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Old 11-09-2011, 06:50 PM
 
161 posts, read 349,314 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Kim View Post
It's a code word for lefty resentment of families fleeing failing urban areas for safer environs.
Actually, the recent trend among young, affluent families has been to reconverge within the city center. Suburbs, which have historically been a byproduct of white flight, are now increasingly attracting the proletariat lower class.

It's happening in major cities across the country, and has always been the case in Austin.
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Old 11-10-2011, 06:06 PM
 
19 posts, read 34,333 times
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If you're a teen, nothing but boredom and food.
X(
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Old 11-11-2011, 04:01 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
16,772 posts, read 43,260,193 times
Reputation: 9351
Quote:
Originally Posted by homeinatx View Post
I agree. It is a major problem, but worse in the sunbelt U.S. than anywhere else. There are also many cities that boomed in the same era that managed to avoid the problems of sprawl. Vancouver would be the most obvious one. The lawsuits and bailout of the awful Circle C are the historical events that enabled Austin to sprawl in the hideous way it has.
Funny you should point to Circle C as such a horrible place to live, when it is one of the most desirable and sought after places to live in Austin. Property values prove that.

While average property values in Austin are: $214,300 //www.city-data.com/city/Austin-Texas.html

Those in Circle C are: $354,135 //www.city-data.com/zips/78739.html

Why are so many people willing to pay more to live in Circle C then in the rest of the City?
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Old 11-11-2011, 05:13 PM
 
1,410 posts, read 2,303,140 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CptnRn View Post
Funny you should point to Circle C as such a horrible place to live, when it is one of the most desirable and sought after places to live in Austin. Property values prove that.

While average property values in Austin are: $214,300 //www.city-data.com/city/Austin-Texas.html

Those in Circle C are: $354,135 //www.city-data.com/zips/78739.html

Why are so many people willing to pay more to live in Circle C then in the rest of the City?
If you believe the market is the arbiter of all value, Circle C is indeed a more desirable place to live.

I don't.

What other development in Austin was tied up in the courts for over a decade, effectively gutted the city's environmental protection standards, creating the legal patchwork for the sprawl to come, was deeply implicated in the Savings and Loans debacle and required a 72 million dollar taxpayer bailout? If you can tell me about another one with as disgraceful and consequential a history, I am willing to spread the hate. Those are my objective reasons for calling Circle C "awful" in a thread about sprawl

Subjectively, all that and then all we get is ticky tacky cookie cutter houses ruining what had been pristine hill-sides, and besides taxes, contributes nothing to the cultural or civic fabric of the city. Some people like that, doesn't mean it's not horrible.
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Old 11-11-2011, 05:46 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
16,772 posts, read 43,260,193 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by homeinatx View Post
If you believe the market is the arbiter of all value, Circle C is indeed a more desirable place to live.

I don't.

What other development in Austin was tied up in the courts for over a decade, effectively gutted the city's environmental protection standards, creating the legal patchwork for the sprawl to come, was deeply implicated in the Savings and Loans debacle and required a 72 million dollar taxpayer bailout? If you can tell me about another one with as disgraceful and consequential a history, I am willing to spread the hate. Those are my objective reasons for calling Circle C "awful" in a thread about sprawl

Subjectively, all that and then all we get is ticky tacky cookie cutter houses ruining what had been pristine hill-sides, and besides taxes, contributes nothing to the cultural or civic fabric of the city. Some people like that, doesn't mean it's not horrible.
No question your descriptions of what happened with the developments of Circle C are "subjective". I lived in and observed the development battles in this part of town for the last thirty years.

The fact is all of those develoments were developed within the requirements of the City of Austin Development Ordinances, and approved by them!
They were all approved by the City of Austin! So, if they were so shameful, then SHAME ON the City of Austin!

Those developments met and exceeded the development standards that apply to all other part of Austin. Show me one other development in Austin that has as much green space, as many parks and amenities, as low an impervious cover and as much environmental sensitivity as Circle C.

Last edited by CptnRn; 11-11-2011 at 06:17 PM..
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Old 11-11-2011, 06:39 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
12,065 posts, read 10,739,572 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CptnRn View Post
Show me one other development in Austin that has as much green space, as many parks and amenities, as low an impervious cover and as much environmental sensitivity as Circle C.
Steiner Ranch.
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Old 11-11-2011, 07:19 PM
 
Location: Not Moving
970 posts, read 1,647,922 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 80SC View Post
Actually, the recent trend among young, affluent families has been to reconverge within the city center. Suburbs, which have historically been a byproduct of white flight, are now increasingly attracting the proletariat lower class.

It's happening in major cities across the country, and has always been the case in Austin.

Affluent "families?" OR, affluent singles, and empty-nesters? I really don't think families are moving downtown. Affluent no children, yes. Not families.
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Old 11-11-2011, 10:20 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,790 posts, read 39,688,484 times
Reputation: 24213
Quote:
Originally Posted by CptnRn View Post
No question your descriptions of what happened with the developments of Circle C are "subjective". I lived in and observed the development battles in this part of town for the last thirty years.

The fact is all of those develoments were developed within the requirements of the City of Austin Development Ordinances, and approved by them!
They were all approved by the City of Austin! So, if they were so shameful, then SHAME ON the City of Austin!

Those developments met and exceeded the development standards that apply to all other part of Austin. Show me one other development in Austin that has as much green space, as many parks and amenities, as low an impervious cover and as much environmental sensitivity as Circle C.
Yep, I've been here through all those battles, too, Cptn Ron. And, yes, shame on the City of Austin for a lot of what happened then and continues to happen now.
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Old 11-12-2011, 12:07 AM
 
161 posts, read 349,314 times
Reputation: 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by N. Olikee View Post
Affluent "families?" OR, affluent singles, and empty-nesters? I really don't think families are moving downtown. Affluent no children, yes. Not families.
When I use the term 'city center' to describe this phenomenon, I'm mostly talking about the neighborhoods bordering downtown, not necessarily downtown proper.

The most desirable (and affluent) parts of Austin--save Westlake--have always been the close-in neighborhoods. This is in stark contrast to most metros in which the city center is run down and poor, and the exurbs are aspirational enclaves.
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Old 11-12-2011, 07:36 AM
 
Location: Not Moving
970 posts, read 1,647,922 times
Reputation: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80SC View Post
When I use the term 'city center' to describe this phenomenon, I'm mostly talking about the neighborhoods bordering downtown, not necessarily downtown proper.

The most desirable (and affluent) parts of Austin--save Westlake--have always been the close-in neighborhoods. This is in stark contrast to most metros in which the city center is run down and poor, and the exurbs are aspirational enclaves.
What the heck are you talking about? Be specific.....I'm a Native Houstonian.
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