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Old 05-03-2013, 11:16 AM
 
14,780 posts, read 43,740,878 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robrobrob View Post
I wasn't comparing sticker prices but likely selling prices. It is ironic that the GM product, the ATS, which has been known for selling for quite a bit below sticker, actually sells for closer to sticker than the IS. So, when price is considered an IS 250 competes with the base ATS. This is likely a reflection of the fact that the ATS is a new model and the IS has been around since 2006.

I also think that Lexus raised the price a few thousand from 2012 to 2013. Not sure of the details though.
I'm not sure what they changed from 2012 to 2013, but you could get a base IS250 in 2012 for $33,790.

The current "price paid" is a little off (though the valid comparison for someone buying today) as the current IS is a much older model. The IS is selling for around 9.5% off sticker while the ATS and all 3-series are selling around 4.5% off sticker. The only exception is the 320i that is going for around 2.6% off.

The other thing to consider here too is that there is no "middle" option on the IS. You either get the 250 or take the plunge up to $40k+ for the 350. Everyone else offers a step inbetween and that makes the lineups harder to compare. The 250 competes well against the base 3-series and ATS. It competes poorly against the middle of the pack models and then becomes more competitive again in top trim. Given that a huge amount of the sales on the other models are in the middle of the lineups, it's an odd omission by Lexus.
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Old 05-03-2013, 06:24 PM
 
Location: SoCal
1,528 posts, read 4,237,740 times
Reputation: 1243
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
I'm going to guess you have driven a 2014 IS350? I've driven the current 3-series, ATS and IS in multiple trims and the current car is frankly crap compared to the others in the class. Good job Lexus if they improved it that much, but looking at other reviews and articles, it's not a "razor sharp" sport sedan in the traditional mold of a sport sedan. Whether I would recommend one comes down to what the person wants to accomplish. Me, I like my sport sedans to be sporty. If the "good things" about the Lexus are that it has comfy seats and is more composed on the highway, then that's not saying much.

If you think the ATS sucks, then you obviously have never driven one. It's one of the most connected sports sedans on the road. Let's see, among your various critiques and those of C&D we have opinion on the interior and exterior being "ugly". Frankly, I find it appealing and my only complaint on the interior, is that some of the control layouts could be better. There is nothing wrong at all with the engine and it outgunned the Lexus in several "real world" scenarios and was a tick slower in the quarter mile. The issue is more with the 6-speed transmission versus the 8-speeds in the other cars. Give the ATS an 8-speed (which it will be getting) and it would outgun the Lexus owing to its better power to weight ratio. Same story on the "gas guzzling", though when looking for a sport sedan, MPG is generally not high on my list.

As for the "stiff ride", maybe that's why it has hands down the best handling and most dynamic chassis in the class. The Lexus did as good as it did in the slalom, do to better steering turn-in as they overboost initial steering turn. I personally prefer more weighted and linear steering. The ATS does that well, not so much in the BMW. Even then it beat the ATS by .6 mph, while being down a full .6g's on the lateral. I notice how you left braking performance off the list, funny they didn't mention that at all in the article, when that is a hallmark trait of sports sedans. The ATS out-braked the IS by 14 feet from 70mph. The IS brakes worse than a Camry. Sure we could blame that all on the tire selection, but what does it say when you don't even get a decent set of all-season performance tires on the top gun IS 350 F-sport?

There were only two sports sedans in the comparo, the ATS and the 3-series. The IS is a luxury car with a sport suspension. Let's see what happens when you take off the F-sport package or opt for the IS 250 against the midrange BMW or ATS...it's not going to be pretty for Lexus.

ETA...

Not every car in that class is the same because buyers look for different things. The best way to describe the comparisons are like this...

Sports sedan with "luxury features" - ATS, G-class and 3-series.

Somewhere in the middle...A4

Luxury sedan with "sports suspension" - IS and C-class.

It all comes down to what one prefers and what they are trying to accomplish. When I hear "sports sedan" I don't think of the IS and C-class, because I am looking more for "sport" then I am "highway composure" and heavily padded seats.
Hahaa love the way you bend and twist facts and figures.

But anyway, the ATS is surely the most 'hardcore' of the three. But that doesn't mean that its the best. The IS350 offers exceptional handling but its also comfortable at the same time. Refined, sporty etc. balanced car.
In fact some of the IS250/IS350 accolades are the sharp dynamics, especially in F-sports guise.

And you think 8-speed really matters? The previous IS350 had 6-speed and it was fast, in fact fastest in segment 0-60mph

And mate, apples to apples, compare IS250 to the base ATS, same displacement and everything and the IS250 is SUPERIOR. Extremly Smooth, refined engine and has good overtaking power the IS250.

The 3.6L motor of the GM is no where as good as the 3.5L 2GR-FSE of the IS350. Not only is the GM 3.6L loud, but the sounds it makes are not pleasant. Where as the 2GR motor sounds awesome. And it's much, much smoother and refined. Such an unruffled and smooth powertrain.

Watch both of these, previous 335i vs previous IS350


YouTube


YouTube
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Old 05-03-2013, 09:59 PM
 
11 posts, read 18,034 times
Reputation: 19
The Acura TSX is just a Honda Accord in Europe with badges. Its not built to the level of a Lexus, BMW, Audi, Benz. It's a shortcut and for cheap Honda fans who think they have a luxury car. Its competent but great at nothing with harsh plastic, a buzzy engine, an ancient 5 speed manual and no real luxury features, not even cooled seats or parking assist or push button start. If you want an Acura, buy the new Accord.

The IS is a completely better car, the 2014 just won a compao beating the ATS and 3 series. Its a true RWD luxury sports sedan with more tech than any Acura.

F30 335i M Sport rips 0-60mph in 4.6 secs in Jun '13 Car & Driver, finishes 2nd - BMW 3-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST

The previous IS as stated is in a different class and just an overall better car. If you want to fool yourself, buy the ugly Acura.
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