, if you had said your Madison job was a dead end and the Austin job offered a little more pay and quality of life, I would be calling the movers.

[sinking]

Moving here for SAD can backfire since if she is not used to the oppressive heat she will likely spend most of her time inside in the summer netting LESS sun exposure than in WI.

Also it does not get lush here ever. It may get central Texans version of lush but that isn't even close to what I saw in NE Texas which isn't even close to the northern part of the country.

[mark311]

Originally Posted by Testudines

[Reposted from City vs. City--not many takers there]

I really liked the architectural mix--Victorians, craftsman bungalows, ultra-modern, and, my favorite, Texas limestone with terra cotta roofs. I also really like the palms and succulents.

I agree with Centralaustinite in that it sounds like the areas that you explored could work for you, but did you actually look at housing prices in those areas?

You might really like the architectural mix as stated above, but can you afford to buy anything like what you spoke of above or do you mind appreciating that architecture while living in more of a cookie-cutter home or apartment? Yes, you can get a 1900 square foot house in Barton Hills that was built in the 50's for just under $400K or a 1200 square foot house for $275K. If that's what you're expecting then it sounds like it could definitely work.

The big question here is what's your budget and what kind of home do you want to live in?

[someguyatx]

Based on your description I think the family part might be toughest for you. I think some people are experiencing SAD this summer, I know I am. Its too hot to to anything unless you get up early or go out late. I wake up early on the weekend to cut the grass or work on the car and I walk the dog at 1030 at night. Its even too hot to go swimming unless you have a backyard pool that is shaded. I dont want to scare people away because I do like living here but its not the land of milk and honey.

[Dr.Mom]

Not to add to your dilemma, but don't forget to look at the schools in those close in neighborhoods. Some are decidedly better than others. There is also the option of private school, but again that's more $$$.

[Testudines]

Thanks for the helpful comments--obviously we'll have to make our own value judgments in the end, but we appreciate hearing all the different perspectives.

To address some of the follow-up questions:

1. SAD is a self-diagnosis, and may not satisfy DSM IV criteria. My wonderful wife is pretty down in the winter, cooped up with a rambunctious toddler who sheds layers of clothing as fast as we can get them on her. Now there's a baby in the mix. I'm insulated to a great extent by being busy at work, where, as they say, it's 72 and fluorescent all day.

The point about being cooped up due to the heat is well-taken. At least it's sunny, though. As an interesting aside, I have a friend who practices psychiatry in Seattle, and he reports that it is the gloomy skies, and not really the rain, that keeps him busy.

I figure that even if its 105 during the day, you can still go outside for a little bit when it drops to 85 or 90 in the early morning or late evening. The reverse isn't true: if it's -5 at night, it doesn't help that much if it goes up to +8 during the height of the day. Although, if it's one of those sunny, cold days, I will sometimes go for a walk . . .

2. Yes, there is a job, and we'll be able to afford decent housing and schooling. It has some shortcomings, as they all do, and there's a risk that I'll be trading a good, steady job for a higher-paying, but more stressful, one. The job I've got is the devil I know.

Thanks again for the helpful comments.

[Bo]

I moved to San Antonio from Madison in 2002 and I would do it again. Madison's a unique place, but I felt like it had lost some of its charm when I went back for a visit a couple of years ago.

Don't get so hung up on the difference between Madison's and Austin's summer weather. The warm winters in south Texas are such a huge improvement. You can leave your snow shovel and your down outerwear behind in Madison.

The traffic in Austin is much, much worse than what you're leaving behind in Madison. You should take whatever advice you can get from folks in this forum on ways to minimize the challenge of your commute.

If you want an unvarnished opinion of Austin from a former Madisonian who doesn't live there but visits it a few x a year, feel free to send me a DM.