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Basically it is a model where if the issue is mental health/substance abuse then a social worker/paramedic is sent to the scene instead of a cop. Cops will only be sent for life/death situations or if the social worker is unable to de-escalate the situation.
Basically it is a model where if the issue is mental health/substance abuse then a social worker/paramedic is sent to the scene instead of a cop. Cops will only be sent for life/death situations or if the social worker is unable to de-escalate the situation.
The issue with this is the paramedics and mental health workers themselves have made the decision that they do not want to go to calls with a person who is mentally unstable. The reason is if the situation turns violent, they are hung out to dry without the protection of the police. This is the same case for many “medical calls” that police go to. Many 911 calls start as police calls but ultimately end as, and are recorded as “medical” calls after no arrest is made.
Also, if this defunding is in response to the recent shootings, I’m not sure why mental health is being brought up. None of these cases were mental health calls. Even if you try to make the case that Rayshaw’s Brooks or George Floyd suffered from mental illness, in neither situation would a mental health worker been initially dispatched. The callers were calling for criminal matters.
Also, no one, I repeat no one has come out to try and answer the question of how less police officers, and less police equipment and training (defunding) addresses police brutality or racial inequality. I under stand more funding for social issues. But why pull these funds from the police versus taking them from the general fund? Proponents of defunding the police dance around this CRITICAL question. Or they simply refuse to acknowledge it at all. Including our city council and mayor.
This defund movement in Austin seems purely punitive to APD (for what happened in MN). I just wish the council would come out and say that, instead of selling it had reform. If you want to spank the police, just say it. Be transparent. Don’t hide it behind massive reform when you aren’t really reforming anything. It’s just a money grab.
The issue with this is the paramedics and mental health workers themselves have made the decision that they do not want to go to calls with a person who is mentally unstable. The reason is if the situation turns violent, they are hung out to dry without the protection of the police. This is the same case for many “medical calls” that police go to. Many 911 calls start as police calls but ultimately end as, and are recorded as “medical” calls after no arrest is made.
1) Any sources for any of these claims?
2) Did you actually watch the video and the part where they can actually have police backup, yet it’s very rarely used?
3) What’s wrong with putting a behavioral health professional in charge of an emergency while the meathead “secures the scene”? There are plenty of options. For instance, the paramedical profession wasn’t even conceived until the 60s.
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Also, if this defunding is in response to the recent shootings, I’m not sure why mental health is being brought up. None of these cases were mental health calls. Even if you try to make the case that Rayshaw’s Brooks or George Floyd suffered from mental illness, in neither situation would a mental health worker been initially dispatched. The callers were calling for criminal matters.
Most of the potentially violent situations police are dispatched to are caused by people having mental breakdowns or have had their well-being and capacity to function in society deteriorate over the years because of lack of access to mental healthcare. George Floyd was just the straw that broke the camel’s back. Investing in community health is the ounce of prevention. Police are the pound of cure.
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Also, no one, I repeat no one has come out to try and answer the question of how less police officers, and less police equipment and training (defunding) addresses police brutality or racial inequality. I under stand more funding for social issues. But why pull these funds from the police versus taking them from the general fund? Proponents of defunding the police dance around this CRITICAL question. Or they simply refuse to acknowledge it at all. Including our city council and mayor.
Simple. A more diverse set of emergency dispatch professionals means fewer twitchy meatheads in charge of sensitive situations.
Quote:
This defund movement in Austin seems purely punitive to APD (for what happened in MN). I just wish the council would come out and say that, instead of selling it had reform. If you want to spank the police, just say it. Be transparent. Don’t hide it behind massive reform when you aren’t really reforming anything. It’s just a money grab.
Listen to any police union head and you’ll understand they’re beyond reform. What’s being reformed is the oversight they have. APD’s budget cuts were mainly achieved by reorganizing duties to not have their direct oversight.
The issue with this is the paramedics and mental health workers themselves have made the decision that they do not want to go to calls with a person who is mentally unstable. The reason is if the situation turns violent, they are hung out to dry without the protection of the police. This is the same case for many “medical calls” that police go to. Many 911 calls start as police calls but ultimately end as, and are recorded as “medical” calls after no arrest is made.
Also, if this defunding is in response to the recent shootings, I’m not sure why mental health is being brought up. None of these cases were mental health calls. Even if you try to make the case that Rayshaw’s Brooks or George Floyd suffered from mental illness, in neither situation would a mental health worker been initially dispatched. The callers were calling for criminal matters.
Also, no one, I repeat no one has come out to try and answer the question of how less police officers, and less police equipment and training (defunding) addresses police brutality or racial inequality. I under stand more funding for social issues. But why pull these funds from the police versus taking them from the general fund? Proponents of defunding the police dance around this CRITICAL question. Or they simply refuse to acknowledge it at all. Including our city council and mayor.
This defund movement in Austin seems purely punitive to APD (for what happened in MN). I just wish the council would come out and say that, instead of selling it had reform. If you want to spank the police, just say it. Be transparent. Don’t hide it behind massive reform when you aren’t really reforming anything. It’s just a money grab.
I'm wondering if you even watched the video.
The lady in the video says she has handled situations her whole life without having to call in police muscle or guns. So it appears she is very effective at what she does.
What if we took $100 million that we reduced the budget and put just $5 million to hire people like this worker? We could probably prevent lots of violence in the city, help mentally ill, and save $95 million in the process.
A gun pointed at a mentally ill person doesn't de-escalate a sitation, in some cases the mentally ill person may see the gun as a suicide by cop scenario. However, a medical professional talking down a mentally ill can de-escalate the situation and get help for the mentally ill person, who is someone's brother, sister, mother, father, son, or daughter.
The lady in the video says she has handled situations her whole life without having to call in police muscle or guns. So it appears she is very effective at what she does.
What if we took $100 million that we reduced the budget and put just $5 million to hire people like this worker? We could probably prevent lots of violence in the city, help mentally ill, and save $95 million in the process.
A gun pointed at a mentally ill person doesn't de-escalate a sitation, in some cases the mentally ill person may see the gun as a suicide by cop scenario. However, a medical professional talking down a mentally ill can de-escalate the situation and get help for the mentally ill person, who is someone's brother, sister, mother, father, son, or daughter.
It's just common sense reform.
I agreed with everything you said until "it's just common sense reform". That is a BS phrase which really means you need to listen to me even if I dont have any data.
No policy is "common sense". No one knows if defund will work, but it seems like it could work, and it is worth trying.
I agreed with everything you said until "it's just common sense reform". That is a BS phrase which really means you need to listen to me even if I dont have any data.
No policy is "common sense". No one knows if defund will work, but it seems like it could work, and it is worth trying.
yes, except the part about being common sense. It isnt common sense and it might fail. When you say it is common sense you actually hurt your argument, because what you are saying is that anyone who doesnt agree lacks common sense. When what you really should be saying, is you are right the data isnt there, but I believe it is worth the risk to try.
1) Any sources for any of these claims?
2) Did you actually watch the video and the part where they can actually have police backup, yet it’s very rarely used?
3) What’s wrong with putting a behavioral health professional in charge of an emergency while the meathead “secures the scene”? There are plenty of options. For instance, the paramedical profession wasn’t even conceived until the 60s.
Most of the potentially violent situations police are dispatched to are caused by people having mental breakdowns or have had their well-being and capacity to function in society deteriorate over the years because of lack of access to mental healthcare. George Floyd was just the straw that broke the camel’s back. Investing in community health is the ounce of prevention. Police are the pound of cure.
Simple. A more diverse set of emergency dispatch professionals means fewer twitchy meatheads in charge of sensitive situations.
Listen to any police union head and you’ll understand they’re beyond reform. What’s being reformed is the oversight they have. APD’s budget cuts were mainly achieved by reorganizing duties to not have their direct oversight.
1. Sources are the actual police officers and paramedics that I personally know do the job. This is what has come out of my discussions with them.
2. Nothing wrong with having behavioral health professionals lead the scene. It still doesn’t remove the need for a police officer. Like I said before, the funding for this stuff shouldn’t come from the police budget, it should come from somewhere else in the general fund that is less critical.
3. George Floyd wasn’t directly a mental health issue. None of these high profile incidents have been. I’m not sure where the connection is. Just seems like an excuse to take money. Especially when the council doesn’t have a plan in place to remove police from these calls. Ever heard the old adage “Don’t quit a job until you have another one”?
It would appear that you just seem to not like police (twitchy meatheads) and that’s fine. However you can’t deny that they still serve a critical function in society. How would you feel about this; keep the police funding so that they can better serve a growing population, but remove them from mental health calls? That would be a win win for everyone right?
“Defunding” comes from a place of privilege. You probably have never needed the police, and thus you think they serve no purpose, or that their purpose is minimal. You also probably assume that all police are doing is beating up mentally ill minorities in Austin, based off incidents that occur in other cities. Each department is different, and not all national issues are local issues. APD didn’t kill George Floyd, and shouldn’t be punished for it.
I’ll say it one last time, if you want police to stop responding to mental health calls, awsome, the city manager just has to say the word. If you want to provide funds for different mental health professionals, awsome! Do it! But why take it from an already understaffed police department in a growing city? Use money from the general fund! Simple! Unless, like I said before, you simply want to “punish” the police. If so, then just say that so everyone can know where you’re coming from.
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