Why I'm leaving Austin: An 8th Generation Austinite's observations (Houston: restaurants, costs)

[EzPeterson]

Yup. Total crap. Really bummed I don't have a highrise here.
That 2 minute commute and the 15 minute drive to the commuter rail "potato, pohtato" that can take me downtown in 45 minutes are just too great of a hassle.

Build more roads!

[TexasHorseLady]

One thing that would help would be urban islands where large employers (and small ones) are encouraged to locate their businesses (and the jobs that go with them) in areas other than downtown, which lessens the commute for most of the people because, as I've learned in my business, most people will locate near where they work, at least initially. Yes, there will always be people who change jobs and move clear across town, but that's a minority and does not lessen the positive impact of this idea. This also increases walkability for a larger number of people if done right. Entertainment and interesting shopping is already spread around the area (as I said, when I'm in Austin I'm pretty much anywhere but downtown, shopping, dining, enjoying entertainment opportunities), but this would encourage even more of such.

There's just no need for downtown to be the sole center of a city's life. That it's been traditionally done that way and some cities still do doesn't make it sacred. The more Austin is encouraged to go that way, the worse things get - can we learn nothing from that but keep on trying to make it work just because that's the way it's always been done? That, in and of itself, is an indicator of a lessening of what's made Austin a place that draws people.

[sws9]

Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady

Perhaps we will. But I DO have some personal experience with both experiences and both can be equally painful in a very similar, feeling powerless in the face of rape of your body or your city and being told you shouldn't, sort of way.

As a survivor I could not pass this one up. This is unbelievably insulting and degrading to make this type of comparison. I find it very hard to believe you've experienced rape and find a growing city that you do not wish to grow to be anywhere near in the same universe, let alone the same level of pain. Appalling.

[TexasHorseLady]

sws9, not all survivors feel the same way. As evidenced by the difference between the way you and I view things.

[sws9]

Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady

sws9, not all survivors feel the same way. As evidenced by the difference between the way you and I view things.

Exactly. So don't deign to speak for them and challenge others by saying you know better than they do on the subject as you did to a PP.

[sws9]

Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady

If people who live here and love it because they don't WANT to live in a major city and wouldn't if you paid them are sad that the city they love is being destroyed, the problem is not really with them. That's like someone telling a woman who objects to being raped that not appreciating what's happening to her means that the problem is in her because, after all, the rapist is happy with what's happening!

Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady

Perhaps we will. But I DO have some personal experience with both experiences and both can be equally painful in a very similar, feeling powerless in the face of rape of your body or your city and being told you shouldn't, sort of way.

Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady

The comparison is apt, I think. It's much like saying to the victims of witch burnings, "If you were a really GOOD person you'd APPRECIATE that we're doing this for your own good, to save your soul." Or to the victims of rape that they should appreciate the great opportunity of the experience that they're having. (By the way, I'm pretty sure I'm in a better position than you to say what's unfair to the latter.)

Again, if you truly are a survivor and feel this way, I guess good for you. But to use it in an argument as though that were a typical response of survivors, suggesting you know better ... I have to wonder what exactly you feel you were subjected to that you are referring to as rape.

[TexasHorseLady]

Originally Posted by sws9

Exactly. So don't deign to speak for them and challenge others by saying you know better than they do on the subject as you did to a PP.

Back at you.

[ognend]

Originally Posted by Komeht

You gave up any credibility about complaining about the hassle of going downtown when you moved a 60 mile round trip commute away. Really - what's the hassle for you? Fighting forty-five minutes of stop and go traffic or the 5 minutes it takes to find a parking spot in a garage and walk three pleasant blocks to your destination.

It is such a myth that Austin downtown is a hassle to get around in. Today I had a 3 pm appointment so I went a little early to take care of some errands. It took me a little longer than usual to get downtown because texas relays caused me to miss a light. 12 minutes instead of usual 8 - ah the aggravation!

I parked in a garage - lots of parking (free on weekends too - nice!). Walked downstairs, grabbed a coffee and a loaf of bread at my favorite bakery. Ran into a friend I hadn't seen in a while - killed about 20 minutes in chit chat. Walked towards my appointment, waived to two other people I know across the street. Walked into a shop, almost bought a new bike - so glad I was able to resist this time. Next time I bet they get me - then I won't even have to drive on nice days like today.

Anyway, ran into another friend/associate - he was glad he ran into me because he has a little piece of business he'd like to throw my way - nice! We grabbed a sandwich at the nearest place and sketched out a little deal. Window shopped at three other stores and finally reached my destination. Had my appointment, took a different route back to car, picked up some food for dinner. Flirted with a bunch of tourists taking a segway tour of Austin. Were they visiting from Germany? Nope. They were from Round Rock. That's right - they were from Round Rock and had to take a Segway Tour of downtown Austin because, and I quote, "we've never been here before".

I logged a total of 6.2 miles on car and burned about a 1/4 of a gallon of gas.

Contrast that experience with my typical nightmare of shopping in sprawl. Drive out along a major freeway 10 or 15 miles, take exit and get stuck in 15 minutes of traffic on the frontage road. Drive into massive parking lot and park in the middle of a flat concrete lot. Cross about an acre of parking and cars squinting my eyes from the glare of the harsh sun beating down on the concrete. Walk into soulless big box store - grab item I'm looking for as fast as possible so as to spend not one more second in place than I absolutely have to. Cross acre of parking and drive to another parking lot a quarter mile as the crow flies but I have to drive 4 miles around a free way to get to it. Rinse and repeat.

Thanks but no thanks - I'll take the "hassle" of going downtown over that crap any day of the week.

Wow. Are you one of those folks who put next to their profession: socialite?

What shopping do you speak of in downtown Austin? I work there and aside from food establishments and a few overpriced stores, I see no appealing "shopping".

Austin on the whole is a nice town, albeit overrated and too self indulged. The funny thing about being overrated and self-indulged is that the "old time" Austinites feel less enthusiastic about it than the swarms of newcomers who are occupying the city, for all the wrong reasons. There are only so many tight jeans and "weird people" sights you can take in before you start feeling like you have walked into a replicator that just keeps replicating. There is such a thing as "too much of the same". Not to mention that having intense feelings of being special and superior inevitably leads to irrelevance.

I have lived in Europe, New York City, Canada, Missouri, south Florida etc. Been exposed to rural, big city, European city etc. You have a nice town here in Austin. The problem is, it is going into the extreme and in my humble opinion, extremes are never good in the long run. There is a difference between normal, funky, weird and fake-trying-too-much.

Just my two cents,
OD

[malarkey]

Originally Posted by mickey65

Which is why I like Round Rock and rarely ever venture down to Austin towards the crowds of people and traffic....

See, to me this is sad. I'm not picking on you personally Mickey, but when I hear people say "I avoid downtown at ALL COSTS" when talking about ANY city, then I want to ask: 'why the hell do you live here then?!'

The core of the city is where things are unique to that city. It's typically where the best restos are, it's where the fun stores are, it's where the good nightlife is, it's where the culture is, it's where the history is. It is what defines the city vibe.

I for one, am glad to see the growth & renovation going on in downtown Austin. That means downtown will continue to be a center of commerce and not some dead zone after 5pm with empty buildings and closed businesses.

[Komeht]

Originally Posted by ognend

Wow. Are you one of those folks who put next to their profession: socialite?

What shopping do you speak of in downtown Austin? I work there and aside from food establishments and a few overpriced stores, I see no appealing "shopping".

Austin on the whole is a nice town, albeit overrated and too self indulged. The funny thing about being overrated and self-indulged is that the "old time" Austinites feel less enthusiastic about it than the swarms of newcomers who are occupying the city, for all the wrong reasons. There are only so many tight jeans and "weird people" sights you can take in before you start feeling like you have walked into a replicator that just keeps replicating. There is such a thing as "too much of the same". Not to mention that having intense feelings of being special and superior inevitably leads to irrelevance.

I have lived in Europe, New York City, Canada, Missouri, south Florida etc. Been exposed to rural, big city, European city etc. You have a nice town here in Austin. The problem is, it is going into the extreme and in my humble opinion, extremes are never good in the long run. There is a difference between normal, funky, weird and fake-trying-too-much.

Just my two cents,
OD

I have to admit, this response was a bit of a head scratcher? I mean? really? what kind of shopping is there? Well, there are over 130 retail establishments alone - including book stores, art and galleries, music, to men's and women's apparel, spirits, AV equipment, running shoes, bike stores, furniture stores, tobacco stores, specialty food stores, groceries, antiques, gifts, pharmacies, haberdasheries, jewelers, paper supplies, office supplies, outdoor gear supplies, tea, salsa, lingerie, skateboards, and window treatments.

What doesn't Downtown Austin have? Oh - I get it. It doesn't have a Best Buy, or a Marshalls, or an Old Navy, or Walmart or Kmart. There is not a single Burlington Coat Factory. oh darn.

But would I want more? Yes, much much more - bring it on. More shops, more restaurants, more cafes, more services, more people, more galleries. . .all of it. Austin is just getting started. It's come a long way from the dead zone that was avoided to where it is today. I expect over the next 20 - 30 years downtown will take off and make these early efforts look like a promising start that showed what is possible. The real action is yet to come. And I can't wait - it will be awesome.

I don't know what you think is "weird" about creating a great downtown that people want to be in? That's kind of a bizarre take don't you think? Is Rome weird? Paris or London? San Francisco, Santa Fe, Washington DC? Is Vancouver weird? Because if it is - I want to be weird. Is it weird to take lessons from the great cities of the world and want to avoid the fate of Atlanta, Phoenix, Houston?

Because to me, that's pretty normal in my book - look at great successes, emulate, look at failures, avoid. Seems like just good ol' fashioned common sense.

Oh, and I am an "old timer" who has called Austin my home for over 4 decades. Consequently nearly all my friends are "old timers". Me and my old timer friends, who grew up in and still call central Austin our home are thrilled with the change this city has gone through.

I see nothing wrong with aspiring to be a great livable vibrant city filled with tons of interesting things to do for all sorts of people.