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Welcome to City Planning & development 101. This isn't specific to Austin, it's happened, and continues to happen through out the country. Cities are developed, redeveloped and then the development moves outward as demand requires it. It's called growth, and it happens - you can't just grow "up" it needs to happen "out" as well for several, many obvious, reasons.
I work in a planning department and understand the forces that drive growth. It is no secret that growth is going to happen in a booming metro area, but there are good ("Smart Growth") and bad (sprawl) ways to handle it. Single-family housing can still be manageable if it is built making efficient use of space and provided with efficient transportation. Just look at cities like Portland, OR (the city itself) where growth continues and sprawl is minimized. Use a gridded street system, plug into what's already there, stop dumping entire subdivisions on a single, already over-taxed collector road. I do not see how anyone could possibly claim that Austin's current growth couldn't be done in a better way. There is definitely a demand for high-density, AFFORDABLE, mixed-use development or the current projects wouldn't be selling out before they're even built. There are thousands of live in the suburbs because they can't afford what they really want, and even those who only want single-family housing cannot argue that places like Hyde Park are much more attractive than the bland, tract housing.
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I know, I know - you detest suburbs, adnaseum ... though, I am not sure where the anger really lies, or why. Was a suburb mean to you growing up?
I see them as a complete waste of land and resources that perpetuate oil/car dependency. They try to replicate both city and rural living, but only end up with the worst of both.
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Suburbs have their place, and their target demographic, as they have since the birth of the suburb in the 50's.
Post WWII development occurred precisely due to dependency on a limited natural resource. The automobile industry was in charge at the time. Surely you knew about this little atrocity as well: The Straight Dope: Did General Motors destroy the LA mass transit system? It only got worse from there.
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Where do you expect this part of the population to live, if development did not occur past city limits? Pack everyone into an over-priced condo? Or do you want city limits to continuously grow into an even larger city? Blending with the other cities - until it's just one large state of pavement? And if so, what would make such "city" special from the next? And what about the economic, social, agricultural, environmental impact of such a suggestion?
You have a lot of contempt for horrible suburbia - but do you have a better solution?
See my solution above. Also, negative the economic, social, agricultural and environmental impacts of suburban development are exactly why I'm against that pattern of growth. It is what keeps cities from being special compared to others. Suburbia is suburbia... it can be Anywhere, America and it will look exactly the same.
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BTW if everyone lived in Austin, and commuted to some of the larger employers (Dell, HP, IBM etc) that is adding congestion and environmental impact. We live out here in the disgusting crap suburbs, my husband commutes 8 miles on a bike to Dell - and sometimes we don't use a car all day or for several days (we can walk to school, parks, pool, nature and other activities). This is just one positive, among many, for suburb dwelling.
That is also NOT typical of most suburban areas and it would be ludicrous to say it is. If there weren't so many people willing to drive to Dell from all over the metro area and clog the freeways daily, then they wouldn't have located there in the first place. I can guarantee you that it is only a small minority that can get to work there without using a car.
You don't need to take such offense and resort to attacks on me because you disagree with me. You're free to live wherever you want and do whatever you want. If you're want to argue what I've said then at least provide some substantiative evidence for the claims you're making.
jread : Don't you LIVE IN as you put it, a "cookie cutter" suburb? Aren't you then, just contributing to the problem, as you see it? I don't understand being so vehemently against something, that you have consciously bought into? Do you feel guilty or something?
I don't see how anyone could possibly say that Austin has terrible drinking water. I actually stopped buying bottled water when I moved here because the tap water is so good.
I also see no lack of recycling. Are you another one of those people who is speaking of "Austin" and actually lives in the suburbs?
Yes, jread, it's true, I live outside of Austin, but I lived IN Austin (Downtown, Hyde Park & South Austin) from '92 until '01--does that count? (eye roll) I grew up in a state that has had a bottle/can deposit for 35 years, and people recycle cardboard, paper, etc. curbside. I can't even throw a yogurt container in my bin.
jenbar, I'm glad you moved to RR, I'm sure there are less thumpers there. I am S. of Austin, where conversations are peppered with Jesus speak all too much for me. This is the first place I've lived where people wear their religious beliefs on their sleeves. If you enjoy the TX coast, I'm glad for you. I think it's lame. Even natives will usually admit this.
Harvester, the only place you've experienced "austintaciousness" is in coffee shops? Really? Ever been to Thundercloud? I just enjoy eye contact and please and thank you, I guess.
And if you haven't experienced the no English thing yet, well, it will be coming North of the river soon enough, I assure you. Ever been to San Antonio? My prediction? Austin in the next 10-20 years. I just don't want my kids to be in the minority. Elementary schools here in Hays Cty. are already 50-50 (ESL) and growing.
And I guess I miss Yankees. I miss salty language. I miss opinion. I miss decent manners. I miss people who have lived places other than Texas.
Loved Austin for a long time, and sure I will miss things, but I am ready to go.
And I guess I miss Yankees. I miss salty language. I miss opinion. I miss decent manners. I miss people who have lived places other than Texas.
Hays county must be really really different from Williamson county because I just can't relate.
My neighbors and I have said several times (all of us new to TX) that we haven't yet met anyone FROM this area, or that had lived here for any length of time.
I am amazed at the good, friendly manners I see in people. Children holding doors for adults, "Yes Ma'am" and all that. We are from the north, and you just don't see that up there.
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I just don't want my kids to be in the minority.
I really sincerely don't mean to label you as a racist, because I am sure that is not your intention with your comments, but you have to understand that your comment reaks of such. At the very least, elitist.
I guess I don't consider this an issue - but then again, full disclosure, I live in a golf course community in an upper middle class area.... it's mainly white and english speaking. We have not always lived in this sort of neighborhood, coming from Seattle - the neighborhood we lived in was more mixed - but I wouldn't say we were a "minority". Then, still, I didn't consider it an issue. I guess everyone has their "hot points" though, and that's just not one of mine.
Quality education is key to me, I couldn't care less if their friends looked different than them, or exposed them to a different culture...
I Moved Here A Year Ago And The City Is A Great Place To Be Especially For Those Who Have Family. Great Place For Children To Live And Yet Have The City Feel And Be Able To Enjoy The Outside Life.
How come McDonalds in Texas does not have ice coffee. Its the only state where Mc Dondalds does not have it that I have been to. Its So delicious. And one other question, what month, if ever does the muggy weather stop?
And I guess I miss Yankees. I miss salty language. I miss opinion. I miss decent manners. I miss people who have lived places other than Texas.
I giggled at this - I'm a born and bred Yankee. Born in Boston, and with the exception of college and a year in Ireland, lived all of my (32) years in MA and RI until last June when we moved to Austin. I'm about as Yankee as you get.
You miss decent manners...in New England?? My husband (another born and bred New England Yankee) talk all the time about how great and friendly the people are here. One of the reasons we LEFT New England (voluntarily, btw, not due to a job location) was because we were sick of the negative attitudes, complaining, and general unfriendliness. Texans are so warm and welcoming!
Yes, I can see what you are saying with missing opinion (Texans seem too polite to really debate politics or religion) and that so many Texans seem to think Texas is the end all and be all of civilization. I have met many people who consider "traveling" to be going between Dallas, Houston and San Antonio, and who look at me sort of blankly when I say I grew up in Rhode Island, went to college in Washington DC, and lived in Europe. So I will grant you those points.
But decent manners? I think Texas has the market cornered on that.
Hays county must be really really different from Williamson county...
I'm not part of that discussion but just wanted to say YES! to your above comment. Williamson and Hays are worlds apart. Aside from the fact that both have certain chain stores that can be found anywhere in the USA, and they have similar weather, they're otherwise extremely different places. Each has its good and bad points depending on what you like or don't like.
And to whoever said this: "Austin still has a very substantial cancerous growth of cookie-cutter, suburban crap growing around it at an alarming rate"
--- that's true everywhere growth has occurred in the past 50 years. After the original suburbs were created on Long Island and around Los Angeles, it became the norm to create housing in assembly-line fashion, thus saving a lot of money, using engineering and marketing studies to figure out how to get people the most commonly-desired amenities at the lowest-possible cost.
Having grown up in southern California, I've watched cookie-cutter-cancer my whole life. I have fond memories of taking the long trip through the countryside between Santa Barbara and Los Angeles, back when there were no freeways until we got to LA. Thousand Oaks was a stop along the way, a little country town with one famous restaurant where we enjoyed dining. Now Ventura County is a non-stop suburb with a population equivalent to all of suburban Austin combined.
Hays county must be really really different from Williamson county because I just can't relate.
My neighbors and I have said several times (all of us new to TX) that we haven't yet met anyone FROM this area, or that had lived here for any length of time.
I am amazed at the good, friendly manners I see in people. Children holding doors for adults, "Yes Ma'am" and all that. We are from the north, and you just don't see that up there.
I really sincerely don't mean to label you as a racist, because I am sure that is not your intention with your comments, but you have to understand that your comment reaks of such. At the very least, elitist.
I guess I don't consider this an issue - but then again, full disclosure, I live in a golf course community in an upper middle class area.... it's mainly white and english speaking. We have not always lived in this sort of neighborhood, coming from Seattle - the neighborhood we lived in was more mixed - but I wouldn't say we were a "minority". Then, still, I didn't consider it an issue. I guess everyone has their "hot points" though, and that's just not one of mine.
Quality education is key to me, I couldn't care less if their friends looked different than them, or exposed them to a different culture...
Quality education is important to me too, JenBar. But the Asian children your kids go to school with are quite different than the kids that make up half the classes at my local elementary here (my daughter will be in Catholic school this fall).
When half the class is made up of children who's parents only speak Spanish, or to whom English is a second language--do you think that might slow the rest of the class down? How fair is that to my daughter? How far will that make her fall behind your kids?
Am I a "racist" or an "elitist"? No, just a realist. But it's easier being open minded about what others should settle for when you're living in an "upper class white community". The elementary school here is ranked 5 out of 10 here--if I want my daughter to have a better education better than that I'm racist? So be it.
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