Surely UT Austin can do better than this???

[artsyguy]

Students "who want to excel" is a subjective condition and should be none of your business. In all my years of university experience I couldn't give a rat's behind on whether a student cared about learning or not. I never cared about anybody else, other than myself. If a few students hated learning or hated the professor, it did not bother me one bit. I didn't care nor was I bothered. What I hated was the paternalistic attitude of a lot of the UT Austin students. It is like they thought they could be your Dad or Mom. What truly matters is your attitude on your education. The other really important factor is the quality of professors. If you love teaching and you love your subject then the attitude of the students should not matter one bit. I really hate it when lousy professionalism of faculty and staff is blamed on a handful of students that might not really like being at UT Austin. It isn't personal. Some students are just feeling it out to see if they like it there. Not every student is going to fall on their knees and cling too every lecture and every group assignment with love and adoration. As a student I've tried many learning environments and many environments are irritating to learn in due to the one-up-man-ship and in your face competition of disgruntled students. I learn best when I am competing against myself. Our society is large enough that you can compete against yourself and do well on your own. Not everyone has to join the rat race and claw their way to the top. Not everyone wants to do that. I prefer to be a human, not a rat.

Originally Posted by thesonofgray

Well I think you explained the problem right there - liberal arts is unfortunately the "catch all" school, which means you get all of the 'bottom of the barrel' students. And I think the quality of the students really brushes off on the faculty.

It sucks for those in liberal arts who actually want to excel. I took a few classes (2, I think?) in the liberal arts department for electives. I thought one professor was great, knew a whole lot about the class topic and seemed sincere in wanting to share that knowledge with us, and one professor who couldn't care less (or appeared so). So it was a pure toss up in my limited experience.

But, for the general class of prospective students, the liberal arts department shouldn't be taken as the quality of education UT, in general, provides. It will vary from top notch to mediocre, and 3,000 levels in between.

[thesonofgray]

Originally Posted by artsyguy

I never cared about anybody else, other than myself.

Well that goes without saying.

[Nomadic9460678748]

Originally Posted by thesonofgray

And I think the quality of the students really brushes off on the faculty.

I don't know if I agree with the faculty comment. Quite a few of the faculty members, especially if they were tenured, could have given a flying flip about anyone. And that wasn't just in liberal arts. I had friends in the Natural Sciences and Engineering Schools who talked a lot of smack about the indifferent nature of their professors. I have a professor friend (who teaches at UT) who said over dinner recently to colleague of his, "I wish I could get out of teaching my classes this semester." And they're both professors in one of UT's more highly respected departments. Needless to say it was disheartening to hear.

It sucks for those in liberal arts who actually want to excel.

Nah, not really. Just means you work that much harder. If you attend a university where very often you are little more than a social security number and you have professors more concerned with publishing than teaching (a pervasive UT problem--all department, not just in liberal arts--UT is a research university), in my opinion it's thereafter incumbent upon you to make the most of your education.


But, for the general class of prospective students, the liberal arts department shouldn't be taken as the quality of education UT, in general, provides.

Considering that it's the largest school in the university with the most majors and the most students, it must indicate something about the quality of education provided at UT Austin, even if that something is mediocrity.

There are a couple of successful liberal arts grads out there--people who didn't need to tack on a law or business degree to feel successful. Think Wes Anderson! He took a philosophy degree and makes kick butt movies.

Anyway . . . if I can just add as a final word as to the original point of thread . . . I'm glad that the vet in that story was able to find a program anyway. He's doing important work. Returning vets need our support, and that does include assisting with their ability to find good, qualified counselors. I wish him the best of luck.

[thesonofgray]

Originally Posted by Nomadic9460678748

I don't know if I agree with the faculty comment. Quite a few of the faculty members, especially if they were tenured, could have given a flying flip about anyone. And that wasn't just in liberal arts. I had friends in the Natural Sciences and Engineering Schools who talked a lot of smack about the indifferent nature of their professors. I have a professor friend (who teaches at UT) who said over dinner recently to colleague of his, "I wish I could get out of teaching my classes this semester." And they're both professors in one of UT's more highly respected departments. Needless to say it was disheartening to hear.

I don't doubt that and I personally know it to be true. It's a careful balance the administration must have: great researchers are what brings the money and good ratings to the school and is the bulk of the innovation and "expertise" in the faculty, but good teachers have obvious benefits they bring to the school and, more importantly, to the students.

UT has a mixed bag - great researchers/bad teachers, great teachers/bad researcher, and those who are great (and bad) at both. UT is far from perfect (what school isn't?), but there are incredible resources there that every student can take advantage of.

As for the original topic, I'm not sure what harm there is in using the interest free loan until the VA pays out?...unless there's a strong doubt that the VA will pay at all.

[theloneranger]

[quote=artsyguy;12017872]I doubt that. But then again it depends on what program you are in. The McCombs School of Business and a few other programs are supposed to be top notch but other than that the students are skating on very thin ice when it comes to quality and professionalism.

Originally Posted by theloneranger

But what do you expect from a public university serving 50,000. At least I'm getting the best value education in the state at $8k tuition.[/QUOTE]

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Just about every academic program at UT is ranked in the top 25 of its field according to US News or the Gourman Report.

I'm in Plan II and I wholeheartedly believe that at $8k it's the best value education not only in the state but in the nation. The only equivalent program for liberal arts and sciences I can think of at an equivalent price is the Echols Scholars at UVA for Virginia residents.

Also, McCombs is a terrible academic experience. It's a great professional school, but the quality of the academic side is lacking. It's more of a problem with the entire concept of an undergraduate business school rather than McCombs itself.