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Old 08-23-2019, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
26,776 posts, read 37,717,092 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCC_1 View Post
Sure we could do that. The big difference is the flow of the game. Rucks, mauls and kicking are why union is soooo boring to watch (and I grew up playing union). League is all about possession, not field position which is why there is endless kicking in union. Get good field position, force a penalty, kick for three points....boring. No one wants to watch the breakdown in union it's boring, in league you get tackled you get up and you play the ball. That's why league is such a faster game, I've read somewhere that in league the ball is in play for about 60 minutes/game whereas in union it's half that. League was invented as a professional sport, union as a product holds on to its amateur roots. By design league has been created and modified to be popular and entertaining, unlike union which steadfastly holds on to its archaic rules. League is a much more physical game than union, I've heard it described as a boxing match with a ball, I think that's right.

I don't think the netball/basketball comparison is incorrect. Netball was invented as women's basketball.
IMO there is also a difference in the flow of the game between Canadian and American football. Generally speaking due to having three downs instead of 4 to make 10 yards, the Canadian game tends to be more focused on passing. In order to run the ball on the ground a lot in Canada, you have to have pretty stellar running back, lest you only gain a couple of yards per run, get stuck with having to make a lot of yards in one down (the 2nd) and then have to kick it away on the third. So many (most?) football offences in Canadian football operate with a majority of passing plays interspersed with occasional running plays to keep the defence honest. In American football a reasonably good running back will get around 3 yards per run. Over three downs your chances of getting the 10 yards are pretty good in that case. Of course they do pass a lot as well but the plays are much more evenly distributed between run and pass in the US.


The Canadian field is also considerably wider than the American field (50 yards in the US vs. 65 in Canada) which gives players more room to manoeuvre. The Canadian field is also 110 yards long as opposed to 100 in the US, and the end zones (like try zones in rugby) are twice as deep in Canada. The goalposts in Canada are also on the goal line as opposed to the back line. I am pretty sure that a lot of these Canadian football quirks are linked to gridiron's rugby origins. (American football is almost certainly descended from Canadian football, and not the other way around, as is often believed.)


Another difference is that before a ball is put in play with a snap, in Canadian football all the receivers and backs can move around as much as they want. This makes things unpredictable for the defenders on the other side that have to cover them. In the US these players are only allowed to move one at a time, and one guy has to return to his stance before another guy can move.


On punts, in Canada you have to give the other team's receiver a five-yard safe zone to catch the ball, otherwise your team is penalized. In the US they have what is called the fair catch which allows the receiver to stick his hand up before catching, and the play stops dead as soon as he catches the ball. This rule IMO leads to a lot more spectacular punt returns in Canadian football.


Generally speaking, Canadian football games are higher scoring than American football games.
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Old 08-23-2019, 04:08 PM
 
Location: Australia
3,602 posts, read 2,275,568 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shirleyeve View Post
Interesting.

What things in BA are similar to Melbourne? Why do posters have a negative opinion of Australia?
Some of the buildings and street scapes that were built in the late eighteen hundreds. Some of the arcades in the cities. Melbourne was able to build these buildings partly because of the wealth of the gold rush. Apparently both Argentina and Australia prospered from the introduction of transport that would enable livestock to be transported to Europe. Also from the development of fencing on rural properties. But Argentina has suffered from terrible governance.

Why do posters have a negative opinion of Australia? Good question. I think they tend to be people from European backgrounds who are comparing first world countries with first world. All of which have their pluses and minuses. We know people who bounce between living in the U.K., Canada and Australia and are happy nowhere. The UK is too cold for them, Australia is too insular and the traffic too bad, Canada apparently is technologically behind! They will never be happy. Your happiness is not really linked to whether a country still use cheaques and faxes!

Obviously there are many problems in all countries. Most of us do not have much choice in where we can live so make the best of it.
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Old 08-24-2019, 01:36 AM
 
5,941 posts, read 5,831,197 times
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Why do posters have a negative opinion of Australia? Do they? Don't find too many on this forum to be honest. Perhaps the over emphasis on sport as expressed to an extent on this thread could give a clue to some general overall dissatisfaction especially with migrants. Almost like the real issues, to which there are plenty, are pushed under the carpet and little of much meaning or relevance is ever discussed. In fact, some may see it as a grand avoidance of difficult subjects, which does make it hard to hold those to account. Any negativity is seen in poor light meaning often very hard to achieve value or excellence.
For A European, probably from a more demanding culture it can mean an acceptance of how things are done with a gnawing of teeth and accepting resistance is largely futile or indeed the removal of oneself to a more enlightened society where voices of dissent are not so ignored or distrusted or creating ripples.
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Old 08-24-2019, 02:18 AM
 
Location: Australia
3,602 posts, read 2,275,568 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Why do posters have a negative opinion of Australia? Do they? Don't find too many on this forum to be honest. Perhaps the over emphasis on sport as expressed to an extent on this thread could give a clue to some general overall dissatisfaction especially with migrants. Almost like the real issues, to which there are plenty, are pushed under the carpet and little of much meaning or relevance is ever discussed. In fact, some may see it as a grand avoidance of difficult subjects, which does make it hard to hold those to account. Any negativity is seen in poor light meaning often very hard to achieve value or excellence.
For A European, probably from a more demanding culture it can mean an acceptance of how things are done with a gnawing of teeth and accepting resistance is largely futile or indeed the removal of oneself to a more enlightened society where voices of dissent are not so ignored or distrusted or creating ripples.
There is a time and a place for dissent and complaints. An acquaintance today, originally German but forty years here, managed to complain about a number of issues over an hours coffee. A person walked on the wrong side of the footpath and she needed to tell off said person, Asians always walk on the wrong side (I rather strongly disagreed with that one) restaurants refuse to split bills (agree that is annoying but it is the way it is here) her coffee was not hot enough nor strong enough, Australians do not complain enough (well she is making up for us). Far out!
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Old 08-24-2019, 03:27 AM
 
5,941 posts, read 5,831,197 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarisaMay View Post
There is a time and a place for dissent and complaints. An acquaintance today, originally German but forty years here, managed to complain about a number of issues over an hours coffee. A person walked on the wrong side of the footpath and she needed to tell off said person, Asians always walk on the wrong side (I rather strongly disagreed with that one) restaurants refuse to split bills (agree that is annoying but it is the way it is here) her coffee was not hot enough nor strong enough, Australians do not complain enough (well she is making up for us). Far out!
Possibly the trauma of forty years in Lotus Land, showing its impact on this particular individual, inducing a whine about the irrelevant as over time has learnt the folly of raising issues of importance in the presence of a home grown audience, I don't know.
Just where is the place and what is the time to raise issues impacting on national well being? Most don't want to hear it and prefer gossip or small talk at best.
I return the coffee if not hot enough as well. At the price charged here I expect a degree of quality. As I do for any workmanship I pay for or professional services received. Afraid near enough is not good enough, especially when charging through the nose.
Australia is not the perfect match for many a European. But then even the English get called 'Whinging Pommies' something which English would not be thought as in Europe.
No Australians (certainly government, employers )prefer a passive, all complying population that will accept and not challenge and if fall by the wayside in the process will accept it as own frailty not the system in place .
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Old 08-24-2019, 04:25 AM
 
Location: Australia
3,602 posts, read 2,275,568 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Possibly the trauma of forty years in Lotus Land, showing its impact on this particular individual, inducing a whine about the irrelevant as over time has learnt the folly of raising issues of importance in the presence of a home grown audience, I don't know.
Just where is the place and what is the time to raise issues impacting on national well being? Most don't want to hear it and prefer gossip or small talk at best.
I return the coffee if not hot enough as well. At the price charged here I expect a degree of quality. As I do for any workmanship I pay for or professional services received. Afraid near enough is not good enough, especially when charging through the nose.
Australia is not the perfect match for many a European. But then even the English get called 'Whinging Pommies' something which English would not be thought as in Europe.
No Australians (certainly government, employers )prefer a passive, all complying population that will accept and not challenge and if fall by the wayside in the process will accept it as own frailty not the system in place .
But the coffee shop lady politely apologised for the coffee and started to make a new one. Then the lady in question complained that she did not want this new one. She complains if the public library where we meet is two minutes late in unlocking one of the exit doors. Naturally she is livid when there is trackwork on the train lines and buses replace the trains. Then there was the need for the water to be turned off at her apartment for four hours for maintenance. But my really close friend, also German born, who is far more charming and much better company, does get tedious when, without fail, she asks for the table allocated in a restaurant to be changed.

As far as I am concerned the time and place for a political or similar discussion is within a group which is formed for that purpose or where such a discussion is relevant. Or among people whom you know fairly well and have some idea of their general political orientation. For example, I lectured my husband to keep the conversation light when he joined my walking group for the first time. Being of European descent he seems to enjoy arguing but I sure do not enjoy listening to it.
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Old 08-24-2019, 08:10 PM
 
5,941 posts, read 5,831,197 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarisaMay View Post
But the coffee shop lady politely apologised for the coffee and started to make a new one. Then the lady in question complained that she did not want this new one. She complains if the public library where we meet is two minutes late in unlocking one of the exit doors. Naturally she is livid when there is trackwork on the train lines and buses replace the trains. Then there was the need for the water to be turned off at her apartment for four hours for maintenance. But my really close friend, also German born, who is far more charming and much better company, does get tedious when, without fail, she asks for the table allocated in a restaurant to be changed.

As far as I am concerned the time and place for a political or similar discussion is within a group which is formed for that purpose or where such a discussion is relevant. Or among people whom you know fairly well and have some idea of their general political orientation. For example, I lectured my husband to keep the conversation light when he joined my walking group for the first time. Being of European descent he seems to enjoy arguing but I sure do not enjoy listening to it.

You stress nationality as if that was the prime factor and not the individual personality of the person involved. Even Germans, taking into account national stereotypes, possess a collection of personality types some more endurable than others.
As agreed previously, many Europeans are more 'open' to speak their minds, than found in places like Australia. (although the offside to that is anger is more common here perhaps because of the inability to express dissent before it gets to that point?) You could try living in The Netherlands for awhile, to get straight talking no holding back rhetoric, that may sound far too direct to more sensitive Anglo ears.
It's probably a matter of culture and language plays a part as well. English not having a polite form can easily be taken as a personal affront or more unclear if abuse is intentional or not.
Complaining is a national pastime to an extent in a host of other cultures. French for example seldom cease, but etiquette is important and rules should be observed unless want to be thought of as a total ignorant Bogan.
When complaining, arguing or debating without due care it can appear crass or over the top or indeed the opposite being too submissive and timid, depending on cultural norms and delivery in the language being spoken.
In a country like Australia, a little less free in self expression some would suggest, it can certainly sound different to intent or it could be out of pure frustration. Or it obviously could be the individual.
The ability to be able to express would probably be an adequate measure of the liveability of the country one finds oneself in. Not one size fits all.
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Old 08-24-2019, 11:36 PM
 
Location: Australia
3,602 posts, read 2,275,568 times
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Yes a lot of it is due to the modality of the language and English ranks on the lower end of that spectrum.
I have actually been on a cruise with 1100 Dutch, a nationality about which I had no preconceptions at all. It was an interesting experience and they certainly had a different concept of polite behaviour than that of many of the Americans aboard.
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Old 08-24-2019, 11:43 PM
 
Location: Earth
411 posts, read 413,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
I find league too predictable and not as exciting as union -all those rucks, mauls and kicking coming with more uncertainty, which is good.
Rugby Union is a beautiful game to watch. The constant squeal of the league whistle does my head in, not to mention that flapping around on the floor like a landed trout that league players do.
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Old 08-25-2019, 01:10 AM
 
4,171 posts, read 4,827,535 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
I find league too predictable and not as exciting as union -all those rucks, mauls and kicking coming with more uncertainty, which is good.
I would agree that league is more predictable because possession isn't contested which is what makes union so much more technical – scrums, lineouts, rucks, mauls are the foundations of union and don't exist in league. It's why saying they're almost the same sport is pretty far of the mark, imo. Even a casual observer would notice the big difference. League is faster though because the ball isn't held up forever everytime someone goes to ground.
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