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Old 04-03-2008, 08:23 PM
 
746 posts, read 3,719,617 times
Reputation: 257

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyjack View Post
Hoooweeee! I'd say it's time to get off your high horse and mingle with the little man! I got news for you Steve, there's a lot of folks done might well with those factory jobs. Why some have even raised families and bought property! I know it might not be up to the standards of a big time realator like yourself livin the highlife out in circle c sendin your kids to fancy schools an all, but 900 jobs lost affects a lot of peoples lives. Its not classist to say blue collar, but there is a certain lack of class to minimize the layoffs and suggest that Dell employees are not homeowners.

It's along the same lines of callin somebody 'uppity'. I know you're not from Texas but there's some connotations that go along with those words also that you might want to think about as they reflect rather poorly on a man of your stature. Kind of like tellin a person of color that racism is just their imagination an they should watch Rudy to learn how to buck up. For someone who is so successful, you seem to have a little bit of edge on and a surprising lack of sensitivity. I'd call your comments ridiculously classist too, but I'd leave off the cl at the front.
I grew up on the south side of Chicago, and the vast majority of folks were blue collar homeowners, who did very well for themselves. Actually, many blue-collar occupations pay more than many white collar clerical positions. including real estate, of which many realtors make very little. I'm sure that the Dell factory workers were doing quite well. Many jobs in Austin, particularly in hospitality, pay little, and I would bet many of those folks would kill to have a steady job at the Dell factory, at least before it closed.
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Old 04-03-2008, 08:26 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,958 posts, read 45,197,233 times
Reputation: 24737
For the record, I agree that Steve was off in his analysis of the Dell workers.
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Old 04-03-2008, 08:46 PM
 
149 posts, read 496,728 times
Reputation: 30
Dell plans more job cuts

Dell Inc. will cut more than the 8,800 jobs it announced last year, CEO Michael Dell told analysts this morning in Round Rock

statesman.com | Dell plans more job cuts | Statesman Business Blog
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Old 04-03-2008, 10:07 PM
 
Location: SW Austin & Wimberley
6,330 posts, read 17,986,506 times
Reputation: 5531
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady View Post
For the record, I agree that Steve was off in his analysis of the Dell workers.
Well, I should quit while I'm behind, but might as well step in it with the other shoe, go all in, so here goes ....

Some minor searching will reveal recent job postings such as this:
Quote:
August 2007
NOW HIRING- Entry level assembly/manufacturing workers for Dell. Work in assembly line, boxing/shipping, testing or build departments. All shifts available- 1st, 2nd, and weekends. Pay scale is $9.50 - $10.40 (depending on shift). Drug and background screens are required.
The plant that was shut down is a desktop assembly plant. I'm sure the experienced, long term employees made more than $10.40/hr, but I doubt they receive raises much more than 5% per year, so one can extrapolate what an average annual wage might be for the 900 laid off assembly line workers.

Now, looking back at my offending, comment, which was
Quote:
Those are mostly factory workers, not a large batch of home owners.
I'm not sure what's being projected on me, but it's simply a factual statement, not a social commentary.

It wasn't asked directly, but the question I was answering as I responded with that comment was simply "will these 900 layoffs cause a lot of homes to come on the market for sale?"

The answer is, no, it won't.

Most $10/hr assembly line workers don't own homes. I'm sorry if that fact offends some people. I'm just offering what I know about real estate and business in general. Those employees, including the ones who in fact do own homes, which I don't disagree some with 2-income homes do, will find other jobs in Austin. They won't be migrating away from Austin and selling their home. That's exactly what I said in the same post where the "factory worker" comment appeared.

When the $70K/yr and up workers get laid off up in Round Rock, as happened 5-7 years ago, those employees at that time did have to move away from Austin. We lost 35,000 jobs in Austin one year, 2002 I think it was. That sort of shift does impact the real estate market and we had a glut of homes for sale in Round Rock when that happened. I was comparing and contrasting this current layoff of 900 factory workers with what I remember happening back then when we had real layoffs and high tech and "dot.com" companies folding.

For the record, I am Blue Collar. I didn't receive a 4-year college degree until I was 32, at which time I took the first high tech "white collar" salaried job I'd ever had, programming computers. I drive an 8 year old pickup truck with 126,000 miles. I had a dog name Lynyrd Skynyrd when I was a teenager. I've worked all sorts of grunt jobs, starting in high school and working my way later in life through college. My wife and I were so broke one year, we had to run one of those fireworks stands on the side the highway 71 between Austin and Bastrop, in a borrowed motor home with our 3 month old infant out there with us.

So, JimmyJack, you don't know me well enough to be making cracks about me being elitist. I worked my up the hard way, dude. And I'm still working hard.

Finally, those of us Realtors who come on the forums and offer insight and opinion about the market seem to often take a lot of heat and insults just because of our occupation. That comes with the territory, given there are so many lousy agents in the field that brand the rest of us by their incompetence.

But some of us do know quite a bit about what's actually happening in the market, and we freely share data and information for the benefit of other forum readers, especially the newbies coming to Austin who don't know anything about the neighborhoods, pricing etc. If you disagree with something a Realtor says, fine, but personal insults about us and our profession make the forums a less pleasant place to visit. And it seems to me just a form of the "classism" I was accused or, only it's "jobism" by Realtor haters.

Steve

Last edited by austin-steve; 04-03-2008 at 10:12 PM.. Reason: typo
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Old 04-04-2008, 08:52 AM
 
389 posts, read 1,626,736 times
Reputation: 194
I appreciate Steve's commentary on the Austin real estate market and could care less if he is - or thought by some to be - a classist, socialist, anarchist, or any other ist. His thoughts, as they are on this topic, are usually factually justified.
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Old 04-04-2008, 09:07 AM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,958 posts, read 45,197,233 times
Reputation: 24737
Steve, one thing you're not taking into account is that of those 900 people, quite a few of them are likely to be married with a second person working outside the home. That changes the picture as far as home ownership is concerned.

Not that I think that this layoff is likely to be the doom and gloom that others are predicting, but in my opinion there could be quite a few homeowners among the laid off. Of course, I represent people in a variety of areas in purchasing and selling homes in a variety of ranges, from $65,000 to $500,000, so my professional perspective on who might be able to afford to own a home (depending on the home) is somewhat different from yours for that reason alone.
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Old 04-04-2008, 10:08 AM
 
Location: Hutto, Tx
9,249 posts, read 26,596,033 times
Reputation: 2851
That Dell layoff doesn't just affect Dell workers. My hiusbands job depends a lot on the shipping from the factories. He told me a few days ago that he's seriously considering buying a larger axled truck to take on different and bigger loads from elsewhere. But thankfully he's about 1-2 payments away from paying off the one he has now. So in a way, if he keeps 2 trucks and hires a driver, we'll be doing better than we were before.

I don't think Steve is too far off, but according to my husband who's met some of these workers who will lose their jobs, THL is more on the money here, since some of them do have 2 income households and do own homes.
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Old 04-04-2008, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,148,425 times
Reputation: 27718
It's not only factory workers in that plant. There were a number of IT folks that ran the computers there as well as other white collar workers/managers. All those folks were not just "blue" collar.

The paper said Dell would try to relocate them inside the company but all companies say that.
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Old 04-04-2008, 12:18 PM
 
439 posts, read 1,252,186 times
Reputation: 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taterhead View Post

As for the factory worker not owning a home thing, don't forget maybe that worker is only 1 part of a 2 income family. With 2 incomes even if both worked the factory job, they could probably afford to buy a home.

Debbie....

I said the same thing too in this quote of mine 2 days ago. just because someone works in a factory, doesn't mean they can't afford to buy a home. 2 income families should be able too.

Debbie
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Old 04-04-2008, 01:38 PM
 
2,627 posts, read 6,549,462 times
Reputation: 1230
In regards to the Dell factory layoffs, do people often immediately sell or foreclose on their homes when they lose their jobs?

I've been a part of two separate layoffs (during the dot com bust) and each time I went on unemployment for a couple months and then found another job. I didn't have to move at all. Is that not an option for these 900 employees? There's no guarantee that the ones that are homeowners will be giving up their homes. I would do everything that I could to find another job as quickly as possible and I'm sure most of them will too.
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