TxDOT to Bury I-35 (Dallas, Austin: airport, safe, move)

[CarnivalGal]

Originally Posted by Novacek

Where in the world did you get that idea?

Loop 360 - Capital of Texas Highway

http://ftp.dot.state.tx.us/pub/txdot...nal-report.pdf

"To achieve long-term relief (10+ years):
• Over/underpasses - Continue environmental clearance and design of all major
intersections to systematically eliminate all traffic signals and at-grade crossings of Loop
360 between US 290/SH 71 to US 183."


And that's _before_ Austin's 2016 mobility bond kickstarted it.


TxDOT windfall includes $620 million for four Austin highways

Now they're expected to start construction in 2 years or so.

https://communityimpact.com/austin/n...nges-loop-360/

"The study aimed to provide that vision by outlining projects that could occur in the next 20 years."

They will START improvements, but the full, completed project will not be done for decades. There was also a critical article about this in the Statesman, but it's not letting me search for it.

Even your linked document doesn't give a timeline for overpasses. It talks about adding lanes and the timeline for that, but when it comes to overpasses (which are what's really needed), it just says it depends on how many can be funded at one time, etc.

[Novacek]

Originally Posted by CarnivalGal

https://communityimpact.com/austin/n...nges-loop-360/

"The study aimed to provide that vision by outlining projects that could occur in the next 20 years."

They will START improvements, but the full, completed project will not be done for decades. There was also a critical article about this in the Statesman, but it's not letting me search for it.

Even your linked document doesn't give a timeline for overpasses. It talks about adding lanes and the timeline for that, but when it comes to overpasses (which are what's really needed), it just says it depends on how many can be funded at one time, etc.

The overpasses are coming _before_ lanes.

The money is already allocated. $250M.

http://www.mystatesman.com/news/tran...F4Ua3zddNJLoN/

[Westerner92]

I used to hate the idea of toll lanes, but when I think of them as public transit/emergency lanes, I come around to it. Two toll lanes in each direction is just a cash grab by crony capitalists though. You'll have to endure years of construction so that a road you can't afford will be put underneath downtown with no aesthetic or traffic benefits to you. The three-level design that comes with having two toll lanes in each direction is needlessly complex as well (I am well within my professional expertise to say that).

Anything short of Option 2 in this video (at 00:20) is settling for less and TxDOT being a corrupt organization. I'm really disappointed to read this new plan. Is one more toll lane really worth it? Would you really trade this for an eyesore like 635?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1lVBzL90r4

[cBach]

Originally Posted by Westerner92

I used to hate the idea of toll lanes, but when I think of them as public transit/emergency lanes, I come around to it. Two toll lanes in each direction is just a cash grab by crony capitalists though. That's called a toll road on public ROW. The three-level design that comes with having two toll lanes in each direction is needlessly complex as well (I am well within my professional expertise to say that).

Anything short of Option 2 in this video (at 00:20) is settling for less and TxDOT being a corrupt organization. I'm really disappointed to read this new plan. Is one more toll lane really worth it? Would you really trade this for an eyesore like 635?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1lVBzL90r4

My point exactly.

[Novacek]

Originally Posted by Westerner92

Two toll lanes in each direction is just a cash grab by crony capitalists though.

within a week the flow in the Mopac lane was already stopped due to an accident.

The fact that Mopac is only one each way is an unfortunate result of funding limitations and extremely limited RoW. Two in each direction is what truly gives you the reliable lane for emergency/transit you like.

[Westerner92]

Originally Posted by Novacek

within a week the flow in the Mopac lane was already stopped due to an accident.

The fact that Mopac is only one each way is an unfortunate result of funding limitations and extremely limited RoW. Two in each direction is what truly gives you the reliable lane for emergency/transit you like.

There are two ways around that. 1) Don't put the pylons between the tolled lane and free lanes. Just separate with a 3' paint buffer and mark the toll lanes clearly. 2) Have there be two toll lanes in the middle that are reversible based off traffic patterns. Both are well-tested and work swimmingly.

(1) would have to be the way to go for Mopac because of the railroad obviously. Also, do you have any details on the accident? I'd have to assume it was a rear-ending accident, which is the result of an overcrowded lane, which is a result of an improperly priced lane.

Edit: Found the article. The culprit was indeed improper pricing.

[Novacek]

Originally Posted by Westerner92

There are two ways around that. 1) Don't put the pylons between the tolled lane and free lanes. Just separate with a 3' paint buffer and mark the toll lanes clearly. 2) Have there be two toll lanes in the middle that are reversible based off traffic patterns. Both are well-tested and work swimmingly.

1) helps slightly, but problematic as far as preventing people from darting in and out. You'd need a very heavy fine and monitoring process to keep it fully under control. And it still doesn't let the toll lane flow when you really need it (when the main lanes are already stopped/nearly stopped).

2) doesn't work if congestion flows both ways simultaneously. Which it does on downtown sections of both I35 and Mopac.

Originally Posted by Westerner92

(1) would have to be the way to go for Mopac because of the railroad obviously. Also, do you have any details on the accident? I'd have to assume it was a rear-ending accident, which is the result of an overcrowded lane, which is a result of an improperly priced lane.

Edit: Found the article. The culprit was indeed improper pricing.

No, that wasn't it. It wasn't just slow, it was completely stopped by a crash (crash outside of toll lanes, that pushed the car into the toll lane).

Still looking for a link, it may just have been on their facebook page.

[Trainwreck20]

My co-workers that use MoPac daily say there has been a pretty dramatic improvement in traffic flow, fwiw.

[Westerner92]

Originally Posted by Novacek

1) helps slightly, but problematic as far as preventing people from darting in and out. You'd need a very heavy fine and monitoring process to keep it fully under control. And it still doesn't let the toll lane flow when you really need it (when the main lanes are already stopped/nearly stopped).

2) doesn't work if congestion flows both ways simultaneously. Which it does on downtown sections of both I35 and Mopac.



No, that wasn't it. It wasn't just slow, it was completely stopped by a crash (crash outside of toll lanes, that pushed the car into the toll lane).

Still looking for a link, it may just have been on their facebook page.

(1) might not work in Texas because people tend to have the attitude that rules don't apply to them. I sometimes see people darting in and out of the toll lane on the Boulder Turnpike here, but if you have toll cameras set up every mile, people kinda just realize it's not worth it to break the rules. The honors system works better than tough enforcement in many cases. Having no physical barrier also makes it easier to find open spots in the free lanes.

With (2), I still think having the lanes flowing toward downtown in the morning and away from downtown in the evening would go a long way. In my experience doing a reverse commute much of the time I lived in Austin, most of the double-sided congestion on Mopac and 35 is limited to a couple miles within the core during rush hour, and most of that has to do with traffic backing up from people trying to get toward downtown in the morning and away in the evening.

[ScoPro]

Originally Posted by Trainwreck20

My co-workers that use MoPac daily say there has been a pretty dramatic improvement in traffic flow, fwiw.

Well yeah, but is it any better than it was before they started the toll lane boondoggle in 2013?