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Old 07-29-2010, 06:08 PM
 
Location: Northridge/Porter Ranch, Calif.
23,695 posts, read 30,272,768 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robhu View Post
IN 1959 Chrysler Corp phased out the flat head 6 cyl. that had been used for decades. The slant 6 came out in 1960 as a 170, and 198. Later the 170 was dropped and the 225 added. Some low end full size Plymouth and Dodges had the 225 in them up through the 70's. I forget what year was the last for them. They were good engines. I owned several cars with slant sixes. Never had a problem with them and the 225 was quite peppy.
I know Chevy and Ford had inline OHV sixes in full size cars in the late sixties and early 70's but I don't remember when they were phased out for V-6's.
Actually, the slant six was available originally in 170 and 225 forms.

The 198 version did not appear until 1970. It lasted until 1975.
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Old 07-29-2010, 08:04 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
15,832 posts, read 50,946,457 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlrl View Post
guys here would feel "weird" driving a top line standard(Caprice, LTD, Gran Sedan) from the big 3 with a 3 speed column shift,and to top it off with nice upholstery and other nice trim, vinyl roof

i gotta get this out of my system, it's like nails on a chalkboard. woujd passengers comment like "hey why a 3 speed tranny when the car is so big?!"
IIRC the upscale trim frequently included a V-8 and maybe an automatic standard.

That said, back in the 60's and 70's, if you wanted something different and were willing to order it, the factory would build it "your way". A Caprice with a 3-on-the-tree and 250 6 would be unusual, but since it's the same frame as a Biscayne, if you wanted it that way they would build it that way. I wouldn't be surprised if the dealer wanted a fairly serious up-front deposit, since he knew it would be a tough sell to anyone else, though.

Frequently the "come on" price in ads was for a car with a 6, 3-speed, mats no carpet, no power steering, A/C, etc.
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Old 07-29-2010, 09:39 PM
 
Location: Northeast Tennessee
7,305 posts, read 25,860,285 times
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According to the brochure, the top level Fury (which was called Sport Fury in 1971) in 1971 had a standard 318 V8. Manual was standard, but like you said, very rare. The "lower level" models had a standard 6-cylinder... V8s were optional.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rlrl View Post
thanks for the info. i swear that 71 Gran Sedan with the 3 speed I saw 30 years ago must have been virtually the only one with a manual tranny

to this day i wonder if it had a 6 or an 8 and if it was factory ordered or installed by someone other than the factory

probably went to the crusher
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Old 07-29-2010, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Northeast Tennessee
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Yep, being a Chevy, even the top of the line model was a nice affordable car, but not too snobby looking. lol. A loaded Chevy Caprice ran about the same price as a plainer Buick LeSabre of the same year, depite Caprices having a richer looking interior than the base Lesabre (of the early 70s).


Quote:
Originally Posted by rlrl View Post
looks fine! ya know no matter how top of the line the Caprices were, they managed to avoid having the snob appeal that Buick and Olds had, and were nice solid middle of the road (remember their ad baseball, hot dogs, apple pie and Chevrolet)
I had a 1969 Chevy Caprice 4dr - it was a very high optioned car... power windows, power door locks, front disc brakes, power brakes, power steering, A/C, tilt wheel, FM radio, 396 engine, turbo automatic, vinyl top, hideaway headlights with washers, deluxe brocade cloth interior, additional courtesy lights option, etc. (Despite being a well optioned car, it still lacked options however such as the light monitor system, power seat, cruise control, speed alert, cassette player, 427 engine and fender skirts). It was green on green on green. I miss that car, but I did sell it to purchase my 72 Caprice Estate wagon. Its a moderately optioned car - 402 engine, 3rd seat, AM radio, luggage rack, tilt wheel, A/C, deluxe wheel covers. I have someone sending me a factory FM radio for it though. He was going to send me the stuff to add power windows and power locks from a wagon he is junking out, but I thought it would be too much trouble for that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouser View Post
My first car was a 1969 Bel-Air 4dr

It had the 250ci in-line six with a 2spd power glide
no power steering or brakes (4 wheel drum) no A/C
plastic seats and a 25gal fuel tank.

It was dependable and cheap to maintain
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Old 11-14-2010, 09:41 PM
 
74 posts, read 568,038 times
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Default 71 Ford LTD with manual shift

I can verify that Ford did produce at least one '71 LTD with a 3 speed manual transmission as this car was owned by a couple in my hometown. It was a '71 LTD Brougham, beige with a dark green vinyl top and equipped with the plush high back Brougham front seats. The car had air conditioning, fm/stereo, power windows, locks, and seats, and of course, the 3 speed column shifted manual transmission.

The owner, Mrs. "G" was very old school and did not like automatic transmissions. She special ordered a new car about every 5-6 years. Up until 1971, there was never a problem getting her new Ford with a manual shift. Her previous car, a '66 Galaxie was equipped as such.

Mrs. G and her husband had quite a bit of money. In fact, her husband had previously been a long time Ford dealer and one of their sons had a dealership as well. In my area of North Carolina, this family was well known for their affiliation with Ford. Still, when the order for a loaded LTD Brougham with a 3 speed came in, Ford claimed they could not produce such a car. It took a call from either Mr. G. or his son to get Ford to change their mind. After all, the family just wanted their wife/mother to be happy with her new car. And happy she was. Mrs. G. drove this car for about 6 years until an accident messed up the sheet metal in the front. My father, who was a good friend of the family, was aware of this car from the beginning, and is the one who told me about the car initially, he had heard the story about all the trouble the family went through to get it.

After the accident Mrs. G had with the car, my father tried to buy it. The frame was not damaged, and with new front end sheet metal (hood, fenders, grille, bumper) a radiator, paint and detailing, the car would be back in first class shape. The car had very low miles, somewhere in the 20's. If I remember correctly, the family retained the car and it probably went back to the Winston Salem area.

A new, loaded '77 LTD II replaced the '71 and by this time, there would be no negotiating for a manual shift car. Mrs. G adapted to the automatic transmission and drove the LTD II for about 5-6 years, replacing it with her last car, an '82 or '83 Mercury Grand Marquis.

My hometown was full of some unusual cars. A friend of mine had a 71 Chevrolet Biscayne 6 with a three speed that was originally specially ordered by the town as a public works vehicle. It didn't even have a radio. Dad had for many years a 55 Studebaker President with factory installed air conditioning that was located in the trunk. It was a NOVI system built for Studebaker. I think it was one of only a hundred plus '55's produced with this option.

Best regards

Mr. Bill
Hamlet, NC

Last edited by Avantiguy; 11-14-2010 at 09:57 PM..
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Old 11-14-2010, 10:47 PM
 
Location: Northeast Tennessee
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Thanks forthis very interesting post!

Wow, what an interesting car... a 71 LTD Brougham with the 3-speed manual... strange indeed! As strange as the 71 Chevy Caprice (the LTD Brougham competitor) that I also mentioned that I seen with the 3-speed manual shift. It too had all options except tilt wheel, which apparently was not available with the manual column shift transmission. It was such a strange looking car, but it was ordered that way. It was an early 71 model (made in late 70), which apparently a 3-speed manual was still standard on lower level GM cars until around January of 71, then automatic was standard on the V8 cars.

You mentioned that one car w/o radio.... I also have seen a 1972 Buick Estate Wagon - it didnt have a radio either... had a blank plate. Also did NOT have A/C, no power windows, no tilt wheel, nothing. It had absolutely NO options. Strange to see such a plain jane Buick wagon.

Thanks for sharing this... had wondered if there had ever been a early 70s LTD Brougham with a manual shift... seems as though... this "Mrs G" sounded like an interesting lady so set on a manual shift car - even on a luxurious trim line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avantiguy View Post
I can verify that Ford did produce at least one '71 LTD with a 3 speed manual transmission as this car was owned by a couple in my hometown. It was a '71 LTD Brougham, beige with a dark green vinyl top and equipped with the plush high back Brougham front seats. The car had air conditioning, fm/stereo, power windows, locks, and seats, and of course, the 3 speed column shifted manual transmission.
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Old 11-15-2010, 10:51 AM
 
Location: A safe distance from San Francisco
11,291 posts, read 7,930,463 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tennesseestorm View Post
Thanks forthis very interesting post!

Wow, what an interesting car... a 71 LTD Brougham with the 3-speed manual... strange indeed! As strange as the 71 Chevy Caprice (the LTD Brougham competitor) that I also mentioned that I seen with the 3-speed manual shift. It too had all options except tilt wheel, which apparently was not available with the manual column shift transmission. It was such a strange looking car, but it was ordered that way. It was an early 71 model (made in late 70), which apparently a 3-speed manual was still standard on lower level GM cars until around January of 71, then automatic was standard on the V8 cars.

You mentioned that one car w/o radio.... I also have seen a 1972 Buick Estate Wagon - it didnt have a radio either... had a blank plate. Also did NOT have A/C, no power windows, no tilt wheel, nothing. It had absolutely NO options. Strange to see such a plain jane Buick wagon.

Thanks for sharing this... had wondered if there had ever been a early 70s LTD Brougham with a manual shift... seems as though... this "Mrs G" sounded like an interesting lady so set on a manual shift car - even on a luxurious trim line.
Very interesting and nostalgic posts indeed! Thanks for that '70 LTD picture - ahhhh what memories that brings. Where do you get all those outstanding pics?

I turned 21 in 1970 and, from my memory, there were a lot more stick shifts in the big Chevys of that era than in Fords. In fact, the only stick shift '71 LTD I've ever heard of is the one Mr.Bill just told us about. Ford had really been working hard since '65 to convey a brand image of quality and luxury and by '68 virtually all big Fords were V-8 automatics. I believe '72 was the first year where a V-8 (351) was standard, but 6s were extremely rare for several years before that.
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Old 11-15-2010, 05:08 PM
 
19,023 posts, read 24,241,433 times
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I made a mistake on page 1 and no one jumped me for it. I said the 225 was the smallest engine and the 170 was. You guys ain't slippin any are ya? reading I was corrected, and i stand corrected, but wonder for how long since at my age I have CRS.

The bright side is when I forget you guys can jump on me then.
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Old 11-15-2010, 06:10 PM
 
Location: The Circle City. Sometimes NE of Bagdad.
21,374 posts, read 22,463,651 times
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Whatta guy.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:00 PM
 
74 posts, read 568,038 times
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Mrs. G was a very kind lady and quite a "happening" one too. I remember she used to trade at the drug store where my mother worked and she liked to come in late during the evening and stay until it was just about time for the store to close. This was back when the local, small town drugstores did a good business. I used to like to see Mrs. G drive away in this Ford. I can still see this now, in on the clutch, shift to reverse, slight revs of the engine to back the car up, in to low gear, hearing the engine rev and seeing that big luxurious Ford move in the different way that a car with a manual transmission moves out. She was a smooth gear changer too. You know, all Ford had to do was use a 3 speed column they would happily use in a Custom, or perhaps a Galaxie and send the car down the line. They sure didn't want too though.

Regarding the tilt wheel option on cars in years past, I was told that power steering was a required option because the "flexibility" of the tilt mechanism would not stand up to the extra pressure exerted on the column to turn the wheels of a non power steering assisted car. This makes sense to me. For some manufacturers, I don' think it mattered what kind of transmission a car had in order to get a tilt wheel, you just had to have power steering. I can back this up by saying that I have seen quite a few full size 4 speed GM cars with a tilt wheel. In fact, there is a commercial on You Tube for the tilt wheel option on 1965 Chevrolets. It is an original commercial from Bewitched showing Gladys and Abner Cravitz on the sidewalk watching someone getting into a new Impala and tilting the steering wheel. Abner did the voice over and said the tilt wheel was available on Chevrolets and Chevelles with power steering and powerglide OR 4 speed transmission.

Regarding Mrs. G's LTD Brougham, it did not have cruise control, that I am sure of. I do not know if it had a tilt wheel, but I am betting that it did not. I can just figure there was something different about a manual column that would make an adjustable column impossible, or at least impractical to tool up for. Very few Fords came with a tilt wheel during these years. I can probably count the ones I've seen on both of my hands. But, you also have to remember on Ford cars at this time and for several years afterwards, you had to push the turn signal lever towards the front of the car to release the mechanism to adjust the wheel. There was not a separate tilt wheel adjustment lever to look for as a dead giveaway. A lot of people who had these cars so equipped may not have ever known they had a tilt wheel because of the way the column operated. I could look at the mechanism where the lever went in to the column and tell if was a fixed or adjustable column. In fact, a co-worker purchased a 77 Thunderbird used and didn't know she had a tilt wheel until I showed her.

Oh, on ebay a few weeks ago was a 14,000 mile original 1973 Chevrolet Bel Air with the straight six and three speed manual transmission. Its been on there twice lately, didn't sell because of the starting bid. Watch for it, will probably be back on there again. Solid black, blackwalls, hubcaps, I think it had a radio. Interesting car, and this was the last time, until 1977, that Chevrolet offered a full size car in the states with a six cylinder engine. If I'm not mistaken, the six cylinder was available as an option only on Bel Airs and there was only one transmission choice, the 3 speed manual.

I'm going to ask about something that interests me and I haven't seen this before here. "What is the most unusual car you have seen with factory air conditioning or without factory air conditioning?"

Best regards

Mr. Bill
Hamlet, NC

Last edited by Avantiguy; 11-15-2010 at 07:34 PM..
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