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The other day I was thinking about this moving to someplace and then completely adopting the local way of doing things and what that would mean. I thought to myself how much I love Asian and Indian food and it would be such a shame if there were no places here to eat such food. But if all people moving to new locations abandoned their old ways, we'd never have experienced Thai food without traveling to Thailand or Pizza without taking a trip to Italy.
I think the problem with some of the posters that lament how Austin has changed is that they don't realize that EVERYPLACE has changed in the last 30 years, whether those places have gained residents or lost residents. Change is just a fact of life, there is no stopping the clock anywhere.
Reps to you on this post, Jennibc.
It made me think of what the difference is.
Someone move here and love the TexMex/Mexican food, but say, "Hmmm, wouldn't it be nice if Austin had a Thai restaurant (or, for that matter, a Trader Joe's)?" Not a problem.
Someone move here and say, right off the bat, "Tex-Mex sucks (or isn't "real" Tex-Mex, which I've heard - excuse me????), and Austin sucks because it doesn't have a Thai restaurant." Definitely a problem.
My problem is with the latter. Whether it be our restaurants or how we pronounce things or how we drive, if you decide that Austin sucks because we don't do it the exactly the way you did wherever you came from or have exactly the restaurants or grocery stores or whatever that you did wherever you came from, I'm going to think that everyone, including you, would be happier if you simply went back where things are so perfect for you.
If you like what we have and who we are, just think it would be cool if we could all have, say, an Afghani restaurant (and I would SO be on board with that!), you're much more likely to get a receptive, rather than defensive, audience.
It's not the change that I'm resisting so much (I've seen a LOT of change, in the way of things being added, rather than replacing what's already there, over the years, and a lot of it is good change), it's the desire to make over the city into something that it's not just because it's not exactly like where you came from.
Does that make what I've been trying to say more clear? I hope?
What I DO have a problem with is newcomers who come here, complain about the way we do things, and try to make us over into a replica of where they came from. You would also have noted that I have specifically stated more than once that Texans (including Austinites) that go somewhere else and do the same thing are just as much in the wrong.
Those who come here because they love Austin and want to live here, not wherever it is that they came from, who adjust to our ways and observe that there might be reasons for them and then add their own particular flavor to the city or state? Not a problem at all, and welcome, indeed!
I get this. The first thing I thought of when read this was Phoenix.
I grew up in a suburb of St Paul in Minnesota. In my early 20's, I moved to Phoenix, mostly for the dry climate and warm weather. I lived there 11 years. Now, in that time, I saw climate changes and such take place because so many people from the Midwest came down there and just had to bring all their Midwest native trees, plants, etc. with them. More humidity was introduced because people needed it to be more green, etc. I get this, it is way too brown for many, but then don't move there!
You want to live there because it's a dry climate, yet you can't leave the Midwest or wherever behind and try to turn Phoenix into what you grew up with. Now Phoenix is nowhere near as dry as it used to be.
I didn't become a totally different person who abandoned all my ways of thinking and living when I moved there, but I did adapt to Phoenix instead of trying to make Phoenix adapt to me, if that makes sense.
I guess in the end, if you want to move somewhere for quality of life and all these things you like about the place, why go there and try to change them into what you're used to? Why not just stay put if that's the case?
That's what I got out of her post, anyway and I didn't think she meant people shouldn't come or people can't bring their own ideas and such.
I also don't like the idea that I have to change the way I do things, the way I think, the way I talk, the stores I want to shop in, the food I want to eat, everything about me, to fit in with Texashorselady's idea of the way Austin SHOULD be. Or the way she remembers it to be. Or the way she happens to live it.
Okay, I can understand this. You know why? Because I don't like the idea that I have to change the way I do things, the way I think, the way I talk, the stores I want to shop in, the food I want to eat, everything about me and Austin, to fit in with the ideas of someone who moved here about what a great place Austin would be if it just changed to be just like (insert city of your choice here) and replace all of our restaurants and stores and "vibe" with the ones you like somewhere else. That's exactly what I've (and several other people have been) saying all along. The ATX thing? Is just sort of a canary in the coal mine kind of thing.
So we're sort of on the same page, believe it or not. How do we get around this quandary?
Someone move here and love the TexMex/Mexican food, but say, "Hmmm, wouldn't it be nice if Austin had a Thai restaurant (or, for that matter, a Trader Joe's )?" Not a problem.
You say it's not a problem NOW, but when the subject of Trader Joe's came up you sure had PLENTY of criticism for those who were in favor of it. And that was but one example of how you criticize those who long for anything non-Austin. There are plenty of other readily-available examples that could be posted here, too ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady
Someone move here and say, right off the bat, "Tex-Mex sucks (or isn't "real" Tex-Mex, which I've heard - excuse me????), and Austin sucks because it doesn't have a Thai restaurant." Definitely a problem.
Here you are now determining once again that anyone with an opinion that you either disagree with or that you perceive as unfavorable to Austin is a "problem". Who made you the sheriff of Austin's thought police? Hell, you don't even live in Austin any longer yourself. Why then does it matter so much to you that not everyone sees Austin as the Taj Mahal, and actually voice opinions of their likes/dislikes?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady
My problem is with the latter. Whether it be our restaurants or how we pronounce things or how we drive, if you decide that Austin sucks because we don't do it the exactly the way you did wherever you came from or have exactly the restaurants or grocery stores or whatever that you did wherever you came from, I'm going to think that everyone, including you, would be happier if you simply went back where things are so perfect for you.
So an "outsider" by your standard is not eligible to make any individual determinations that a particular restaurant sucks, or that it's funny how something is pronounced, or proclaim that they miss a favorite store? It's not allowed then under your rules for an outsider to like some things, and dislike others? Any dissent from your dogma deems one eligible to be shown the door? I've heard you complain about plenty of things that occur in this town, THL. Maybe YOU would be happier somewhere else.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady
If you like what we have and who we are, just think it would be cool if we could all have, say, an Afghani restaurant (and I would SO be on board with that!), you're much more likely to get a receptive, rather than defensive, audience.
There you go again, dictating the terms for communication. Also, you are not "we". You are just "you". There's that pesky "voice of Austin" thing again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady
How do we get around this quandary?
You could start by stepping down from your self-imposed role as the Voice of Austin and start showing a little more tolerance for people who have an equally valid yet different view of Austin. Some people might move here and love it but miss a thing or two from where they came. Some people might move here, hate everything about it, whine up a storm, and then decide to move away. In either event, your "love it or leave it" admonishments do nothing but identify you as an unfriendly-to-anyone-different elitist. If you toned down your "love it or leave it" stance you might actually serve as a more positive influence on new people, here at this board and probably in every day life, too. Why not try being an ambassador instead of a cop!
This has all become very un-Austin. One thing that I can say for the old ways of Austin is that we live and let live. I hate what Austin has become, but I can't do anything about it, so I do my best to stick the old things that remind me of what things were like....Sunset Valley Farmer's Market....Christmas Affair...Zilker Park....Wheatsville Coop and stay away from the new stuff I hate. It's not personal, and I'm not going to fight with anyone IRL or here. I get that people move because they have to (California?) and that things change, but I can ignore it. Kind of like putting my hands on my ears and saying 'lalalalala I can't hear you'. LOL
Where on EARTH did you get the idea that "Liberal" means "tolerant"? Nothing could be further from the truth! If that were true, Liberals wouldn't be constantly complaining about Conservatives (or anyone else who doesn't toe the party line), for one thing.
Wow, you really need to stop taking these things so seriously. You got upset when the whole point of my post was basically trying to say the exact same thing you said. I'm a Democrat, a very liberal Democrat in a lot of ways I like to think. But I don't believe any part is overall any more tolerant than the other overall. They all have their own set of beliefs and they are tolerant only when concerning the things they believe should be tolerated. It just so happens my beliefs fall in line with Democrats more often than not. I was taking a shot at most Austinites because the city as a whole claims they are more liberal and tolerant however, when they think the city is getting a little too much Hip-Hop or any other kind of Black culture they get all upset. Trust me Austinites, Austin is never going to be mistaken for Atlanta so you guys can calm down.
I'd still like to know what the "Austin way" is in your eyes. I honestly think it would be enlightening if people got this off their chests and spoke up about what 'their' Austin means to them and what it is about the place that they absolutely can't stand to see change.
I'll bet it would be eye-opening to find out what others value and don't value. If twenty people spoke up I bet you'd see twenty different "Austin ways". Something to remember when you're instructing noobs on how to behave.
As a transplant of over 13 years, the top 5 things I would NEVER want to see changed are:
1. the entire downtown music, club, bar, dive, restaurant, shops scene including the IBIZ district from MLK to Ben White with all the old buildingsand neighborhoods remaining(that's enough new tall buildings, hotels and lofts for the next 20 years thank you very much. now go away!)
2. all the trees getting knocked down(we gotta have the trees yall). some are cool to clear for neighborhoods but geesh slow down, build around.
3. the saftey of the city. Austin is one of the safest cities to raise kids and have a family and that wins huge points with me.
4. All the festivals that hit the city from the Hot Sauce to the ACL to the ReggaeFest, keep Austin buzzing with this stuff.... I love it!!
5. And the bohemian "culture" that is truly only Austin...you hippies know what I mean...
I like to dress up, but I would also like to know that the "relax, this is Austin" attitude will stick around, and I can go somewhere in a t-shirt and jeans if I want and not be looked down upon. When I say jeans, I'm not talking about $200 jeans
However, I like most of the changes in Austin. There's more to do now. It was pretty boring when I was a teenager. As long as some of the little restaurants, etc. remain and people see the importance of restoring buildings instead of tearing them down, I like it. However, some buildings that have been torn down, needed to be torn down. Some on Burnet Road, for example. I'm not a fan of some of the development along there, but for the most part it's been good, and more needs to be done.
I'm a transplant myself, although consider myself a long-time Austinite. Among my favorite people are some who moved here from California, New York, Wisconsin. They take part in the 'traditional' offerings of the city even more than I do. I let them know about restaurants, shops, etc. that have been here a long time and that they might like to try, and it's rarely, "Oh, you should have what we have in (_____)". It's usually, "Okay, this now has a spot on my list of favorite places". Not always, but a lot of the time. But, there's no doubt that they get out and discover the city independently and appreciate it for what it is, which will change as it always has.
This has all become very un-Austin. One thing that I can say for the old ways of Austin is that we live and let live. I hate what Austin has become, but I can't do anything about it, so I do my best to stick the old things that remind me of what things were like....Sunset Valley Farmer's Market....Christmas Affair...Zilker Park....Wheatsville Coop and stay away from the new stuff I hate. It's not personal, and I'm not going to fight with anyone IRL or here. I get that people move because they have to (California?) and that things change, but I can ignore it. Kind of like putting my hands on my ears and saying 'lalalalala I can't hear you'. LOL
That may be the wisest thing to do. As long, of course, as the old things that remind you of what things were like still exist and don't get replaced by all the new things that are the antithesis of what they were like.
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FREE LOVE MAN!
